Maybe it's difficult for engines

Discussion of anything and everything relating to chess playing software and machines.

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Chessqueen
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Full name: Jorge Picado

Re: Maybe it's difficult for engines

Post by Chessqueen »

Sometimes it take a very low rated engine to come up with great moves that super engines do NOT even consider because super engines always look for the best response of the opponent engine and not NOT execute the simplest move, here is Tarrasch Toy rated only 1450 and it did NOT even care about taking the Rook with its Queen, but somehow it managed a DRAW :roll:

[pgn][Event "Computer chess game"]
[Site "MININT-UB2PIMJ"]
[Date "2021.04.05"]
[Round "2"]
[White "TarraschToyEngineV0.906"]
[Black "TarraschToyEngineV0.906"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[BlackElo "1450"]
[Time "09:16:18"]
[WhiteElo "1450"]
[TimeControl "120+1"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "N2b1bk1/4p1p1/4PpPp/B1K5/3Q4/8/3n1p1p/r4Nbr w - - 0 1"]
[Termination "normal"]
[PlyCount "71"]


1. Qxa1 Nb3+ 2. Kb4 Nxa1 3. Kc3 Bxa5+ 4. Kb2 f5 5. Kxa1 f4 6. Kb2 h5 7. Kc2
h4 8. Kd3 Bb4 9. Nc7 Ba3 10. Ke4 Bd6 11. Nd5 h3 12. Nxf4 Bxf4 13. Kxf4 Kh8
14. Kg4 Kg8 15. Kxh3 Kh8 16. Kg2 Kg8 17. Kxh1 Kh8 18. Kg2 h1=Q+ 19. Kxh1
Kg8 20. Kg2 Kh8 21. Nd2 Kg8 22. Nf3 Kh8 23. Nxg1 fxg1=Q+ 24. Kxg1 Kg8 25.
Kf2 Kh8 26. Ke3 Kg8 27. Ke4 Kh8 28. Ke5 Kg8 29. Ke4 Kh8 30. Ke5 Kg8 31. Kd5
Kh8 32. Kc6 Kg8 33. Kd7 Kh8 34. Kd8 Kg8 35. Ke8 Kh8 36. Kxf8 {Stalemate}
1/2-1/2[/pgn]
Who is 17 years old GM Gukesh 2nd at the Candidate in Toronto?
https://indianexpress.com/article/sport ... t-9281394/
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Nordlandia
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Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2015 9:38 pm
Location: Sortland, Norway

Re: Maybe it's difficult for engines

Post by Nordlandia »

I remember Stockfish once wanted to capture the rook in the corner :lol:
Chessqueen
Posts: 5589
Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:16 am
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Full name: Jorge Picado

Re: Maybe it's difficult for engines

Post by Chessqueen »

Chessqueen wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 4:48 pm Sometimes it take a very low rated engine to come up with great moves that super engines do NOT even consider because super engines always look for the best response of the opponent engine and not NOT execute the simplest move, here is Tarrasch Toy rated only 1450 and it did NOT even care about taking the Rook with its Queen, but somehow it managed a DRAW :roll:

[pgn][Event "Computer chess game"]
[Site "MININT-UB2PIMJ"]
[Date "2021.04.05"]
[Round "2"]
[White "TarraschToyEngineV0.906"]
[Black "TarraschToyEngineV0.906"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[BlackElo "1450"]
[Time "09:16:18"]
[WhiteElo "1450"]
[TimeControl "120+1"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "N2b1bk1/4p1p1/4PpPp/B1K5/3Q4/8/3n1p1p/r4Nbr w - - 0 1"]
[Termination "normal"]
[PlyCount "71"]


1. Qxa1 Nb3+ 2. Kb4 Nxa1 3. Kc3 Bxa5+ 4. Kb2 f5 5. Kxa1 f4 6. Kb2 h5 7. Kc2
h4 8. Kd3 Bb4 9. Nc7 Ba3 10. Ke4 Bd6 11. Nd5 h3 12. Nxf4 Bxf4 13. Kxf4 Kh8
14. Kg4 Kg8 15. Kxh3 Kh8 16. Kg2 Kg8 17. Kxh1 Kh8 18. Kg2 h1=Q+ 19. Kxh1
Kg8 20. Kg2 Kh8 21. Nd2 Kg8 22. Nf3 Kh8 23. Nxg1 fxg1=Q+ 24. Kxg1 Kg8 25.
Kf2 Kh8 26. Ke3 Kg8 27. Ke4 Kh8 28. Ke5 Kg8 29. Ke4 Kh8 30. Ke5 Kg8 31. Kd5
Kh8 32. Kc6 Kg8 33. Kd7 Kh8 34. Kd8 Kg8 35. Ke8 Kh8 36. Kxf8 {Stalemate}
1/2-1/2[/pgn]

