Battle of the Forgotten

Discussion of computer chess matches and engine tournaments.

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Carlos777
Posts: 615
Joined: Sun Dec 13, 2009 5:09 pm

Re: Battle of the Forgotten

Post by Carlos777 » Sun Jan 17, 2010 4:35 pm

Richard Allbert wrote::shock:

Jabba better than expected.

Thanks a lot for the result, I'll post it on my blog

Regards

Richard
Hi Richard,

Not at all, Jabba is a nice engine.

Jabba was one of the first programs I was testing (before the "real" tournament began). I opted for keeping it in the tournament, in spite of the strenght showed until then.

Here is a logo for Jabba: (thanks to David Dahlem)

Image

I am thinking about testing Lime, but I am afraid it would be too strong for this field. What do you think?

Regards,
Carlos

PS:

More logos from David:

Cuckoo Chess
Image

Stockfish 1.6s
Image

Sven
Posts: 3572
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 7:57 pm
Location: Berlin, Germany

Re: Battle of the Forgotten

Post by Sven » Sun Jan 17, 2010 5:58 pm

swami wrote:Thank you.

Interesting information about engines in 1800-2000 range of the ratings scale.
In fact it is even slightly below that:
Carlos777 wrote:The conditions to participate are:

1. Engines should have an approx. ELO of 1700 or lower.
which by no means makes it less interesting, of course.

Sven

Richard Allbert
Posts: 762
Joined: Wed Jul 19, 2006 7:58 am

Re: Battle of the Forgotten

Post by Richard Allbert » Sun Jan 17, 2010 6:09 pm

Yes, I think Lime is too strong for the list!

swami
Posts: 6535
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 3:21 am

Re: Battle of the Forgotten

Post by swami » Sun Jan 17, 2010 6:31 pm

Sven Schüle wrote:
swami wrote:Thank you.

Interesting information about engines in 1800-2000 range of the ratings scale.
In fact it is even slightly below that:
Carlos777 wrote:The conditions to participate are:

1. Engines should have an approx. ELO of 1700 or lower.
which by no means makes it less interesting, of course.

Sven
Yes, I hadn't read that until later.

I did see the top 2 Jabba and KMTChess in there and thought these engines were around 2000 and ones below them were probably around 1800. Hence my assumption 1800-2000. :)

Carlos777
Posts: 615
Joined: Sun Dec 13, 2009 5:09 pm

Re: Battle of the Forgotten

Post by Carlos777 » Mon Jan 18, 2010 1:39 am

Richard Allbert wrote:Yes, I think Lime is too strong for the list!
Ok Richard, thanks.

Update

Current crosstable:

