Is Movei438 as strong as Shredder 6.02 ?

[pichy]

I believe that it is, we will find out very soon:

Athlon, Blitz:3'+1" 0

12345678
1 Shredder 6.02 2720 101101004.0/8 16.00
2 Movei00_8_438 2700 010010114.0/8 16.00

[Uri Blass]

I believe that there are good chances that the answer is yes.

I also tested movei at long time control against fruit2.0 40 minutes/30 moves and it is clear that movei won the match.

In the first 34 games results was close to equal(I believe that movei was leading 18-16 but I am not sure and I will check later)

results of the last 58 games is
+24 =22 -12 for movei and it means that if I remember correctly
result is now 53-39 for movei(and probably is going to be 53.5-39.5 in case movei fail to win the KRN vs KR endgame that it now plays)


I also believe that I have better piece square table for the pawns that I still did not test enough(the results that I report about are with the default setting except less_reduce 1)

pawn_square_table 1020 1030 1030 1030 1030 1030 1030 1020 130 130 130 130 130 130 130 130 110 110 110 110 110 110 110 110 105 105 105 110 110 105 105 105 97 99 102 107 107 102 99 97 97 98 99 92 92 99 98 97 98 97 97 90 90 97 97 98 0 0 0 0 0 0 0

knight_square_table 210 300 340 340 340 340 300 210 300 340 350 350 350 350 340 300 330 350 355 355 355 355 350 330 330 350 355 360 360 355 350 330 330 350 355 360 360 355 350 330 340 350 355 355 355 355 350 340 320 340 350 350 350 350 340 320 280 320 340 340 340 340 320 280


Uri

[pichy]

I believe that there are good chances that the answer is yes.

I also tested movei at long time control against fruit2.0 40 minutes/30 moves and it is clear that movei won the match.

In the first 34 games results was close to equal(I believe that movei was leading 18-16 but I am not sure and I will check later)

results of the last 58 games is
+24 =22 -12 for movei and it means that if I remember correctly
result is now 53-39 for movei(and probably is going to be 53.5-39.5 in case movei fail to win the KRN vs KR endgame that it now plays)


I also believe that I have better piece square table for the pawns that I still did not test enough(the results that I report about are with the default setting except less_reduce 1)

pawn_square_table 1020 1030 1030 1030 1030 1030 1030 1020 130 130 130 130 130 130 130 130 110 110 110 110 110 110 110 110 105 105 105 110 110 105 105 105 97 99 102 107 107 102 99 97 97 98 99 92 92 99 98 97 98 97 97 90 90 97 97 98 0 0 0 0 0 0 0

knight_square_table 210 300 340 340 340 340 300 210 300 340 350 350 350 350 340 300 330 350 355 355 355 355 350 330 330 350 355 360 360 355 350 330 330 350 355 360 360 355 350 330 340 350 355 355 355 355 350 340 320 340 350 350 350 350 340 320 280 320 340 340 340 340 320 280


Uri

I will try with your newer piece square table, but this is the result that I got versus Shredder 6.02 and versus Fritz 5.32

Movei438 is Not yet as strong as Shredder 6.02, but it fall between Fritz 5.32 2662 and shredder 6.02 on an Athlon 1200 Mhz


http://www.chessland.host.sk/html/chess ... ogramy.htm


Athlon, Blitz:3'+1" 0

12345678901234567890123456789012345678901234567890
1 Shredder 6.02 2720 101101000½11001½10½1½111010111½101½011111½1111½1½1 33.5/50
2 Movei00_8_438 2700 010010111½00110½01½0½000101000½010½100000½0000½0½0 16.5/50



-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Athlon, Blitz:3'+1" 0

12345678901234567890123456789012345678901234567890
1 Movei00_8_438 2700 0½11½½½10½11011½0½010½1111½1101½1½0½01101½½½011½½½ 30.0/50
2 Fritz 5.32 2690 1½00½½½01½00100½1½101½0000½0010½0½1½10010½½½100½½½ 20.0/50

[Uri Blass]

I am surprised by your result because shredder6.02 is only slightly better than Fritz5.32 in blitz

From the CEGT blitz rating list

173 Shredder 6.02 Paderborn 2620 29 29 401 46.1 % 2647 28.9 %
191 Fritz 5.32 2602 21 21 747 50.1 % 2601 32.3 %
235 Movei 00.8.403 2562 19 19 973 43.6 % 2607 28.3 %


Based on my results against fruit2.0 and also based on the FRC results of movei I believe that movei should be slightly better than Shredder6.02

Uri

[George Bodkin]

When is Movei438 be out.