I also realized that in move 23. Ne5! followed by Nf7+ and repeat three times etc.. could also have achieve a quicker Draw by repetition :roll:
Who is 17 years old GM Gukesh 2nd at the Candidate in Toronto?
https://indianexpress.com/article/sport ... t-9281394/
Chessqueen
Posts: 5589
Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:16 am
Location: Moving
Full name: Jorge Picado

Re: Maybe it's difficult for engines

Post by Chessqueen »

Chessqueen wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 11:01 pm
Chessqueen wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 4:48 pm Sometimes it take a very low rated engine to come up with great moves that super engines do NOT even consider because super engines always look for the best response of the opponent engine and not NOT execute the simplest move, here is Tarrasch Toy rated only 1450 and it did NOT even care about taking the Rook with its Queen, but somehow it managed a DRAW :roll:

[pgn][Event "Computer chess game"]
[Site "MININT-UB2PIMJ"]
[Date "2021.04.05"]
[Round "2"]
[White "TarraschToyEngineV0.906"]
[Black "TarraschToyEngineV0.906"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[BlackElo "1450"]
[Time "09:16:18"]
[WhiteElo "1450"]
[TimeControl "120+1"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "N2b1bk1/4p1p1/4PpPp/B1K5/3Q4/8/3n1p1p/r4Nbr w - - 0 1"]
[Termination "normal"]
[PlyCount "71"]


1. Qxa1 Nb3+ 2. Kb4 Nxa1 3. Kc3 Bxa5+ 4. Kb2 f5 5. Kxa1 f4 6. Kb2 h5 7. Kc2
h4 8. Kd3 Bb4 9. Nc7 Ba3 10. Ke4 Bd6 11. Nd5 h3 12. Nxf4 Bxf4 13. Kxf4 Kh8
14. Kg4 Kg8 15. Kxh3 Kh8 16. Kg2 Kg8 17. Kxh1 Kh8 18. Kg2 h1=Q+ 19. Kxh1
Kg8 20. Kg2 Kh8 21. Nd2 Kg8 22. Nf3 Kh8 23. Nxg1 fxg1=Q+ 24. Kxg1 Kg8 25.
Kf2 Kh8 26. Ke3 Kg8 27. Ke4 Kh8 28. Ke5 Kg8 29. Ke4 Kh8 30. Ke5 Kg8 31. Kd5
Kh8 32. Kc6 Kg8 33. Kd7 Kh8 34. Kd8 Kg8 35. Ke8 Kh8 36. Kxf8 {Stalemate}
1/2-1/2[/pgn]

I also realized that in move 23. Ne5! followed by Nf7+ and repeat three times etc.. could also have achieve a quicker Draw by repetition :roll:
Sorry, for NOT calculating the position deeper, after 23. Ne5 the Black Bishop could place itself on h2! and the Knight would have to reconsider where it would have to place itself or retrieve back to g4 forcing a drawish position again, White King can NOT take the Bishop on h2 because the f2 pawn will promote to Queen :roll: :mrgreen:
Who is 17 years old GM Gukesh 2nd at the Candidate in Toronto?
https://indianexpress.com/article/sport ... t-9281394/
Chessqueen
Posts: 5589
Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:16 am
Location: Moving
Full name: Jorge Picado

Re: Maybe it's difficult for engines

Post by Chessqueen »

Hobacle you should try to play a few games against Tarrasch Toy Engine rated 1450, it will NOT block its pieces Ha Ha Ha :roll: :mrgreen: :roll:
Who is 17 years old GM Gukesh 2nd at the Candidate in Toronto?
https://indianexpress.com/article/sport ... t-9281394/
Paloma
Posts: 1167
Joined: Thu Dec 25, 2008 9:07 pm
Full name: Herbert L

Re: Maybe it's difficult for engines

Post by Paloma »

Chessqueen wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:38 am Hobacle you should try to play a few games against Tarrasch Toy Engine rated 1450, it will NOT block its pieces Ha Ha Ha :roll: :mrgreen: :roll:
are you stupid ? Your 12. Nxf4 Bxf4 13. Kxf4 is a big mistake!
exchange of free white Night against free black Bishop is WRONG

And if this one free black Bishop is exchanged against free white Night, there's no white figure left for capturing f-Bishop but the King, giving so stalemate after march of black free pawns is done.
So the white knight has to capture the f-bishop.