Code: Select all

    Engine             Score   Ja Si KM Ro Si Yo Cu My Da Ch Mi Re Sj Oz Ro Br Cl Ad RB Ar Ch Al AL Da Tr Ed Fr Nu Ge Na Xa Jo Fi Yo Ge Sa Ne Ac Po Cp    S-B
01: Jabba 1.0          50.5/58 ·· 0= 10 00 11 11 11 11 11 =  =  1  1  11 11 0  1  1  11 =  1  1  1  1  11 11 1  11 1  =1 11 1  1  11 11 11 1  1  1  1   1135.2
02: Simplex 0.0        49.5/57 1= ·· 1= == 01 01 11 01 =1 1  1  =  0  11 11 1  1  1  11 1  1  =     1  11 11 1  11 1  11 11 1  1  11 11 11 1  1  1  1   1112.7
03: KMTChess 1.1       49.0/57 01 0= ·· 11 11 00 11 11 10 =  1  1  =  11 11 1  1  1  10 1     1  =  1  11 11 1  11 1  11 11 1  1  11 11 11 1  1  1  1   1102.5
04: Roce 0.0390        47.5/57 11 == 00 ·· =0 1= 10 10 11 0  1  =  1  11 11 1  1  1  11 =  1  1  1  1  1= 11    11 1  11 11 1  1  11 11 11 1  1  1  1   1031.7
05: Sissa 1.00         46.5/58 00 10 00 =1 ·· 1= 11 =0 11 0  0  =  1  10 11 1  1  1  11 1  =  1  1  1  11 11 1  11 1  11 11 1  1  11 11 11 1  1  1  1   970.50
06: Yoda 1.30          40.5/57 00 10 11 0= 0= ·· 00 11 =0 0  0  =  0  =1 =1 1  0     11 1  1  1  =  1  11 11 1  10 1  11 11 1  1  11 11 11 1  1  1  1   815.75
07: Cuckoo Chess 1.0   40.5/58 00 00 00 01 00 11 ·· =1 11 0  1  0  =  01 10 0  1  0  11 =  1  1  1  0  11 11 1  11 1  11 11 1  1  11 11 11 1  1  1  1   777.00
08: Myrddin 0.81a2     39.0/57 00 10 00 01 =1 00 =0 ·· 11 =  0  0  0  =1 11    =  1  =0 1  1  0  1  1  11 11 1  11 0  11 11 1  1  11 11 11 1  1  1  1   762.00
09: Dabbaba 2.46       33.5/58 00 =0 01 00 00 =1 00 00 ·· 1  =  0  0  11 1= 1  0  0  10 0  0  0  1  0  11 11 =  01 1  11 11 1  1  11 11 11 1  1  1  1   593.50
10: Chesley r317 ja    31.0/38 =  0  =  1  1  1  1  =  0  ·· 1  0  0  1     1  =  0  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1   644.25
11: Micro-Max 4.8w     29.0/37 =  0  0  0  1  1  0  1  =  0  ·· 1  1     1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  =  0  1  1  =  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1     1  1   589.00
12: Reger 0.09         28.5/37 0  =  0  =  =  =  1  1  1  1  0  ·· 1  1  1  1  0  1     =  =  =  1  1  1  1  1     0  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1   584.00
13: Sjakk 1.1.3        28.5/38 0  1  =  0  0  1  =  1  1  1  0  0  ·· 1  1  =  0  =  1  1  1  1  1  0  =  1  1  1  1     1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1   578.50
14: Ozwald 0.43        28.5/56 00 00 00 00 01 =0 10 =0 00 0     0  0  ·· == 1  =  0  01 =  0  0  0  =  1= 11 0  11 1  =1 11 1  1  11 11 11 1  1     1   471.50
15: Rocinante 1.01     27.0/57 00 00 00 00 00 =0 01 00 0=    0  0  0  == ·· 0  0  1  00 0  0  1  0  =  11 0= =  11 =  11 11 1  1  11 11 11 1  1  1  1   389.75
16: Brembo 0.62        26.0/38 1  0  0  0  0  0  1     0  0  0  0  =  0  1  ·· 1  1  =  =  1  1  1  1  1  1  =  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1   453.25
17: Cleo 1             25.0/38 0  0  0  0  0  1  0  =  1  =  0  1  1  =  1  0  ·· 0  =  0  1  0  1  1  1     1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1   434.00
18: Adamant 1.7        25.0/38 0  0  0  0  0     1  0  1  1  0  0  =  1  0  0  1  ·· 1  1  0  1  =  1  0  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1   421.25
19: RBrChess 2.16      24.5/56 00 00 01 00 00 00 00 =1 01 0  0     0  10 11 =  =  0  ·· 0  0  0  0  0  00 00 0  11 0  11 11 1     11 11 11 1  1  1  1   397.00
20: ArabianKnight 0.88 23.5/38 =  0  0  =  0  0  =  0  1  0  0  =  0  =  1  =  1  0  1  ·· 1  1  0  =  =  1  1  1  1  1     1  =  1  1  1  1  1  1  1   416.00
21: Chessrikus 1.466   23.5/38 0  0     0  =  0  0  0  1  0  0  =  0  1  1  0  0  1  1  0  ·· =  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  0  1  1  1  1  1  1  1   386.00
22: Alibaba 1.17       23.0/38 0  =  0  0  0  0  0  1  1  0  0  =  0  1  0  0  1  0  1  0  =  ·· =  1     1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1   378.75
23: ALChess1.5b        23.0/38 0     =  0  0  =  0  0  0  0  =  0  0  1  1  0  0  =  1  1  0  =  ·· 1  1  1  =  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1   364.25
24: Damas9             21.0/39 0  0  0  0  0  0  1  0  1  0  1  0  1  =  =  0  0  0  1  =  0  0  0  ·· 0  1  1  1  =  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1   333.50
25: Trex 1.9           20.5/57 00 00 00 0= 00 00 00 00 00 0  0  0  =  0= 00 0  0  1  11 =  0     0  1  ·· 01 =  00 1  01 01 0  1  11 01 11 1  1  1  1   281.50
26: Eden 0.013         18.5/57 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 0  0  0  0  00 1= 0     0  11 0  0  0  0  0  10 ·· =  01 0  01 11 0  0  1= 11 11 1  1  1  1   220.25
27: Frittle 0.5        18.0/38 0  0  0     0  0  0  0  =  0  =  0  0  1  =  =  0  0  1  0  0  0  =  0  =  =  ·· =  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1   241.50
28: Numpty 0.5pr       17.5/56 00 00 00 00 00 01 00 00 10 0  0     0  00 00 0  0  0  00 0  0  0  0  0  11 10 =  ·· 0  =0 10 =  1  11 11 11    1  1  1   225.25
29: Gedeone 1620       14.0/38 0  0  0  0  0  0  0  1  0  0  0  1  0  0  =  0  0  0  1  0  0  0  0  =  0  1  0  1  ·· =  1  0  =  1  1     1  1  1  1   200.25
30: Nanook 0.17        13.5/56 =0 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 0  0  0     =0 00 0  0  0  00 0  0  0  0  0  10 10 0  =1 =  ·· 11 0  1  == == 1= =  1     =   174.50
31: Xadreco 5.7        11.5/57 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 0  0  0  0  00 00 0  0  0  00    0  0  0  0  10 00 0  01 0  00 ·· 0  0  1= 11 11 1  1  1  1    85.25
32: Joana_DC           11.0/38 0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  1  1  0  =  1  1  1  ·· 1  0  1  =     1  1  1   111.50
33: Fimbulwinter 5.02  11.0/38 0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0     =  1  0  0  0  0  1  0  0  =  0  1  0  ·· 1  1  1  1  1  1  1   102.25
34: Youk 1.05          9.5/58  00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 0  0  0  0  00 00 0  0  0  00 0  0  0  0  0  00 0= 0  00 0  == 0= 1  0  ·· 10 =1 1  1  1  1    62.75
35: Geko 0.43          7.0/57  00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 0  0  0  0  00 00 0  0  0  00 0  0  0  0  0  10 00 0  00 0  == 00 0  0  01 ·· == 1  1  1       56.00
36: Sachy 0.2.01       5.5/57  00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 0  0  0  0  00 00 0  0  0  00 0  0  0  0  0  00 00 0  00    0= 00 =  0  =0 == ·· =  =  1  1    29.25
37: Neg 0.3d           4.0/37  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0     0  =  0     0  0  0  =  ·· 1  1  1    13.50
38: Ace v0.1           1.5/38  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0     0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  =  0  ·· =  =     4.00
39: Pos-1.20           1.5/37  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0     0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0     0  0  0  0  0  0  0  =  ·· 1     1.75
40: Cpp1               1.0/38  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  0  =  0  0  0  0     0  0  =  0  ··    7.50

