Can Komodo give a Queen to a 1500 chess Engine on CCRL?

[Chessqueen]

As a matter of fact how many chess Engines fall between 1500 to 1550 listed on CCRL ?

[amanjpro]

As a matter of fact how many chess Engines fall between 1500 to 1550 listed on CCRL ?

Go, and count maybe? And then find one, and test it against Komodo, then come back to this forum to ask the moderators to delete your thread!

[Chessqueen]

As a matter of fact how many chess Engines fall between 1500 to 1550 listed on CCRL ?

Go, and count maybe? And then find one, and test it against Komodo, then come back to this forum to ask the moderators to delete your thread!

Well 1st try against Cicada, but it was too strong for Stockfish, since Cicada is rated 1536 Next I will try against Pooky rated 1437. I started from this position since it is hard to start with a Queen missing from the original position without having Stockfish resign immediately

[pgn][Event "Computer chess game"]
[Site "MININT-UB2PIMJ"]
[Date "2021.09.04"]
[Round "?"]
[White "Cicada"]
[Black "Stockfish_14_x64_bmi2"]
[Result "1-0"]
[BlackElo "3500"]
[Time "18:05:37"]
[WhiteElo "1700"]
[TimeControl "1200+5"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "r1b1kb1r/1p2pp1p/pn1P1np1/8/3P4/3B1N2/PP3PPP/RNBQK2R b KQkq - 0 1"]
[Termination "normal"]
[PlyCount "61"]
[WhiteType "program"]
[BlackType "program"]

1. ... e6 2. Qb3 Nfd5 3. Qa3 Bd7 4. Nc3 Rd8 5. Bg5 f6 6. Bh4 Bc6 7. Nxd5
Nxd5 8. Bg3 Kf7 9. Qc5 Rc8 10. Kf1 Bh6 11. Qa5 Rhe8 12. Re1 Rcd8 13. Be4
Bf8 14. Qc5 Rc8 15. Kg1 Kg8 16. Bd3 f5 17. Be5 Bg7 18. Bxg7 Kxg7 19. Ng5 h6
20. Nxe6+ Kf6 21. d7 Bxd7 22. Qxd5 Rxe6 23. Rxe6+ Bxe6 24. Qxb7 Rc1+ 25.
Bf1 Rd1 26. Qb4 h5 27. h4 a5 28. Qf8+ Bf7 29. Kh2 Rxd4 30. Qh8+ Ke7 31.
Qxd4 a4 {Black resigns} *[/pgn]

[Chessqueen]

As a matter of fact how many chess Engines fall between 1500 to 1550 listed on CCRL ?

Go, and count maybe? And then find one, and test it against Komodo, then come back to this forum to ask the moderators to delete your thread!

Well 1st try against Cicada, but it was too strong for Stockfish, since Cicada is rated 1536 Next I will try against Pooky rated 1437. I started from this position since it is hard to start with a Queen missing from the original position without having Stockfish resign immediately. This is where the main difference lie, an engine like Cicada rated 1536 can easily beat Stockfish with a Queen Odds but any human rated between 1550 to 1600 will have a hard time beating Stockfish with a Queen odds. On the other hand Komodo Dragon2 will destroy any engine rated up to 1600 with a Queen Odds.

[pgn][Event "Computer chess game"]
[Site "MININT-UB2PIMJ"]
[Date "2021.09.04"]
[Round "?"]
[White "Cicada"]
[Black "Stockfish_14_x64_bmi2"]
[Result "1-0"]
[BlackElo "3500"]
[Time "18:05:37"]
[WhiteElo "1700"]
[TimeControl "1200+5"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "r1b1kb1r/1p2pp1p/pn1P1np1/8/3P4/3B1N2/PP3PPP/RNBQK2R b KQkq - 0 1"]
[Termination "normal"]
[PlyCount "61"]
[WhiteType "program"]
[BlackType "program"]

1. ... e6 2. Qb3 Nfd5 3. Qa3 Bd7 4. Nc3 Rd8 5. Bg5 f6 6. Bh4 Bc6 7. Nxd5
Nxd5 8. Bg3 Kf7 9. Qc5 Rc8 10. Kf1 Bh6 11. Qa5 Rhe8 12. Re1 Rcd8 13. Be4
Bf8 14. Qc5 Rc8 15. Kg1 Kg8 16. Bd3 f5 17. Be5 Bg7 18. Bxg7 Kxg7 19. Ng5 h6
20. Nxe6+ Kf6 21. d7 Bxd7 22. Qxd5 Rxe6 23. Rxe6+ Bxe6 24. Qxb7 Rc1+ 25.
Bf1 Rd1 26. Qb4 h5 27. h4 a5 28. Qf8+ Bf7 29. Kh2 Rxd4 30. Qh8+ Ke7 31.
Qxd4 a4 {Black resigns} *[/pgn]

[lkaufman]

As a matter of fact how many chess Engines fall between 1500 to 1550 listed on CCRL ?