Solution is:
[pgn][Event "?"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "????.??.??"]
[Round "?"]
[White "?"]
[Black "?"]
[Result "*"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "N2b1b1k/4p1p1/4PpPp/B1K5/3Q4/8/3n1p1p/r4Nbr w - - 0 1"]
[PlyCount "117"]

1. Qxa1 Nb3+ 2. Kc4 Nxa1 3. Kc3 Bxa5+ 4. Kb2 Kg8 5. Kxa1 Kh8 6. Kb2 Kg8 7. Kb3
Kh8 8. Kc4 Kg8 9. Kd5 Kh8 10. Kc5 Kg8 11. Kc6 Kh8 12. Kd7 Kg8 13. Ke8 h5 14.
Kd7 Kh8 15. Kc6 Kg8 16. Kd5 Kh8 17. Ke4 Kg8 18. Kf4 Kh8 19. Kg3 Kg8 20. Kh4 Kh8
21. Kxh5 Kg8 22. Kg4 ({God of Chess:} 22. Kg4 Bd8 23. Kf4 Ba5 24. Ke4 Bd8 25.
Kd5 Ba5 26. Kc6 Kh8 27. Kd7 Kg8 28. Ke8 f5 29. Kd7 Kh8 30. Kc6 Bd8 31. Kd5 Ba5
32. Ke5 Bc3+ 33. Kxf5 Bd4 34. Ke4 Bc5 35. Kd5 Ba7 36. Kc6 Bd4 37. Nc7 Bc3 38.
Na6 Kg8 39. Nc5 Bd2 40. Kd7 Be3 41. Ne4 Kh8 42. Kd8 Kg8 43. Ke8 Bd4 44. Ng5 Bb2
45. Nh7 Be5 46. Nxf8 Bd6 47. Nd7 Bc7 48. Kxe7 Ba5 49. Ke8 Bc7 50. e7 Bf4 51.
Nf6+ gxf6 52. Kd7 Kg7 53. e8=Q Kh6 54. Ke6 Kg5 55. g7 Kg4 56. g8=Q+ Kh4 57.
Qh7+ Bh6 58. Qxh6+ Kg4 59. Qeh5# {#38/80}) 22... Kh8 23. Kf5 Kg8 24. Ke4 Kh8
25. Kd5 Kg8 26. Kc6 Kh8 27. Kd7 Kg8 28. Ke8 f5 29. Kd7 Kh8 30. Kc6 Kg8 31. Kd5
f4 32. Ke4 Bd2 33. Nb6 Bc1 34. Nc4 Be3 35. Kd5 Bc1 36. Kc6 Be3
37. Kd7 Bd4 38. Ke8 f3 39. Ncd2 Be5 40. Nxf3 Bf4 41. Kd8 Kh8
42. Kd7 Kg8 43. Ke8 Bg3 44. Ng5 Bd6 45. Nh7 Ba3 46. Nxf8 Bd6 47. Nh7 Bc5 48.
Ng5 Ba3 49. Nf7 Bb2 50. Nd8 Bc3 51. Nc6 Bb2 52. Nxe7+ Kh8 53. Kf7 Bc3 54. Nf5
Bb4 55. Nxg7 Be7 56. Nf5 Bf6 57. e7 Bxe7 58. g7+ Kh7 59. g8=Q# *
[/pgn]

have you not read this or do you not want to get it? (Ha Ha Ha :roll: :mrgreen: :roll:)

1. Qxa1 Nb3+ 2. Kc4 Nxa1 3. Kc3 Bxa5+ 4. Kb2 Kg8 5. Kxa1 Kh8 6. Kb2 Kg8 7. Kb3
Kh8 8. Kc4 Kg8 9. Kc5 Kh8 10. Kd5 Kg8 11. Kc6 Kh8 12. Kd7 Kg8 13. Ke8 h5 14.Kd7 is mate in 50

