Nakamura vs. Komodo

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How will Komodo score in 4 handicap games with Nakamura?

Poll ended at Wed Jan 06, 2016 6:59 am

Half a point or zero.
0
No votes
one point.
0
No votes
1.5 points.
3
16%
two points.
3
16%
2.5 points.
6
32%
three points.
7
37%
3.5 or 4 points.
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 19

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Leto
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Re: Nakamura vs. Komodo

Post by Leto » Thu Jan 07, 2016 12:05 am

Jesse Gersenson wrote:4-move odds is going to be murder.
For which side?

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Graham Banks
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Re: Nakamura vs. Komodo

Post by Graham Banks » Thu Jan 07, 2016 12:24 am

Leto wrote:So how do you think Nakamura will do on the last two games which will be exchange odds and four move odds?
I'll stick with Nakamura salvaging a draw in game 3 and winning game 4. :)
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Laskos
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Re: Nakamura vs. Komodo

Post by Laskos » Thu Jan 07, 2016 12:46 am

Graham Banks wrote:
Leto wrote:So how do you think Nakamura will do on the last two games which will be exchange odds and four move odds?
I'll stick with Nakamura salvaging a draw in game 3 and winning game 4. :)
It seems to me that game 4 (4 move handicap) is the trickiest for Naka. One has to be sharp to materialize the opening advantage. I don't remember if this was played before, but I believe in this position Naka cannot sit and play waiting moves, trade material and go to a won endgame. Maybe he will find it difficult to go even to a drawn endgame. I remember when simulating these handicaps that the rule of thumb would be that for human against computer "material odds beat positional odds" (for the same nominal value of odds).

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lucasart
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Re: Nakamura vs. Komodo

Post by lucasart » Thu Jan 07, 2016 1:59 am

Jesse Gersenson wrote:4-move odds is going to be murder.
With 4 move odds, even I can murder Komodo: e4 Qf3 Bc5 Qxf7#.
Theory and practice sometimes clash. And when that happens, theory loses. Every single time.

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Graham Banks
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Re: Nakamura vs. Komodo

Post by Graham Banks » Thu Jan 07, 2016 2:25 am

lucasart wrote:
Jesse Gersenson wrote:4-move odds is going to be murder.
With 4 move odds, even I can murder Komodo: e4 Qf3 Bc5 Qxf7#.
I think the restriction is that no piece can cross the 4th rank in the first four moves. :wink:
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lkaufman
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Re: Nakamura vs. Komodo

Post by lkaufman » Thu Jan 07, 2016 3:09 am

Graham Banks wrote:
lucasart wrote:
Jesse Gersenson wrote:4-move odds is going to be murder.
With 4 move odds, even I can murder Komodo: e4 Qf3 Bc5 Qxf7#.
I think the restriction is that no piece can cross the 4th rank in the first four moves. :wink:

Chess.com wanted a specific starting position, so we went with 1.e4,2d4, and 3Nf3, with White to move freely for the fourth move.
Komodo rules!

APassionForCriminalJustic
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Re: Nakamura vs. Komodo

Post by APassionForCriminalJustic » Thu Jan 07, 2016 3:42 am

JJJ wrote:no clue about four move odds.
exchange could be a draw also. tough to get a win. It's just rook against knight, probably easy to draw for Komodo.
Komodo will certainly win at least one of these next two matches... a rook versus knight advantage isn't nearly the handicap that Naka needs. No different than four first moves... that advantage can evaporate quickly. Quite frankly Naka is fortunate that he didn't lose in the first game... f7 odds.

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Re: Nakamura vs. Komodo

Post by lkaufman » Thu Jan 07, 2016 4:30 am

APassionForCriminalJustic wrote:
JJJ wrote:no clue about four move odds.
exchange could be a draw also. tough to get a win. It's just rook against knight, probably easy to draw for Komodo.
Komodo will certainly win at least one of these next two matches... a rook versus knight advantage isn't nearly the handicap that Naka needs. No different than four first moves... that advantage can evaporate quickly. Quite frankly Naka is fortunate that he didn't lose in the first game... f7 odds.
In my opinion, the Exchange handicap is a bit larger than the "f" pawn assuming the same color for the odds-giver in each game. If I'm right then the game three handicap in in betwee the handicaps of the first two games. But I'm a bit worried because Naka wasted much of his handicap in the opening of the first game, and he probably won't do that this time.
Komodo rules!

Jesse Gersenson
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Re: Nakamura vs. Komodo

Post by Jesse Gersenson » Thu Jan 07, 2016 7:15 am

lkaufman wrote: [at pawn and move]...Naka wasted much of his handicap in the opening of the first game[/snip]
Larry, you'd said something similar about Movsesian and his pawn and move openings. M's response was that he was trying to get the types of positions he wanted to play against the machine.

Have any of Komodo's opponents played pawn and move without 'wasting' their opening advantage?

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Re: Nakamura vs. Komodo

Post by Jesse Gersenson » Thu Jan 07, 2016 8:07 am

lucasart wrote:
Jesse Gersenson wrote:4-move odds is going to be murder.
With 4 move odds, even I can murder Komodo: e4 Qf3 Bc5 Qxf7#.
Mate?! That's not mate. 4... Kxf7! and White's (again) lost his opening advantage.
Leto Atreides wrote:For which side?
That's my way of saying 'the game will not end in a draw.'

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