This has to be a very weak computer NOT the program.........

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pichy
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Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 3:04 am

This has to be a very weak computer NOT the program.........

Post by pichy »

Computer at blitz should be almost unbeatable, but GM Nakamura got lucky or this has to be a very old and weak P.C. with Rybka :roll:

http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1497429
pichy
Posts: 2564
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 3:04 am

Re: This is how a GM block a position vs a great Program....

Post by pichy »

pichy wrote:Computer at blitz should be almost unbeatable, but GM Nakamura got lucky or this has to be a very old and weak P.C. with Rybka :roll:

PS: Unless Rybka was able to sacrifice a pawn in order to break through the position a great program like Rybka is still too materialistic vs a GM and at the end it runs out of time and suffer positionally and give up material. Notice how GM Nakamura was down trading pieces with the program knowing that Rybka was blocked with the pawns and at the end it will not sacrifice a pawn or two to break the position :lol:
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1497429
pichy
Posts: 2564
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 3:04 am

Re: This is how a GM block a position vs a great Program....

Post by pichy »

pichy wrote:
pichy wrote:Computer at blitz should be almost unbeatable, this is the reason why I do NOT consider the high rating of the top 5 programs to be taken too seriously when matched versus a top GM that knows how to block a position:roll:

PS: Unless programs are programmed to sacrifice a pawn or two in order to break through the position a great program like Rybka is still too materialistic vs a GM and at the end it runs out of time and suffer positionally and give up material. Notice how GM Nakamura was down-trading pieces with the program knowing that Rybka was blocked with the pawns and at the end it will not sacrifice a pawn or two to break the position :lol:
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1497429
Here are two more matches versus Rybka:
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chess.pl ... pid2=10084
Terry McCracken
Posts: 16465
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2007 4:16 am
Location: Canada

Re: This is how a GM block a position vs a great Program....

Post by Terry McCracken »

pichy wrote:
pichy wrote:
pichy wrote:Computer at blitz should be almost unbeatable, this is the reason why I do NOT consider the high rating of the top 5 programs to be taken too seriously when matched versus a top GM that knows how to block a position:roll:

PS: Unless programs are programmed to sacrifice a pawn or two in order to break through the position a great program like Rybka is still too materialistic vs a GM and at the end it runs out of time and suffer positionally and give up material. Notice how GM Nakamura was down-trading pieces with the program knowing that Rybka was blocked with the pawns and at the end it will not sacrifice a pawn or two to break the position :lol:
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1497429
Here are two more matches versus Rybka:
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chess.pl ... pid2=10084
I have quickly looked over the first game you presented, it has nothing to do with weak hardware or software but everything to do with how to beat these programs.

He knows how.
Terry McCracken
pichy
Posts: 2564
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 3:04 am

Re: This is how a GM block a position vs a great Program....

Post by pichy »

Terry McCracken wrote:
pichy wrote:
pichy wrote:
pichy wrote:Computer at blitz should be almost unbeatable, this is the reason why I do NOT consider the high rating of the top 5 programs to be taken too seriously when matched versus a top GM that knows how to block a position:roll:

PS: Unless programs are programmed to sacrifice a pawn or two in order to break through the position a great program like Rybka is still too materialistic vs a GM and at the end it runs out of time and suffer positionally and give up material. Notice how GM Nakamura was down-trading pieces with the program knowing that Rybka was blocked with the pawns and at the end it will not sacrifice a pawn or two to break the position :lol:
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1497429
Here are two more matches versus Rybka:
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chess.pl ... pid2=10084
I have quickly looked over the first game you presented, it has nothing to do with weak hardware or software but everything to do with how to beat these programs.

He knows how.
You are correct the hardware don't have nothing to do with it, for the first game that I presented GM Nakamura was able to block the position, and Rybka is not programmed to sacrifice a pawn or two in order to break through. Now if you look at this game, it is simply amazing at how GM Nakamura slowly and gradually demolish Rybka.
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1497426
Terry McCracken
Posts: 16465
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2007 4:16 am
Location: Canada

Re: This is how a GM block a position vs a great Program....

Post by Terry McCracken »

pichy wrote:
Terry McCracken wrote:
pichy wrote:
pichy wrote:
pichy wrote:Computer at blitz should be almost unbeatable, this is the reason why I do NOT consider the high rating of the top 5 programs to be taken too seriously when matched versus a top GM that knows how to block a position:roll:

PS: Unless programs are programmed to sacrifice a pawn or two in order to break through the position a great program like Rybka is still too materialistic vs a GM and at the end it runs out of time and suffer positionally and give up material. Notice how GM Nakamura was down-trading pieces with the program knowing that Rybka was blocked with the pawns and at the end it will not sacrifice a pawn or two to break the position :lol:
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1497429
Here are two more matches versus Rybka:
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chess.pl ... pid2=10084
I have quickly looked over the first game you presented, it has nothing to do with weak hardware or software but everything to do with how to beat these programs.

