Just to emphasize the Point, watch FREE Lc0 using FREE Sergio NN THRASH Commercial Fat Fritz with BLACK....
[pgn][Event "Rated game, 7m+3s"]
[Site "Engine Room"]
[Date "2019.12.31"]
[Round "?"]
[White "Pestif"]
[Black "Shrapnel, Lc0 v0.23.1+git.683"]
[Result "0-1"]
[ECO "B86"]
[WhiteElo "2453"]
[BlackElo "2524"]
[Annotator "-1.07;-0.02"]
[PlyCount "146"]
[EventDate "2019.12.31"]
[SourceTitle "playchess.com"]
[TimeControl "420+3"]
{Fat Fritz (in lc0) cuda (2 cores): 17.6 plies; 68kN/s AMD Ryzen 7 2700X
Eight-Core Processor 3700MHz, (8 cores, 16 threads), Perfect2019.ctg,
32768 MB} 1. e4 {B 0} c5 {B 0} 2. Nf3 {B 0} d6 {B 0} 3. d4 {B 0} cxd4 {B 0} 4.
Nxd4 {B 0} Nf6 {B 0} 5. Nc3 {B 0} a6 {B 0} 6. Bc4 {B 0} e6 {B 0} 7. Bb3 {B 0}
Nbd7 {B 0} 8. Bg5 {B 0} Nc5 {-0.02/12 11} 9. f4 {B 0 (0-0)} Be7 {-0.13/13 9}
10. Qf3 {B 0} Qc7 {-0.15/14 9} 11. O-O-O {B 0} b5 {-0.22/15 12} 12. Bxf6 {
B 0 (Rhe1)} Bxf6 {-1.14/14 13} 13. g4 {-1.07/14 8} b4 {-1.13/17 9} 14. Na4 {
-1.12/18 3} O-O {-1.18/17 4} 15. g5 {-1.16/19 5} Be7 {-1.20/16 5} 16. Rhg1 {
-1.18/20 8 (Rhe1)} Bd7 {-1.29/17 17} 17. f5 {-1.14/21 0} Bxa4 {-1.33/18 6} 18.
Bxa4 {-1.14/21 0} Nxa4 {-1.30/18 6} 19. f6 {-1.11/18 0} Rac8 {-1.38/16 13} 20.
fxe7 {-1.12/20 5} Qxe7 {-1.35/15 7} 21. h4 {-1.10/18 11} Qc7 {-1.35/15 1 (Nc5)}
22. Rg2 {-1.04/16 42 (Qg2)} Qa5 {-1.45/14 25} 23. Kb1 {-1.07/21 11 (h5)} Rc4 {
-1.65/13 29} 24. Qb3 {-1.19/19 4 (Qd3)} Rfc8 {-1.46/17 21 (d5)} 25. h5 {
-1.20/20 39} Rc3 {-1.60/22 0} 26. bxc3 {-1.23/27 18} Rxc3 {-1.68/22 1} 27. Ne2
{-1.22/26 8} Rxb3+ {-1.67/19 0} 28. axb3 {-1.17/24 9} Nc5 {-1.69/17 0} 29. Rg4
{-1.16/20 1} g6 {-1.75/18 14 (Qc7)} 30. hxg6 {-1.70/18 79 (Rxd6)} hxg6 {
-1.87/18 1} 31. Rxd6 {-1.69/15 0} Nb7 {-1.87/18 10} 32. Rd7 {-1.80/18 31 (Rd3)}
Qb5 {-1.97/21 43} 33. Rd3 {-1.86/19 0} Nc5 {-1.97/24 11 (Qc5)} 34. Rd8+ {
-1.70/16 14} Kg7 {-1.97/23 1} 35. Nc1 {-1.84/18 27 (Rh4)} Qb6 {-2.22/14 36} 36.
Rd1 {-1.89/18 0} e5 {-2.25/16 12 (Qb7)} 37. Rd5 {-2.02/15 22 (Nd3)} Qe6 {
-2.46/14 25} 38. Rxc5 {-2.14/17 0} Qxg4 {-2.45/14 8} 39. Rxe5 {-2.15/16 0} Qg1
{-2.51/13 8 (Qd1)} 40. Rd5 {-2.25/14 51 (Ra5)} Qe3 {-2.64/13 9} 41. Nd3 {
-2.31/15 10} Qxe4 {-2.69/12 10} 42. Re5 {-2.34/13 8} Qd4 {-2.82/11 22} 43. Rc5
{-2.38/13 2} Qd6 {-2.89/11 10} 44. Ra5 {-2.42/13 12 (Rc4)} Qb6 {-3.14/10 20}
45. Rc5 {-2.45/13 0} f5 {-3.26/10 20 (a5)} 46. gxf6+ {-2.42/13 17} Kxf6 {
-3.23/10 0} 47. Rc4 {-2.44/13 9 (Nf2)} a5 {-3.51/9 15} 48. Rf4+ {-2.46/14 11
(Rc5)} Kg5 {-3.43/9 33 (Kg7)} 49. Rc4 {-2.20/12 19 (Re4)} Kh5 {-3.77/9 4 (Qg1+)
} 50. Nf4+ {-2.15/14 12 (Rc5+)} Kh6 {-4.03/9 6} 51. Nxg6 {-2.17/15 1 (Nd3)}
Kxg6 {-5.29/7 11 (Qg1+)} 52. Rg4+ {-1.36/12 14 (Kb2)} Kf5 {-4.77/7 14 (Kf7)}
53. Rg3 {-1.49/18 2 (Rh4)} Ke4 {-4.69/7 8 (Qf2)} 54. Rd3 {-1.65/13 15 (Rg5)}
Qb5 {-4.84/7 6 (Qf6)} 55. Rd2 {-1.47/11 11 (Rg3)} Ke3 {-5.30/7 6 (Kf3)} 56. Kc1
{-2.13/12 18 (Rd6)} Qe5 {-7.17/7 4 (Qg5)} 57. Rd3+ {-2.54/12 3} Ke2 {-6.16/7 4
(Ke4)} 58. Rd2+ {-2.18/14 5 (Kb1)} Ke1 {-6.40/8 7 (Ke3)} 59. Rd1+ {-2.09/16 5}
Kf2 {-5.14/8 3 (Ke2)} 60. Rd2+ {-2.14/15 5 (Kb1)} Kf1 {-4.88/9 9 (Ke3)} 61.