949 of 1560 games played
Buggy engines still in the tournament (I will take a decision about them later)

- Joana DC by Juan Pablo Mendoza (when playing with white pieces does not accept opponent's short castle and loses by time. 5 losses on time out of 38 games.)
- Yoda 1.30 does not accept opponent's underpromotion to other piece different of a queen. (as this happens ocasionally, Yoda won't appear in this list in the next update. Anyway, it seems Yoda is going to be removed at the end of the cycle being at the top10 right now.)

Regards,
Carlos

PS: I will travel in few hours, therefore I'll be far from my PC for some days. So, next update will be in 6 or 7 days.

Carlos777
Posts: 615
Joined: Sun Dec 13, 2009 5:09 pm

Re: Battle of the Forgotten

Post by Carlos777 » Mon Jan 18, 2010 1:56 am

swami wrote: I did see the top 2 Jabba and KMTChess in there and thought these engines were around 2000 and ones below them were probably around 1800. Hence my assumption 1800-2000. :)
Hi Swami,

Yes, I did not know too much about these engines at the time. As they had already played many games, I decided to keep them. Less strong engines will compete in the next cycle (this is the goal of this peculiar tournament :wink:).

Best,
Carlos

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hgm
Posts: 22180
Joined: Fri Mar 10, 2006 9:06 am
Location: Amsterdam
Contact:

Re: Battle of the Forgotten

Post by hgm » Mon Jan 18, 2010 8:32 am

Carlos777 wrote:Not working under Arena: (if someone has an idea on how to make them work, please reply)

ChessV 0.94
The engine command line for ChessV 0.94 has to be:

Code: Select all

ChessV_WinBoard "Orthodox Chess"
It seems that Arena cannot handle this (or people simply have not found out what they have to tell Arena to produce this command line when installing the engine).

Possible work-arounds are:

1) Put that command line in a batch file chessv.bat, and then install that batch file as an engine in Arena.