I might be able to answer your question definitively, by using the queen odds file posted here a while back by Chris Whittington. I have the engine Irina 0.15, which is a little below your range at 1435 CCRL blitz, but not on the rapid list. You didn't specify blitz or rapid, I can easily get an answer for blitz with "irina".

[Chessqueen]

As a matter of fact how many chess Engines fall between 1500 to 1550 listed on CCRL ?

I might be able to answer your question definitively, by using the queen odds file posted here a while back by Chris Whittington. I have the engine Irina 0.15, which is a little below your range at 1435 CCRL blitz, but not on the rapid list. You didn't specify blitz or rapid, I can easily get an answer for blitz with "irina".

Even Komodo 13.3 can easily beat Hokus-Pokus rated 1389 by CCRL, and by conclusion Komodo Dragon2 can probably beat a 1600 rated engine easy. TC 15'+10". Tomorrow I will go to the Chess Club and ask a 1550 rated player to play versus Komodo 13.3 with Queen Odds.

[pgn][Event "Queen Odds"]
[Site "MININT-UB2PIMJ"]
[Date "2021.09.04"]
[Round "?"]
[White "Komodo-13.3-64bit-bmi2"]
[Black "Hokpok_063 (1)"]
[Result "1-0"]
[BlackElo "1389"]
[Time "20:54:52"]
[WhiteElo "3470"]
[TimeControl "900+10"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "rnbqkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNB1KBNR w KQkq - 0 1"]
[Termination "normal"]
[PlyCount "127"]
[WhiteType "program"]
[BlackType "program"]

1. Nf3 d5 2. g3 Nc6 3. d4 f6 4. Bg2 e5 5. c3 e4 6. Nfd2 f5 7. f4 Nf6 8. a4
Be6 9. Nb3 Nxd4 10. Nxd4 Bd7 11. Nc2 Bd6 12. O-O h5 13. h4 Ng4 14. Bd2 c5
15. Bh3 Qb6 16. a5 Qxb2 17. Nba3 c4 18. Rfb1 Bxa3 19. Rxb2 Bxb2 20. Rb1
Bxc3 21. Bxc3 Bc6 22. Bxg4 fxg4 23. Bxg7 Rg8 24. Be5 Rd8 25. Bc3 Rf8 26.
Kf2 Rb8 27. Ke3 b6 28. Ra1 bxa5 29. Nd4 Bb5 30. Rxa5 a6 31. f5 Rf7 32. Kf4
Rbb7 33. Kg5 Rg7+ 34. Kf4 Rgf7 35. Kg5 Rg7+ 36. Kf4 Rgd7 37. Kg5 Rh7 38.
Ne6 d4 39. Bxd4 Rbd7 40. Kg6 Rhf7 41. f6 Rd6 42. Ng5 Rf8 43. Bc3 e3 44. Ra1
Bd7 45. Rb1 Bc8 46. Rb8 Kd7 47. Kg7 Kc7 48. Rb4 Re8 49. Rxc4+ Kb8 50. f7
Rd7 51. Kg6 Red8 52. Be5+ Ka8 53. Ne6 Ka7 54. Nxd8 Rxd8 55. Re4 Kb6 56.
Bd4+ Kc7 57. Re8 Rxd4 58. f8=Q Rd6+ 59. Qxd6+ Kxd6 60. Rxc8 a5 61. Kxh5 Kd5
62. Kxg4 a4 63. h5 a3 64. Rd8 {Black resigns} 1-0[/pgn]

[lkaufman]

As a matter of fact how many chess Engines fall between 1500 to 1550 listed on CCRL ?

I might be able to answer your question definitively, by using the queen odds file posted here a while back by Chris Whittington. I have the engine Irina 0.15, which is a little below your range at 1435 CCRL blitz, but not on the rapid list. You didn't specify blitz or rapid, I can easily get an answer for blitz with "irina".

Even Komodo 13.3 can easily beat Hokus-Pokus rated 1389 by CCRL, and by conclusion Komodo Dragon2 can probably beat a 1600 rated engine easy. TC 15'+10". Tomorrow I will go to the Chess Club and ask a 1550 rated player to play versus Komodo 13.3 with Queen Odds.