Rd1+ {-2.09/16 5} Ke2 {-4.41/9 5 (Kf2)} 62. Rd2+ {-2.48/15 5} Ke3 {-4.02/9 4}
63. Rd3+ {-2.74/14 0} Ke4 {-3.93/8 1} 64. Rh3 {-2.85/13 2 (Kb1)} a4 {-7.99/6 5
(Qa1+)} 65. bxa4 {-1.54/13 7 (Kd2)} Qa1+ {-128.00/2 3} 66. Kd2 {-1.57/13 0}
Qxa4 {-128.00/2 6 (Kd5)} 67. Rd3 {-1.21/13 8} Qa7 {-6/1 0 (Qa1)} 68. Kc1 {
-1.09/12 7} Qa1+ {-5/1 0 (Qa2)} 69. Kd2 {-1.10/14 0} Qg1 {-4/1 0 (Qb1)} 70. Rb3
{-0.97/13 6} Qg5+ {-3/1 0 (Qh1)} 71. Kd1 {-128.00/2 6} Qd5+ {-2/1 0 (Qh6)} 72.
Kc1 {-128.00/2 6} Qxb3 {-2/1 0 (Qd4)} 73. cxb3 {-1/0 0} Kd3 {-4/1 0 Pestif,Fat
Fritz (in lc0) c resigns} 0-1[/pgn]
Best Nets for Lc0 Page
Moderators: hgm, Rebel, chrisw
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Re: Best Nets for Lc0 Page
i7 5960X @ 4.1 Ghz, 64 GB G.Skill RipJaws RAM, Twin Asus ROG Strix OC 11 GB Geforce 2080 Tis
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Re: Best Nets for Lc0 Page
Sergio 1705 net is out. Strong!!
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- Full name: Kai Laskos
Re: Best Nets for Lc0 Page
I would say that Sergio's 256x20b net 1541 net is the strongest around for my OC-ed RTX 2070 GPU on any reasonable TC, even LTC.
Here is what I get with the BigNets:
Code: Select all
Games at 30'' + 0.3''
SV 384x30b
Rank Name Elo +/- Games Score Draws
1 1573 36 19 800 55.1% 38.3%
2 1538 26 19 800 53.8% 38.3%
3 1530 -62 20 800 41.1% 35.0%
Finished match
Code: Select all
Games at 4 min + 2.4 s
Score of Sergio_384x30_1573 vs Sergio_256x20_1467: 24 - 59 - 117 [0.412]
Elo difference: -61.4 +/- 30.8, LOS: 0.0 %, DrawRatio: 58.5 %
200 of 200 games finished.
And today came the new Sergio_256x20_1541 net which again improves sensibly on 1467:
Code: Select all
1000 nodes per move:
Score of 1541 vs 1467: 611 - 541 - 848 [0.517] 2000
Elo difference: 12.17 +/- 11.55
Finished match
So, all in all, I would take for my RTX GPU Sergio's SV_256x20_1541 at any time control (aside longish analysis, where BigNet 1705 is probably the best).
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- Full name: Kai Laskos
Re: Best Nets for Lc0 Page
Just finished the test of SV 1541 against vanilla T40 net 42850, which ruled supreme for some time in the past.Laskos wrote: ↑Wed Jan 01, 2020 7:48 pmI would say that Sergio's 256x20b net 1541 net is the strongest around for my OC-ed RTX 2070 GPU on any reasonable TC, even LTC.