Thanks
George

[Uri Blass]

I did not decide if to release it or maybe to release a later version.

At this point of time latest movei is private when I only sent it to some testers.

Uri

[Uri Blass]

final result of the match against fruit2.0 is 57-43 and note that movei did not use tablebases even not at the root.

This is the best result that movei got against fruit in its career so maybe the new movei unlike previous versions perform relatively better at long time control.

Fruit has clearly more knowledge than movei about simple endgames.
Fruit2.0 also searches more than twice faster than movei when I compare knodes.

You can imagine what could happen in case that movei could search as fast as fruit2.0

Uri

[pichy]

final result of the match against fruit2.0 is 57-43 and note that movei did not use tablebases even not at the root.

This is the best result that movei got against fruit in its career so maybe the new movei unlike previous versions perform relatively better at long time control.

Fruit has clearly more knowledge than movei about simple endgames.
Fruit2.0 also searches more than twice faster than movei when I compare knodes.

You can imagine what could happen in case that movei could search as fast as fruit2.0

Uri

Is this the correct movei_changes438
less_reduce 1

and movei_magic_numbers438 or you have a better one

loghash 20 loghasheval 20 logpawnhash 16 resign_value -1000 logfile 0 perfthash 256win_learning 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1lose_learning 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1pawn_square_table 1020 1030 1030 1030 1030 1030 1030 1020 130 130 130 130 130 130 130 130 115 115 115 115 115 115 115 115 100 100 100 105 105 100 100 100 90 92 95 100 100 95 92 90 90 91 92 85 85 92 91 90 91 90 90 70 70 90 90 91 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0knight_square_table 210 300 340 340 340 340 300 210 300 340 350 350 350 350 340 300 330 350 355 355 355 355 350 330 330 350 355 360 360 355 350 330 330 350 355 360 360 355 350 330 340 350 355 355 355 355 350 340 320 340 350 350 350 350 340 320 220 320 340 340 340 340 320 220 bishop_square_table 350 350 350 350 350 350 350 350 300 360 360 360 360 360 360 300 360 360 365 365 365 365 360 360 350 360 365 370 370 365 360 350 350 360 365 370 370 365 360 350 350 360 360 360 360 360 360 350 350 360 360 360 360 360 360 350 340 340 340 350 350 340 340 340 rook_square_table 540 540 540 540 540 540 540 540 540 540 540 540 540 540 540 540 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 530 540 540 540 540 530 530 queen_square_table 1020 1030 1030 1030 1030 1030 1030 1020 1010 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1010 1030 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1030 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1010 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1010 1010 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1020 1010 king_table -60 -60 -60 -60 -60 -60 -60 -60 -50 -50 -50 -50 -50 -50 -50 -50 -45 -45 -45 -45 -45 -45 -45 -45 -40 -40 -40 -40 -40 -40 -40 -40 -35 -35 -35 -35 -35 -35 -35 -35 -30 -30 -30 -30 -30 -30 -30 -30 -10 -10 -20 -20 -20 -20 -10 -10 30 20 0 0 0 0 20 30 -24 -12 0 4 4 0 -12 -24 -12 8 20 24 24 20 8 -12 0 20 32 36 36 32 20 0 4 24 36 40 40 36 24 4 4 24 36 40 40 36 24 4 0 20 32 36 36 32 20 0 -12 8 20 24 24 20 8 -12 -24 -12 0 4 4 0 -12 -24king_safety_table 0 4 9 15 22 30 39 49 60 72 85 99 114 130 147 165king_relative_to_pawns_table 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 5 5 3 1 0 0 0 0 11 11 7 3 0 0 0 