[pgn][Event "Queen Odds"]
[Site "MININT-UB2PIMJ"]
[Date "2021.09.04"]
[Round "?"]
[White "Komodo-13.3-64bit-bmi2"]
[Black "Hokpok_063 (1)"]
[Result "1-0"]
[BlackElo "1389"]
[Time "20:54:52"]
[WhiteElo "3470"]
[TimeControl "900+10"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "rnbqkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNB1KBNR w KQkq - 0 1"]
[Termination "normal"]
[PlyCount "127"]
[WhiteType "program"]
[BlackType "program"]

1. Nf3 d5 2. g3 Nc6 3. d4 f6 4. Bg2 e5 5. c3 e4 6. Nfd2 f5 7. f4 Nf6 8. a4
Be6 9. Nb3 Nxd4 10. Nxd4 Bd7 11. Nc2 Bd6 12. O-O h5 13. h4 Ng4 14. Bd2 c5
15. Bh3 Qb6 16. a5 Qxb2 17. Nba3 c4 18. Rfb1 Bxa3 19. Rxb2 Bxb2 20. Rb1
Bxc3 21. Bxc3 Bc6 22. Bxg4 fxg4 23. Bxg7 Rg8 24. Be5 Rd8 25. Bc3 Rf8 26.
Kf2 Rb8 27. Ke3 b6 28. Ra1 bxa5 29. Nd4 Bb5 30. Rxa5 a6 31. f5 Rf7 32. Kf4
Rbb7 33. Kg5 Rg7+ 34. Kf4 Rgf7 35. Kg5 Rg7+ 36. Kf4 Rgd7 37. Kg5 Rh7 38.
Ne6 d4 39. Bxd4 Rbd7 40. Kg6 Rhf7 41. f6 Rd6 42. Ng5 Rf8 43. Bc3 e3 44. Ra1
Bd7 45. Rb1 Bc8 46. Rb8 Kd7 47. Kg7 Kc7 48. Rb4 Re8 49. Rxc4+ Kb8 50. f7
Rd7 51. Kg6 Red8 52. Be5+ Ka8 53. Ne6 Ka7 54. Nxd8 Rxd8 55. Re4 Kb6 56.
Bd4+ Kc7 57. Re8 Rxd4 58. f8=Q Rd6+ 59. Qxd6+ Kxd6 60. Rxc8 a5 61. Kxh5 Kd5
62. Kxg4 a4 63. h5 a3 64. Rd8 {Black resigns} 1-0[/pgn]

That is a very strange game; 9...Nxd4??? is not a 1400 level blunder, it is a 400 level blunder. No program doing even a one ply search should do that unless programmed to deliberately blunder. Some programs may just not work properly when up too much; I recall that Rybka 2 (maybe 2.1 or 2.2) had a bug when I started to work on Rybka that caused it to play like an idiot when up more than a rook. I think that the engine Irina that I am using is more or less reliable for the rating it has, I'll see. A 1500 rated human should beat any opponent, human or engine, with queen odds in Rapid, though not in blitz.
By the way I ran some tests at the fastgm blitz level of 1' + 0.6" to compare knight odds with rook odds. I picked Zahak 5.0 as the opponent as it is rated about right for this test and is relatively good with the handicap compared to other similarly rated engines. Dragon was set to use Contempt 125 as that seems best for knight odds vs. engines at least. At knight odds (using Chris W. book, middle 200 positions) Dragon won 115, lost 75, and drew 10 for a plus 70 elo result. At rook odds (done the same way) Dragon won 60, lost 129, drew 11 for minus 126 elo. So the difference between knight odds and rook odds was just about 200 elo, rather less than I would expect. To put it another way, the performance rating of Dragon using the fastgm list for that bullet time control was 2573 giving knight odds, 2377 giving rook odds. Of course these ratings are not comparable to human bullet chess ratings; I would estimate that a 2500 bullet rating on that list means that the engine playing at that bullet speed (with no ponder) would be a pretty even match with a human GM rated 2500 playing 15' + 10" Rapid. I find it remarkable that the Dragon can give rook odds to an engine rated 2377 on that list, even at bullet.
The blitz (2' + 1") match with Irina is 1/4 done and Dragon is winning by more than 2 to 1 after 100 games. So at least in blitz, it can probably give queen odds to engines rated up to 1550 or so. But Rapid may be too favorable for the odds-receiver.