Here is what I get with the BigNets:
And:Code: Select all
Games at 30'' + 0.3'' SV 384x30b Rank Name Elo +/- Games Score Draws 1 1573 36 19 800 55.1% 38.3% 2 1538 26 19 800 53.8% 38.3% 3 1530 -62 20 800 41.1% 35.0% Finished match
In the second one, the time control is already real Blitz. I don't think that the SV BigNet scales so well to catch-up with the 256x20b SV net even to LTC on my GPU, 60 Elo points are too much.Code: Select all
Games at 4 min + 2.4 s Score of Sergio_384x30_1573 vs Sergio_256x20_1467: 24 - 59 - 117 [0.412] Elo difference: -61.4 +/- 30.8, LOS: 0.0 %, DrawRatio: 58.5 % 200 of 200 games finished.
And today came the new Sergio_256x20_1541 net which again improves sensibly on 1467:
The real error margins are a factor of 1.4 smaller than the shown ones because a I used unbalanced positions side-and-reversed.Code: Select all
1000 nodes per move: Score of 1541 vs 1467: 611 - 541 - 848 [0.517] 2000 Elo difference: 12.17 +/- 11.55 Finished match
So, all in all, I would take for my RTX GPU Sergio's SV_256x20_1541 at any time control (aside longish analysis, where BigNet 1705 is probably the best).
Code: Select all
Games in 30'' + 0.3''
Score of SV_256x20_1541 vs 42850: 257 - 166 - 377 [0.557] 800
Elo difference: 39.69 +/- 17.51
Finished match
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Re: Best Nets for Lc0 Page
The Sergio nets are very very good, On an RTX 2060 Super , the latest Sergio net is at least about equal ( maybe better) to the latest Komodo running on the Threadripper with all 64 threads.
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Re: Best Nets for Lc0 Page
The one point you did not mention is the configuration of the Lc0 net in the GUI. The default settings are awful and more so for the bigger nets. In my current testing with the T61xxx nets. With a few simple tweaks this net series is testing 50 to 60 elo better then default settings. And doing this at fast time controls against the Best A/B engines.AdminX wrote: ↑Mon Dec 23, 2019 11:23 pm "There is no single "best net" for Leela but there a few worth recommending for various purposes. The most important consideration in choosing a net is picking the right size for your hardware and time controls (TC). In general, if you have a weak GPU (or no GPU at all) and you want to only spend milliseconds per move, then you want a smaller net that evaluates positions more quickly, i.e. higher NPS (nodes per second). On the other hand, if you have an RTX card (or several) and you want to run an analysis on a single move for hours at a time, then the quality of the evaluation is more important than the speed and a larger (but slower) net is probably going to work best."
https://github.com/LeelaChessZero/lc0/w ... ts-for-Lc0
"The worst thing that can happen to a forum is a running wild attacking moderator(HGM) who is not corrected by the community." - Ed Schröder
But my words like silent raindrops fell. And echoed in the wells of silence.
But my words like silent raindrops fell. And echoed in the wells of silence.
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Re: Best Nets for Lc0 Page
Share your Settings please.
i7 5960X @ 4.1 Ghz, 64 GB G.Skill RipJaws RAM, Twin Asus ROG Strix OC 11 GB Geforce 2080 Tis
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Re: Best Nets for Lc0 Page
There is only one problem: Using very short time control it is very far from the practical games. A test is useful only if the circumstances of the test are the same as in the case of normal games. It is a more important viewpoint than getting a mathematically exact but practically useless Elo. If somebody stick to gain relative exact Elo one should not regret the time for getting a practically useful result.mwyoung wrote: ↑Thu Jan 02, 2020 3:41 am ...
The default settings are awful and more so for the bigger nets. In my current testing with the T61xxx nets. With a few simple tweaks this net series is testing 50 to 60 elo better then default settings. And doing this at fast time controls against the Best A/B engines.
It is also an important viewpoint the connection between power of GPU and the dimension of net.
If somebody would like to get the real knowledge what is in a big net that one need a GPU with higher power.
Obviously as the dimension of a net is bigger as it needs more time and/or more faster GPU to scan its content.
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Re: Best Nets for Lc0 Page
I agree, and that is why I test realistic time controls that would be useful. From 5s a move to 5m a move.corres wrote: ↑Thu Jan 02, 2020 8:48 amThere is only one problem: Using very short time control it is very far from the practical games. A test is useful only if the circumstances of the test are the same as in the case of normal games. It is a more important viewpoint than getting a mathematically exact but practically useless Elo. If somebody stick to gain relative exact Elo one should not regret the time for getting a practically useful result.mwyoung wrote: ↑Thu Jan 02, 2020 3:41 am ...
The default settings are awful and more so for the bigger nets. In my current testing with the T61xxx nets. With a few simple tweaks this net series is testing 50 to 60 elo better then default settings. And doing this at fast time controls against the Best A/B engines.
It is also an important viewpoint the connection between power of GPU and the dimension of net.
If somebody would like to get the real knowledge what is in a big net that one need a GPU with higher power.
Obviously as the dimension of a net is bigger as it needs more time and/or more faster GPU to scan its content.
I will say a higher power gpu is nice. But if you are running a bad configuration you are wasting a lot of that horse power.
"The worst thing that can happen to a forum is a running wild attacking moderator(HGM) who is not corrected by the community." - Ed Schröder
But my words like silent raindrops fell. And echoed in the wells of silence.
But my words like silent raindrops fell. And echoed in the wells of silence.