0 17 16 11 5 0 0 0 0 20 20 13 5 0 0 0 0 0 15 10 4 0 0 0 0 12 11 6 2 0 0 0 0 7 5 2 0 0 0 0 0 4 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0paneltyfiles 0 0 10 25 45 60 80 100progress 0 0 0 0Doublepawnpanelty 20candidatefactor 3opposite_color_bishops 44bigpositional_opening 130 bigpositional_endgame 130 big_bonus 160bigadvantage 200old_mobility_table -92 -86 -80 -74 -68 -62 -56 -50 -44 -38 -32 -26 -20 -14 -8 -2 4 10 15 20 25 30 34 38 42 46 49 52 55 58 60 62 64 66 68 70 72 74 76 78 80 82 84 86 88 90 92 94 96 98 100 102 104 106 108 110 112 114 116 118 120 122 124 126 128 130 132 134 136 138 140 142 144 146 148 150 152 154 156 158 160 162 164 166 168 170 172 174 176 178 180 182 184 186 188 190 192 194 196 198 200 202 204 206 208 210 212 214 216 218 220 222 224 226 228 230 232 234 236 238 240 242 244 246 248 250 252 254 256 258 260 262 264 266 268 270 272 274 276 278 280 282 284 286 288 290 292 294 296 298 300 302 304 306 308 310 312 314 316 318 320 322 324 326 328 330 332 334 336 338 340 342 344 346 348 350 352 354 356 358 360 362 364 366 368 370 372 374 376 378 380 382 384 386 388 390 392 394 396 398 400 402 404 406 408 410 412 414 416 418 420 422 424 426 428 430 432 434 436 438 440 442 444 446 448 450 452 454 456 458 460 462 464 466 468 470 472 474 476 478 480 483 484 486 488 490 492 494 496 498 500 502 504 506 508open_file_number 10rook_behind_passed_pawn 20prefer_pawns_in_end_games 1capture_bonus1 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127capture_endgame_bonus1 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127capture_bonus2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2capture_endgame_bonus2 0 2 4 6 8 10 12 14 16 18 20 22 24 26 28 30 32 34 36 38 40 42 44 46 48 50 52 54 56 58 60 62 64 66 68 70 72 74 76 78 80 82 84 86 88 90 92 94 96 98 100 102 104 106 108 110 112 114 116 118 120 122 124 126 128 130 132 134 136 138 140 142 144 146 148 150 152 154 156 158 160 162 164 166 168 170 172 174 176 178 180 182 184 186 188 190 192 194 196 198 200 202 204 206 208 210 212 214 216 218 220 222 224 226 228 230 232 234 236 238 240 242 244 246 248 250 252 254weak_pawn_opening_1 3weak_pawn_opening_2 10weak_pawn_endgame_1 3weak_pawn_endgame_2 10futilityprune 160 480 480 480 480 fruit_mobility 0futilityprune2 30 70 70 70 70 26pruning3 500hardpruning_numbers 0 250 500 750 1000 partial_check_extension 1array_reply_extension 0 140 60 0 0 0 0 0additional_reply_extension 200 0 0 0 0 0 0check_or_single_extensions 1mate_threat_ext 1promotion_reduction 1recapture_ext 1recap_num 140pawnend_ext 1limit_check 800limit_single 200pawn_push_ext 1min_eval_pruning -500LIGHTpassedbonusopening 0 4 8 16 20 30 30LIGHTpassedbonusendgame 0 4 8 16 20 30 30Blockedpassedminusopening 0 2 4 8 10 15 15Blockedpassedminusendgame 0 2 4 8 10 15 15max_search_ply 100 reducekings 5additional_king_safety 10play_rate 100 probe_depth 3qsearchprune 1 latereduction 1 depth_late 2num_late 5morelatereduction 30 margin 100 num_order_qsearch 5 num_order_search 10 good_pass_ext 100limit_pass 200mobilitydivider 64special_bonus_endgame 10rook_factor 0a_weaker 0extreme_pawn_array 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0history_verification_number 1less_reduce 0

[Uri Blass]

Yes

This is the correct change files.
The magic number include the default numbers and is constant(movei will change it to default numbers if you try to change it).

You can test changing it only by changing the changes file.

I suggested different piece square tables but I am not sure if they are better so I left the default piece square table.

Uri