[d]N3Kbk1/4p1p1/4PpP1/b6p/8/8/5p1p/5Nbr w - - 0 1

Analysis by Stockfish-MOJO 281120:
14.Kd7 Kh8 15.Kc6 h4 16.Kd5 Bd8 17.Ke4 Kg8 18.Kf4 h3 19.Kg3 Ba5 20.Kxh3 Bd8 21.Kg3 Ba5 22.Kf4 Kh8 23.Ke4 Kg8 24.Kd4 Bd8 25.Kc5 Ba5 26.Kc6 Kh8 27.Kd7 Kg8 28.Ke8 f5 29.Kd7 Kh8 30.Kc6 Kg8 31.Kd5 Kh8 32.Ke5 Bc3+ 33.Kxf5 Bd4 34.Ke4 Ba7 35.Nc7 Kg8 36.Na6 Kh8 37.Kd5 Kg8 38.Kc6 Bd4 39.Nb8 Be5 40.Nd7 Bd6 41.Nb6 Be5 42.Kb7 Bd4 43.Nd7 Bc3 44.Kb6 Kh8 45.Nxf8 Kg8 46.Nh7 Bb4 47.Kc7 Bd6+ 48.Kd7 Bb4
+- (#50) Depth: 68/71 00:01:01 2343MN

here's the output at starting position:
Analysis by Stockfish-MOJO 281120:

1.Qxa1 Nb3+ 2.Kb4 Nxa1 3.Kc3 Bxa5+ 4.Kb2 Bd2 5.Kxa1 Bc3+ 6.Kb1 Bd2 7.Nb6 Be3 8.Nd7 Bd2 9.Ka1 Bc1 10.Nb6 Bg5 11.Kb2 Bd2 12.Ka2 Kg8 13.Kb3 Ba5 14.Nd7 f5 15.Kc2 Bb4 16.Kb2 Ba5 17.Nb8 Kh8 18.Kc2 Bc7 19.Nd7 Bd6 20.Kb1 Ba3 21.Ka1 Bc1 22.Ka2 Bg5 23.Kb3 Kg8 24.Nb8 Kh8 25.Kb2 Bd2 26.Kc2 Ba5 27.Nd7 Bb4 28.Kb3 Ba5 29.Ka4 Bc7 30.Ka3 Bg3 31.Ka2 Bf4 32.Kb2 Bg3 33.Kc3 Bf4 34.Nb6 Be3 35.Na8 Ba7 36.Kb4 Bd4 37.Kb3 Be5 38.Kc4 Bb8 39.Kb5 Ba7 40.Nc7
+- (137.72) Depth: 76/80 00:10:41 14601MN

(Analysis from peter in this thread)
peter
Posts: 3186
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2008 7:38 am
Full name: Peter Martan

Re: Maybe it's difficult for engines

Post by peter »

MTaktikos wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 10:32 am
Paloma wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 3:46 am 1. Qxa1 Nb3+ 2. Kc4 Nxa1 3. Kc3 Bxa5+ 4. Kb2 Kg8 5. Kxa1 Kh8 6. Kb2 Kg8 7. Kb3
Kh8 8. Kc4 Kg8 9. Kc5 Kh8 10. Kd5 Kg8 11. Kc6 Kh8 12. Kd7 Kg8 13. Ke8 h5 14.Kd7 is mate in 50

