Page 1 of 10

Nakamura vs. Komodo

Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2016 6:59 am
by lkaufman
The long-awaited handicap clash between Hikaru Nakamura (World number 5 in classical chess, number 2 in rapid chess, and number 1 in blitz) and Komodo will take place on chess.com tv Jan. 6 and 7, games at 11 a.m. and 4 p.m. Eastern Standard time each day. The time limits are our usual 45' + 15". Four different handicaps.
1. "pawn and move", meaning Komodo plays Black with no f7 pawn, the worst one to be missing.
2. "pawn odds", meaning Komodo plays White with no f2 pawn.
3. "Exchange odds", meaning White removes a1 rook, Black removes b8 knight, a8 rook moved to b8, Komodo plays White.
4. "Four move odds", meaning White plays 1.e4,2.d4,3Nf3 and it's still White (Nakamura) to move.

Nakamura is not only a Candidate for World Champion this year and widely considered to be the world's best blitz player, but has huge experience playing computers countless blitz games. Probably only Carlsen would have better chances against Komodo, and even that isn't clear. Nakamura is especially known for fighting spirit, so I wouldn't expect him just to make quick repetition draws. He will receive three times as much money for a win as for a draw so he also has financial incentive to try to win.

So far no one has won even a single game off of Komodo at any handicap less than two nonedge pawns or f7 and three moves, but Nakamura is nearly a class stronger than the top past opponents. Can Komodo give these handicaps to a title contender?

Re: Nakamura vs. Komodo

Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2016 7:50 am
by Laskos
lkaufman wrote:The long-awaited handicap clash between Hikaru Nakamura (World number 5 in classical chess, number 2 in rapid chess, and number 1 in blitz) and Komodo will take place on chess.com tv Jan. 6 and 7, games at 11 a.m. and 4 p.m. Eastern Standard time each day. The time limits are our usual 45' + 15". Four different handicaps.
1. "pawn and move", meaning Komodo plays Black with no f7 pawn, the worst one to be missing.
2. "pawn odds", meaning Komodo plays White with no f2 pawn.
3. "Exchange odds", meaning White removes a1 rook, Black removes b8 knight, a8 rook moved to b8, Komodo plays White.
4. "Four move odds", meaning White plays 1.e4,2.d4,3Nf3 and it's still White (Nakamura) to move.

Nakamura is not only a Candidate for World Champion this year and widely considered to be the world's best blitz player, but has huge experience playing computers countless blitz games. Probably only Carlsen would have better chances against Komodo, and even that isn't clear. Nakamura is especially known for fighting spirit, so I wouldn't expect him just to make quick repetition draws. He will receive three times as much money for a win as for a draw so he also has financial incentive to try to win.

So far no one has won even a single game off of Komodo at any handicap less than two nonedge pawns or f7 and three moves, but Nakamura is nearly a class stronger than the top past opponents. Can Komodo give these handicaps to a title contender?
Wow, thanks Larry, that will be a feast. I will go with 2.5/4 for Komodo.

Re: Nakamura vs. Komodo

Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2016 8:03 am
by APassionForCriminalJustic
lkaufman wrote:The long-awaited handicap clash between Hikaru Nakamura (World number 5 in classical chess, number 2 in rapid chess, and number 1 in blitz) and Komodo will take place on chess.com tv Jan. 6 and 7, games at 11 a.m. and 4 p.m. Eastern Standard time each day. The time limits are our usual 45' + 15". Four different handicaps.
1. "pawn and move", meaning Komodo plays Black with no f7 pawn, the worst one to be missing.
2. "pawn odds", meaning Komodo plays White with no f2 pawn.
3. "Exchange odds", meaning White removes a1 rook, Black removes b8 knight, a8 rook moved to b8, Komodo plays White.
4. "Four move odds", meaning White plays 1.e4,2.d4,3Nf3 and it's still White (Nakamura) to move.

Nakamura is not only a Candidate for World Champion this year and widely considered to be the world's best blitz player, but has huge experience playing computers countless blitz games. Probably only Carlsen would have better chances against Komodo, and even that isn't clear. Nakamura is especially known for fighting spirit, so I wouldn't expect him just to make quick repetition draws. He will receive three times as much money for a win as for a draw so he also has financial incentive to try to win.

So far no one has won even a single game off of Komodo at any handicap less than two nonedge pawns or f7 and three moves, but Nakamura is nearly a class stronger than the top past opponents. Can Komodo give these handicaps to a title contender?
Naka is still just a man. Wouldn't expect much more from him as opposed to other strong grandmasters.