He knows how.
You are correct the hardware don't have nothing to do with it, for the first game that I presented GM Nakamura was able to block the position, and Rybka is not programmed to sacrifice a pawn or two in order to break through. Now if you look at this game, it is simply amazing at how GM Nakamura slowly and gradually demolish Rybka.
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1497426
It's very simple, he's good and knows where Rybka is weak.

Thanks for posting these games. I liked this game far better and he took down Rybka without conventional anti-computer techniques.
Terry McCracken
BubbaTough
Posts: 1154
Joined: Fri Jun 23, 2006 5:18 am

Re: This is how a GM block a position vs a great Program....

Post by BubbaTough »

If computers were allowed unfettered access to human tournaments, GM Nakamura would quite possibly be the highest rated human in the world :).

-Sam
pichy
Posts: 2564
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 3:04 am

Re: This is how a GM block a position vs a great Program....

Post by pichy »

Terry McCracken wrote:
pichy wrote:
pichy wrote:
pichy wrote:Computer at blitz should be almost unbeatable, this is the reason why I do NOT consider the high rating of the top 5 programs to be taken too seriously when matched versus a top GM that knows how to block a position:roll:

PS: Unless programs are programmed to sacrifice a pawn or two in order to break through the position a great program like Rybka is still too materialistic vs a GM and at the end it runs out of time and suffer positionally and give up material. Notice how GM Nakamura was down-trading pieces with the program knowing that Rybka was blocked with the pawns and at the end it will not sacrifice a pawn or two to break the position :lol:
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1497429
Here are two more matches versus Rybka:
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chess.pl ... pid2=10084
I have quickly looked over the first game you presented, it has nothing to do with weak hardware or software but everything to do with how to beat these programs.

He knows how.
I have something to add, in the beginning back in the 80's when programs did not have opening or ending databases they were very weak programs, later besides adding databases, more knowledge was added and chess programs became stronger and stronger. A program that does not have the knowledge of sacrificing a pawn or two specially when it is ahead in order to break through a fortress of pawns barrier it is still a weak program when matched against a strong human that knows how to block a position. Therefore, Rybka is still a weak chess program. :shock:

PS: I should NOT say that Rybka is a weak chess program, it is the strongest program available, but most strong human GMs have more chess knowledge than rybka, and blocking and being able to unblock a position any strong human GM or even a master is capable of doing it when they are ahead in material.
pichy
Posts: 2564
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 3:04 am

Re: This is how a GM block a position vs a great Program....

Post by pichy »

BubbaTough wrote:If computers were allowed unfettered access to human tournaments, GM Nakamura would quite possibly be the highest rated human in the world :).

-Sam
It is hard to tell, somebody will have to find out which GM has the better percentage versus the top 5 programs ICC.
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Laskos
Posts: 10948
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2006 10:21 pm
Full name: Kai Laskos

Re: This is how a GM block a position vs a great Program....

Post by Laskos »

pichy wrote:
Terry McCracken wrote:
pichy wrote:
pichy wrote:
pichy wrote:Computer at blitz should be almost unbeatable, this is the reason why I do NOT consider the high rating of the top 5 programs to be taken too seriously when matched versus a top GM that knows how to block a position:roll:

PS: Unless programs are programmed to sacrifice a pawn or two in order to break through the position a great program like Rybka is still too materialistic vs a GM and at the end it runs out of time and suffer positionally and give up material. Notice how GM Nakamura was down-trading pieces with the program knowing that Rybka was blocked with the pawns and at the end it will not sacrifice a pawn or two to break the position :lol:
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1497429
Here are two more matches versus Rybka:
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chess.pl ... pid2=10084
I have quickly looked over the first game you presented, it has nothing to do with weak hardware or software but everything to do with how to beat these programs.

He knows how.
I have something to add, in the beginning back in the 80's when programs did not have opening or ending databases they were very weak programs, later besides adding databases, more knowledge was added and chess programs became stronger and stronger. A program that does not have the knowledge of sacrificing a pawn or two specially when it is ahead in order to break through a fortress of pawns barrier it is still a weak program when matched against a strong human that knows how to block a position. Therefore, Rybka is still a weak chess program. :shock:

PS: I should NOT say that Rybka is a weak chess program, it is the strongest program available, but most strong human GMs have more chess knowledge than rybka, and blocking and being able to unblock a position any strong human GM or even a master is capable of doing it when they are ahead in material.
No problem, put the contempt at 3.00 and Rybka will be going to crush you.

Kai