2) Make a ChessV .SGF file (saved-game file), say CHESS.SGF for the initial position of Orthodox Chess by saving from the stand-alone version of ChessV, or read the instructions that come with ChessV on how to make such a file for specifying variants, and follow those. Then install ChessV in Arena with the engine command:

Code: Select all

ChessV_WinBoard CHESS.SGF
so that you do not need the quotes around the argument that specifies the variant.

Even under WinBoard + PSWBTM I have to use the latter trick to make ChessV play Bird's Chess, as I have found no way yet to get the single quote in the variant name into the engine command line. With a bare WinBoard I can use /fcp={ChessV_WinBoard "Bird's Chess"}, but PSWBTM puts single quotes around the /fcp argument, and that is what makes WinBoard choke on it.

metax
Posts: 344
Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2009 3:56 pm
Location: Germany

Re: Battle of the Forgotten

Post by metax » Mon Jan 18, 2010 4:32 pm

What is the approximate rating scale for '1700 or lower'?

In CCRL rating, I would estimate ChessMind at 1930-1950 Elo based on games against Surprise. But in other rating scales, the ratings are often lower.

However, based on games against humans, I would estimate ChessMind at 1700-1750 'human Elo'.

I think in the CCRL rating scale Jabba would have around 1980-2000 Elo or even more.

Adam Hair
Posts: 3184
Joined: Wed May 06, 2009 8:31 pm
Location: Fuquay-Varina, North Carolina

Re: Battle of the Forgotten

Post by Adam Hair » Mon Jan 18, 2010 5:15 pm

This is great Carlos. I've been working on a rating list since August
and I am including engines of all strengths. Here is the bottom of my
list. I plan to include as many engines as I can make run on my computer
under Arena 2.01.

Code: Select all

77 Warrior_103                   -214   28   28   984   54%  -246   20% 
  78 Smash                         -248   27   27  1063   49%  -237   16% 
  79 SnailChess_4013               -252   29   29  1037   66%  -398   15% 
  80 Surprise_4.3b13               -254   28   28   970   49%  -244   16% 
  81 Clueless_14                   -278   28   28   984   46%  -241   11% 
  82 Embracer_112                  -309   28   28  1023   60%  -394   28% 
  83 Grizzly1401b                  -334   29   29  1023   57%  -395   13% 
  84 Elf130                        -403   29   29  1065   50%  -401   16% 
  85 TSCP181                       -430   28   28  1154   51%  -438   15% 
  86 Mizar3.0                      -453   30   30  1015   53%  -477   18% 
  87 DChess1_0_2                   -469   30   30  1018   51%  -475   16% 
  88 Storm_06                      -485   29   29  1034   49%  -473   17% 
  89 Beaches226                    -494   31   31   901   52%  -507   14% 
  90 PolarChess1.2                 -500   30   30   986   47%  -475   17% 
  91 Bace_045                      -513   29   29  1050   46%  -473   17% 
  92 MSCP_144_uci_ja               -517   31   31   981   51%  -553   18% 
  93 Needle_0531                   -563   31   31   872   53%  -618   23% 
  94 LarsenVB                      -638   32   32   877   45%  -616   15% 
  95 Pentagon_12                   -657   31   31   869   35%  -539   28% 
  96 StAndersen_v1.31_X64          -675   32   32   867   34%  -539   15% 
  97 TarraschToyEngineV0.906       -681   31   31   942   32%  -531   15% 
  98 Yawce016                      -687   34   34   770   45%  -660   10% 
  99 Nero_61                       -717   32   32   961   33%  -571   16% 
 100 Numpty_0.4pr                  -924   40   40   570   35%  -807   17% 
 101 Marquis16                     -951   45   45   536   50%  -953   16% 
 102 Xadreco_v5.7                 -1192   57   57   420   31%  -956   13% 
 103 Testina2_2                   -1259   64   64   241   34% -1096   31% 
 104 Pyotr-am_06                  -1376   63   63   387   12%  -947   18% 
The only engine in this group that gives me problems is Testina2.2. It
loses some on time and sometimes makes illegal moves.

Carlos777
Posts: 615
Joined: Sun Dec 13, 2009 5:09 pm

Re: Battle of the Forgotten

Post by Carlos777 » Mon Jan 18, 2010 8:06 pm

hgm wrote:
Carlos777 wrote:Not working under Arena: (if someone has an idea on how to make them work, please reply)

ChessV 0.94
The engine command line for ChessV 0.94 has to be:

Code: Select all

ChessV_WinBoard "Orthodox Chess"
Hi HGM,

I tried adding "Orthodox Chess" in the command parameters box without success, I will try your suggestions when I back home.

Thanks,
Carlos

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