There is something wrong with Honey Elo Expert setting

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Chessqueen
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There is something wrong with Honey Elo Expert setting

Post by Chessqueen » Wed Jul 07, 2021 2:22 am

I set up Honey to play at Expert Level, and started with the Clemenz Opening which I know most Engines do not know the best continuation, but there must be something wrong because I beat it to easy.

Do all chess hustlers talk trash? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ilZNF7PUQqs

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MikeB
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Re: There is something wrong with Honey Elo Expert setting

Post by MikeB » Wed Jul 07, 2021 2:32 am

Chessqueen wrote:
Wed Jul 07, 2021 2:22 am
I set up Honey to play at Expert Level, and started with the Clemenz Opening which I know most Engines do not know the best continuation, but there must be something wrong because I beat it to easy.

The predefined levels have been weakened by design over time - internally just use them as a ladder , if one level is too weak , play at highe level. They have variability built-in. This was done by design to make the weakest levels more beatable by weak players. Othersie weak playrrs may not win or draw a game. My grandchildren , who have just learned chess, can play the weakest levels to a draw, I am not changing it, just play at the level right for you if Expert is too easy. Try a game at search depth 7 with variety off and tactical set to 3. ;>)
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Chessqueen
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Re: There is something wrong with Honey Elo Expert setting

Post by Chessqueen » Wed Jul 07, 2021 3:02 am

MikeB wrote:
Wed Jul 07, 2021 2:32 am
Chessqueen wrote:
Wed Jul 07, 2021 2:22 am
I set up Honey to play at Expert Level, and started with the Clemenz Opening which I know most Engines do not know the best continuation, but there must be something wrong because I beat it to easy.

The predefined levels have been weakened by design over time - internally just use them as a ladder , if one level is too weak , play at highe level. They have variability built-in. This was done by design to make the weakest levels more beatable by weak players. Othersie weak playrrs may not win or draw a game. My grandchildren , who have just learned chess, can play the weakest levels to a draw, I am not changing it, just play at the level right for you if Expert is too easy. Try a game at search depth 7 with variety off and tactical set to 3. ;>)
I lost the 2nd game :oops:

Do all chess hustlers talk trash? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ilZNF7PUQqs

Chessqueen
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Re: There is something wrong with Honey Elo Expert setting

Post by Chessqueen » Wed Jul 07, 2021 1:26 pm

I did not wanted to leave the score even so I played another game with the recommended settings by Mike B search depth 7 with variety off and tactical set to 3.

Do all chess hustlers talk trash? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ilZNF7PUQqs

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MikeB
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Re: There is something wrong with Honey Elo Expert setting

Post by MikeB » Wed Jul 07, 2021 3:19 pm

Chessqueen wrote:
Wed Jul 07, 2021 1:26 pm
I did not wanted to leave the score even so I played another game with the recommended settings by Mike B search depth 7 with variety off and tactical set to 3.

You do know that you are playing the engine in a weakened condition. If you post a screenshot of your settings, i can help you fix that.
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Chessqueen
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Re: There is something wrong with Honey Elo Expert setting

Post by Chessqueen » Wed Jul 07, 2021 5:32 pm

MikeB wrote:
Wed Jul 07, 2021 3:19 pm
Chessqueen wrote:
Wed Jul 07, 2021 1:26 pm
I did not wanted to leave the score even so I played another game with the recommended settings by Mike B search depth 7 with variety off and tactical set to 3.

You do know that you are playing the engine in a weakened condition. If you post a screenshot of your settings, i can help you fix that.
I do NOT know how to get a screenshot, I decided to play against the Master Level and I gave it a good fight :roll:

Do all chess hustlers talk trash? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ilZNF7PUQqs

Chessqueen
Posts: 2399
Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2018 12:16 am
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Re: There is something wrong with Honey Elo Expert setting

Post by Chessqueen » Wed Jul 07, 2021 9:18 pm

MikeB wrote:
Wed Jul 07, 2021 3:19 pm
Chessqueen wrote:
Wed Jul 07, 2021 1:26 pm
I did not wanted to leave the score even so I played another game with the recommended settings by Mike B search depth 7 with variety off and tactical set to 3.

You do know that you are playing the engine in a weakened condition. If you post a screenshot of your settings, i can help you fix that.
Other members of this forum should play games at different level like Class B, Class C, to see how well those level are tuned up with Honey :roll:
[img]file:///C:/Users/Administrator/Pictures/Honey.png[/img]
Do all chess hustlers talk trash? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ilZNF7PUQqs

scchess
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Re: There is something wrong with Honey Elo Expert setting

Post by scchess » Thu Jul 08, 2021 6:42 am

Didn't Stockfish already provide well defined strength level support? What's difference between Honey to it?

purechess
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Re: There is something wrong with Honey Elo Expert setting

Post by purechess » Thu Jul 08, 2021 8:55 am

scchess wrote:
Thu Jul 08, 2021 6:42 am
Didn't Stockfish already provide well defined strength level support? What's difference between Honey to it?
Stockfish doesn't has an adaptive mode , doesn't cut nodes to search if played at a limited ELO rating, doesn't has a UCI setting for fixed search depth for example or doesn't support Polybook books.

Rowen
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Re: There is something wrong with Honey Elo Expert setting

Post by Rowen » Thu Jul 08, 2021 9:16 am

scchess wrote:
Thu Jul 08, 2021 6:42 am
Didn't Stockfish already provide well defined strength level support? What's difference between Honey to it?
I think that the stockfish 'skill level' setting parameter works by calculating normally and then selecting an inferior move (using MultiPV mode) whereas
the Honey reduced elo / engine levels weaken the engine by restricting nodes searches (node count).

Nodes can also be reduced using stockfish and I think Honey still has the skill level setting ?(I dont have the latest versions) but Honey also has other options compared to stockfish and so seems to be more useful as a 'sparing partner'.

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