[d]N3Kbk1/4p1p1/4PpP1/b6p/8/8/5p1p/5Nbr w - - 0 1

Analysis by Stockfish-MOJO 281120:
14.Kd7 Kh8 15.Kc6 h4 16.Kd5 Bd8 17.Ke4 Kg8 18.Kf4 h3 19.Kg3 Ba5 20.Kxh3 Bd8 21.Kg3 Ba5 22.Kf4 Kh8 23.Ke4 Kg8 24.Kd4 Bd8 25.Kc5 Ba5 26.Kc6 Kh8 27.Kd7 Kg8 28.Ke8 f5 29.Kd7 Kh8 30.Kc6 Kg8 31.Kd5 Kh8 32.Ke5 Bc3+ 33.Kxf5 Bd4 34.Ke4 Ba7 35.Nc7 Kg8 36.Na6 Kh8 37.Kd5 Kg8 38.Kc6 Bd4 39.Nb8 Be5 40.Nd7 Bd6 41.Nb6 Be5 42.Kb7 Bd4 43.Nd7 Bc3 44.Kb6 Kh8 45.Nxf8 Kg8 46.Nh7 Bb4 47.Kc7 Bd6+ 48.Kd7 Bb4
+- (#50) Depth: 68/71 00:01:01 2343MN
Don't agree with this output.
Background idea: the Na8 has to capture on f8, therefore this Knight plays a key role for a white win. In order to draw, Black must be able to capture this piece immediately after Nc7 or Nb6.
And then, let's try a verbal description of Black's strategy:
1) If White blunders moving the Nf1, then unleash the trapped pieces and win the game
2) If White attacks the Ba5, then move Ba5-d8
3) If White attacks the Bd8, then move Bd8-a5
4) If White moves the Na8, then capture it with the Bishop on a5 or d8
5) Else move the King back and forth

A bit confused by all the Stockfish output, especially when it comes as mate announces, I am not sure if this strategy can reach a draw, but on the other hand, Black is 100% lost if he does not follow this recipe. And in light of the recipe, in the above output, Black's mistake comes immediately after losing his second pawn, it is 33... Bd4?

[d]N4b1k/4p1p1/4P1P1/5K2/8/2b5/5p1p/5Nbr b - - 0 33

The recipe requires 33... Ba5!

Can someone find from here a winning way for White, assuming that Black consequently follows the recipe above?
From there (following the output- line of MOJO SF's till 33. Kxf5, replacing ...Bd4 there with your 33...Ba5 (!?, as a matter of fact, it just makes the DTM there shorter for one move):

[d]N4b1k/4p1p1/4P1P1/b4K2/8/8/5p1p/5Nbr w - - 0 1
34.Kf4 Bb4 35.Nb6 Kg8 36.Nd7 Bc3 37.Ke4 Ba5 38.Kd5 Bc7 39.Kc6 Ba5 40.Kb7 Bb4 41.Kc7 Ba5+ 42.Kc8 Kh8 43.Nxf8 Bc3 44.Kd8 Ba5+ 45.Ke8 Kg8 46.Nh7 Bb4 47.Ng5 Ba5 48.Kxe7 Bb4+ 49.Ke8 Be1 50.Nh7 Bb4 51.e7 Kh8 52.Nf6 Ba3 53.Kf7 Bxe7 54.Kxe7 gxf6 55.Kf7 f5 56.g7+ Kh7 57.g8Q+ Kh6 58.Qg6#
+- (#25) Depth: 93/49 00:02:25 3422MN

From there onwards it's easy, as well for engines (with some Forward- Backward and or switched off nullmove- pruning) as for human player who has understood the principle of the triangle- maneuvre with the white King between b7, c7 and c8, having the Knight at d7, and after black Pawns at f- und h- line are already blocked (the have to move every time Black get's into Zugwzang again before the final maneuvre against the black free Bishop succeeds of course) or captured. One of the two possibilities get's the shorter way once according to Black's choice of moving or not- moving one of these pawns.

Before these pawns are blocked or captured, Black always has the choice of moving a pawn, or move the free black Bishop away from a5 sooner, setting the white a1- Knight free. As long as Black has these choices, White has to repeat the triangle manouvre with the King, that's including some fields towards the black Pawns as long as they are able to move, from a certain point shortest way gets capturing them, if Black decides to set the a1-Knight free with leaving a5- d8 line with the free Bishop sooner then the Pawns get captured, White can as well wait for them to get blocked.