[lkaufman]

Final result for Dragon 2 giving queen odds to Irina 0.15 at 2' + 1" blitz was +106 -70 =24 for +63 elo. So based on this, at blitz CCRL tc Dragon is about even with 1500 CCRL blitz at queen odds. Overnight running 15' + 10" rapid, I expect Dragon to lose badly.

[Chessqueen]

Final result for Dragon 2 giving queen odds to Irina 0.15 at 2' + 1" blitz was +106 -70 =24 for +63 elo. So based on this, at blitz CCRL tc Dragon is about even with 1500 CCRL blitz at queen odds. Overnight running 15' + 10" rapid, I expect Dragon to lose badly.

I came to Philippines Thursday and leaving today in 30 minutes, 4 hours ago I visited one of their local Chess Club and found Nelson a 1545 rated player since I am with my i7 laptop computer he agreed to play one game with Queen Odds against Komodo 13.3 I only had to pay him $10.00 since he lost and if he had won $25.00 which is a lot of money in Philippines and $15.00 for a draw. Well he tried hard to get at least a draw but was could NOT draw against the Beast. I also played one game against a local Fulo, Nunilon III rated 2025 and drew at TC 5'+3"

[pgn][Event "Queen Odds"]
[Site "Philippines Chess Club"]
[Date "2021.09.05"]
[Round "1"]
[White "Komodo-13.3-64bit-bmi2"]
[Black "Nelson"]
[Result "1-0"]
[BlackElo "1545"]
[Time "02:09:31"]
[WhiteElo "3470"]
[TimeControl "300+3"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "rnbqkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNB1KBNR w KQkq - 3 1"]
[Termination "normal"]
[PlyCount "100"]
[WhiteType "program"]
[BlackType "human"]

1. Nf3 Nc6 2. d3 Nf6 3. e4 d5 4. e5 Ng4 5. d4 Bf5 6. c3 Qd7 7. h3 Bxb1 8.
Rxb1 Qf5 9. Ra1 Nh6 10. Bb5 g6 11. O-O O-O-O 12. Nh4 Qe6 13. Nf3 Bg7 14.
Re1 Qd7 15. b4 Rde8 16. a4 a6 17. Bd3 Nf5 18. b5 axb5 19. axb5 Nb8 20. g4
Nh6 21. Bf4 Nxg4 22. e6 fxe6 23. hxg4 e5 24. Nxe5 Bxe5 25. Rxe5 Qxg4+ 26.
Bg3 Qf3 27. Re3 Qg4 28. Be2 Qf5 29. Re5 Qd7 30. b6 Na6 31. bxc7 Nxc7 32. c4
Qh3 33. cxd5 b6 34. Rc1 Kb7 35. Bf3 Na6 36. Rce1 Kc8 37. Re6 Nb8 38. Rxb6
Ref8 39. Bg2 Qg4 40. Rxb8+ Kd7 41. Rb7+ Kd8 42. Rexe7 g5 43. d6 Qc8 44.
Rec7 Rf6 45. Bc6 Qa8 46. Rb1 Rf7 47. Bxa8 Rxc7 48. dxc7+ Kd7 49. Rb8 Rc8
50. Rxc8 Kxc8 {Black resigns} *[/pgn]

[Chessqueen]

But against another 1600 rated player Komodo lost very quickly, and I lost $25.00. This is using my Laptop Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-4770 CPU @ 3.40GHz with 15.9 GB Memory

[pgn][Event "Queen Odds"]
[Site "Philippines Chess Club"]
[Date "2021.09.05"]
[Round "2"]
[White "Komodo-13.3-64bit-bmi2"]
[Black "Jose"]
[Result "0-1"]
[BlackElo "1600"]
[Time "08:09:17"]
[WhiteElo "3470"]
[TimeControl "300+3"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "rnbqkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNB1KBNR w KQkq - 0 1"]
[Termination "normal"]
[PlyCount "43"]
[WhiteType "program"]
[BlackType "human"]

1. d4 Nf6 2. Bf4 d5 3. Nf3 Nc6 4. e3 Bg4 5. Nbd2 Bxf3 6. gxf3 Nh5 7. Bg3
Nxg3 8. hxg3 e5 9. O-O-O exd4 10. exd4 Nxd4 11. Re1+ Be7 12. c3 Ne6 13. Re5
O-O 14. f4 Bf6 15. Reh5 h6 16. Rxh6 gxh6 17. Kd1 Bg7 18. f3 c5 19. Kc2 d4
20. Bc4 dxc3 21. bxc3 {White resigns} Qd6 22. Ne4 {White resigns} *[/pgn]