Re: Nakamura vs. Komodo

Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2016 10:13 am
by Uri Blass
lkaufman wrote:The long-awaited handicap clash between Hikaru Nakamura (World number 5 in classical chess, number 2 in rapid chess, and number 1 in blitz) and Komodo will take place on chess.com tv Jan. 6 and 7, games at 11 a.m. and 4 p.m. Eastern Standard time each day. The time limits are our usual 45' + 15". Four different handicaps.
1. "pawn and move", meaning Komodo plays Black with no f7 pawn, the worst one to be missing.
2. "pawn odds", meaning Komodo plays White with no f2 pawn.
3. "Exchange odds", meaning White removes a1 rook, Black removes b8 knight, a8 rook moved to b8, Komodo plays White.
4. "Four move odds", meaning White plays 1.e4,2.d4,3Nf3 and it's still White (Nakamura) to move.

Nakamura is not only a Candidate for World Champion this year and widely considered to be the world's best blitz player, but has huge experience playing computers countless blitz games. Probably only Carlsen would have better chances against Komodo, and even that isn't clear. Nakamura is especially known for fighting spirit, so I wouldn't expect him just to make quick repetition draws. He will receive three times as much money for a win as for a draw so he also has financial incentive to try to win.

So far no one has won even a single game off of Komodo at any handicap less than two nonedge pawns or f7 and three moves, but Nakamura is nearly a class stronger than the top past opponents. Can Komodo give these handicaps to a title contender?
45+15 is not blitz and is something between rapid and standard.
Rating is also based on playing against humans.

I can add that I did not check if nakamura is better than other top human players in winning from better positions.

I think that it is a different type of game than normal chess.
A player can be very strong in winning won positions but not so strong in getting them from the opening position.

Maybe it is a good idea to analyze human games to find who performs the best against humans from positions that are evaluated by engines as 0.9-1.1 pawn advantage.

Re: Nakamura vs. Komodo

Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2016 7:52 pm
by duncan
lkaufman wrote:The long-awaited handicap clash between Hikaru Nakamura (World number 5 in classical chess, number 2 in rapid chess, and number 1 in blitz) and Komodo will take place on chess.com tv Jan. 6 and 7, games at 11 a.m. and 4 p.m. Eastern Standard time each day. The time limits are our usual 45' + 15". Four different handicaps.
1. "pawn and move", meaning Komodo plays Black with no f7 pawn, the worst one to be missing.
2. "pawn odds", meaning Komodo plays White with no f2 pawn.
3. "Exchange odds", meaning White removes a1 rook, Black removes b8 knight, a8 rook moved to b8, Komodo plays White.
4. "Four move odds", meaning White plays 1.e4,2.d4,3Nf3 and it's still White (Nakamura) to move.

Nakamura is not only a Candidate for World Champion this year and widely considered to be the world's best blitz player, but has huge experience playing computers countless blitz games. Probably only Carlsen would have better chances against Komodo, and even that isn't clear. Nakamura is especially known for fighting spirit, so I wouldn't expect him just to make quick repetition draws. He will receive three times as much money for a win as for a draw so he also has financial incentive to try to win.

So far no one has won even a single game off of Komodo at any handicap less than two nonedge pawns or f7 and three moves, but Nakamura is nearly a class stronger than the top past opponents. Can Komodo give these handicaps to a title contender?


if komodo wins which I believe it will, it may be another historic moment in the fight of man vs machine. any journalists here ?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p00nftbx

Re: Nakamura vs. Komodo

Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2016 8:03 pm
by JJJ
Yeah, that's maybe the best player ever to play these handicap match, but I think these handicap are very small. Nakamura will play for the win of course and could get some draw.

But at these handicap, I see no single win possible for now for him, but I m not sure about the 4 move handicap yet.

So Komodo could Score 3 or 3,5 easy with one ore two draw at best for Nakamura.

Re: Nakamura vs. Komodo

Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2016 8:07 pm
by JJJ
Still, I m hoping to be wrong and expect a much better preparation for Nakamura that others players who tried their shot against the reptile :)

Re: Nakamura vs. Komodo

Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2016 8:14 pm
by Graham Banks
I've bucked the trend and gone for Nakamura by 2.5-1.5.

I think he should hold a draw in the first three games and win the fourth game.

Time trouble will be his biggest enemy though.

Re: Nakamura vs. Komodo

Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2016 10:03 pm
by Uri Blass
JJJ wrote:Yeah, that's maybe the best player ever to play these handicap match, but I think these handicap are very small. Nakamura will play for the win of course and could get some draw.

But at these handicap, I see no single win possible for now for him, but I m not sure about the 4 move handicap yet.

So Komodo could Score 3 or 3,5 easy with one ore two draw at best for Nakamura.
I do not agree that the handicap is very small.

f7 pawn is not a very small handicap and same for 4 moves handicap or exchange handicap.

I wonder what happen with other programs with the same type of match with the same positions and the same time control against Komodo.

Re: Nakamura vs. Komodo

Posted: Tue Jan 05, 2016 4:14 pm
by overlord
Larry, why don´t you offer Nakamura to play completly different odd match? From my point of view it is more iteresting to see normal chess, but with také back odds (let´s say that Nakamura can take back five moves). You might be very surprised how much it improves human play.