Look at the position in this output- line after 39th move, there you see, how Black is forced by Zugzwang finally to leave the a5- field.
If you understood this one maneuvre (which I have to admit, I didn't see by myself for a while neither) you know, why the whole study is a forced win of Black's.
And then you can easily win from the very starting position against any engine and against any human player as strong or as weak as they may be and how soon or how late the engine gets the winning lines into output by itself. Give it a try, it's funny then, even if you struggled on your own a little bit now and again before, the bigger the fun gets having got the trick finally regards
:)
Peter.
MTaktikos
Posts: 59
Joined: Fri Oct 25, 2019 7:58 pm
Full name: Michael Taktikos

Re: Maybe it's difficult for engines

Post by MTaktikos »

peter wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 12:01 pm Look at the position in this output- line after 39th move, there you see, how Black is forced by Zugzwang finally to leave the a5- field.
If you understood this one maneuvre (which I have to admit, I didn't see by myself for a while neither) you know, why the whole study is a forced win of Black's.
And then you can easily win from the very starting position against any engine and against any human player as strong or as weak as they may be and how soon or how late the engine gets the winning lines into output by itself. Give it a try, it's funny then, even if you struggled on your own a little bit now and again before, the bigger the fun gets having got the trick finally regards
:)
Thank you, Peter!
Chessqueen
Posts: 5589
Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:16 am
Location: Moving
Full name: Jorge Picado

Re: Maybe it's difficult for engines

Post by Chessqueen »

Paloma wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 3:46 am
Chessqueen wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:38 am Hobacle you should try to play a few games against Tarrasch Toy Engine rated 1450, it will NOT block its pieces Ha Ha Ha :roll: :mrgreen: :roll:
are you stupid ? Your 12. Nxf4 Bxf4 13. Kxf4 is a big mistake!
exchange of free white Night against free black Bishop is WRONG

And if this one free black Bishop is exchanged against free white Night, there's no white figure left for capturing f-Bishop but the King, giving so stalemate after march of black free pawns is done.
So the white knight has to capture the f-bishop.
Paloma, por favor no llame a nadie estupido, ( Please do NOT call anybody here on this Forum Stupid ) I have NOT wasted my money training with an online chess coach from India for 2 years for nothing. Yes you are correct, but you failed to realized that that game was Autoplayed by Tarrasch Toy Engine rated 1450, but of course I know better to keep my Knight and it does NOT matter against who or what engine I played this position from move 12........ of course 12.Nxf4 ? is a blunder, so I continue with 12. Nb6 as White, bring Carlsen if you want I will bet you $5,000 that I can beat him with white since the Black Bishop and the Black Rook are useless they are in jail guarded and blocked by its own pawns f2 and h2 I do not even need to pick any further pawns, all that I have to do is to use my extra free knight and King as I demonstrated against Hermman rated around 2600+, but it does NOT matter not even Stockfish of the future with the most powerful computer that will be available in the next 30 years can win such lost position with Black. Here is the the continuation that I chose after 12. Nb6! and the rest is very easy just need to get my King on e8! and if the Bishop remain on a5 all that I have to do is temporarily relocate my Knight from d7 and take my King to e8 via d7, and move my Knight back to d7 and after I win the Black Bishop on f8 the game is pretty much over :roll:

[pgn][Event "Three Blocked Black Pieces"]
[Site "MININT-UB2PIMJ"]
[Date "2021.04.06"]
[Round "?"]
[White "ChessQueen"]
[Black "Hermann28_64"]
[Result "1-0"]
[BlackElo "2600"]
[Time "10:06:40"]
[WhiteElo "2000"]
[TimeControl "600+1"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "5bk1/4p1p1/3bP1P1/3N4/4Kp2/7p/5p1p/5Nbr w - - 0 1"]
[Termination "normal"]
[PlyCount "47"]
[WhiteType "human"]
[BlackType "program"]

1. Nb6 Bc7 {(Bd6-c7 Nb6-d5 Bc7-b8 Nd5xf4 Bb8-d6 Nf4xh3 Bd6-b4 Ke4-f3
Bb4-c3) +6.65/22 36} 2. Nd7 Bd8 {(Bc7-d8 Ke4xf4 Bd8-c7+ Kf4-f3 Bc7-d6)
+6.55/26 12} 3. Kd5 Ba5 {(Bd8-a5 Kd5-e5 Ba5-d2 Ke5-d5 Bd2-c1 Kd5-e4 Bc1-e3
Ke4-f3 Be3-d4 Kf3xf4 Kg8-h8 Kf4-f3 Bd4-b6 Nd7xf8 Kh8-g8 Nf8-d7 Bb6-d4
Kf3-f4 Bd4-b2 Kf4-e4 Bb2-c1 Ke4-f3 Kg8-h8 Nd7-f8 Kh8-g8 Nf8-d7 Kg8-h8)
+6.55/26 64} 4. Nb8 Bb4 {(Ba5-b4 Nb8-d7 Bb4-e1 Kd5-e5 Be1-c3+ Ke5xf4 Kg8-h8
Nd7xf8 Bc3-b2 Kf4-e4 Bb2-c1 Ke4-f3 Bc1-g5 Nf8-h7 Bg5-h6 Nh7-f8) +6.55/21
48} 5. Kc6 Bc3 {(Bb4-c3 Kc6-d5 Bc3-d2 Nb8-d7 Bd2-c1 Kd5-e4 Bc1-e3 Ke4-f3
Be3-d4 Kf3xf4 Bd4-c3) +6.53/31 15} 6. Nd7 Ba5 {(Bc3-a5 Kc6-b7 Kg8-h8 Nd7-e5
f4-f3 Ne5-d7 Ba5-d2 Kb7-c6 Bd2-c1 Kc6-d5 Kh8-g8 Nd7-b8 Kg8-h8 Nb8-d7
Kh8-g8) +6.53/25 50} 7. Kb7 Be1 {(Ba5-e1 Nd7-b8 f4-f3 Kb7-c6 Kg8-h8 Kc6-d5
Kh8-g8 Nb8-d7 Kg8-h8 Kd5-e4 Kh8-g8 Ke4-d5 Kg8-h8) +6.53/18 13} 8. Kc8 Bd2
{(Be1-d2 Kc8-c7 Bd2-b4 Kc7-b7 Bb4-a5 Nd7-b8) +6.53/22 7} 9. Kd8 Ba5+
{(Bd2-a5+ Kd8-c8 Ba5-b4 Kc8-b7 Bb4-a5 Nd7-b8) +6.53/33 42} 10. Ke8 Be1
{(Ba5-e1 Nd7xf8 Be1-b4) 0.00/21 7} 11. Nxf8 Ba5 {(Be1-a5 Nf8-d7 Ba5-c7
Ke8xe7) -M13/22 9} 12. Nd7 Bc7 {(Ba5-c7 Ke8xe7) -M12/22 9} 13. Kxe7 f3
{(f4-f3 Nd7-f8 Kg8-h8 Nf8-d7 Kh8-g8 Nd7-f8) -M11/21 8} 14. Nf8 Bb6 {(Bc7-b6
Nf8-d7 Bb6-c7 Nd7-f8 Kg8-h8) -M10/19 8} 15. Kd7 Bc5 {(Bb6-c5 Nf8-h7 Kg8-h8
e6-e7 Bc5xe7) -M9/20 0 Black resigns} 16. e7 Bxe7 {(Bc5xe7 Kd7xe7 Kg8-h8
Nf8-d7 Kh8-g8 Nd7-e5 Kg8-h8 Ne5-d7 Kh8-g8) -M8/18 0 Black resigns} 17. Kxe7
Kh8 {(Kg8-h8 Nf8-d7 Kh8-g8 Nd7-e5 Kg8-h8 Ne5-d7 Kh8-g8) +8.12/1 0} 18. Nd7
Kg8 {(Kh8-g8 Nd7-e5 Kg8-h8 Ne5-d7 Kh8-g8) +7.94/1} 19. Ke8 Kh8 {(Kg8-h8
Ke8-e7 Kh8-g8 Nd7-e5 Kg8-h8 Ne5-d7 Kh8-g8) +8.11/1 0} 20. Nf6 gxf6 21. Kf7
f5 {(f6-f5 g6-g7+ Kh8-h7 g7-g8Q+ Kh7-h6) +8.30/1} 22. g7+ Kh7 {(Kh8-h7
g7-g8Q+ Kh7-h6) -M2/1} 23. g8=Q+ Kh6 {(Kh7-h6) -M1/1} 24. Qg6# 1-0[/pgn]
Who is 17 years old GM Gukesh 2nd at the Candidate in Toronto?
https://indianexpress.com/article/sport ... t-9281394/
Paloma
Posts: 1167
Joined: Thu Dec 25, 2008 9:07 pm
Full name: Herbert L

Re: Maybe it's difficult for engines

Post by Paloma »

peter wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 12:01 pm ....
If you understood this one maneuvre (which I have to admit, I didn't see by myself for a while neither) you know, why the whole study is a forced win of Black's.
...
??
forced win for White !