Initial position -x pieces for black

Discussion of anything and everything relating to chess playing software and machines.

Moderators: hgm, Rebel, chrisw

fastgm
Posts: 818
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 6:57 pm

Initial position -x pieces for black

Post by fastgm »

The following 10 positions I have analyzed intensively with different engines during the past few months.
I have saved many analyzes for these positions. So hopefully I can answer one or the other question.

The positions with two black minor pieces are currently the maximum feasible with current hardware and software.
And that only with analyzes lasting for days.

Position No. 1

[d]4k3/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1
Mate in 6 moves

+M8 1.f3 Kd8 2.d4 Kd7 3.Bf4 Ke7 4.Qd3 Kd8 5.Qh7 Ke8 6.Bc7 Kf8 7.Bd6+ Ke8 8.Qe7+
+M8 1.c4 Ke7 2.e4 Kd6 3.c5+ Kxc5 4.Qh5+ Kd6 5.Qf7 Kc6 6.d4 Kb6 7.Qd7 Ka5 8.Qb5+
+M8 1.Nf3 Kd8 2.e4 Kc8 3.Ne5 Kc7 4.Qg4 Kd6 5.Qg6+ Ke7 6.Ba6 Kd8 7.Qd6+ Ke8 8.Bb5+
+M8 1.d3 Kd7 2.e4 Kd6 3.Qg4 Kc7 4.Qf4+ Kb7 5.Qf7+ Kb8 6.d4 Ka8 7.Ba6 Kb8 8.Qb7+
+M8 1.f4 Kd8 2.e3 Kd7 3.Bb5+ Kd8 4.Qg4 Kc7 5.Qd7+ Kb6 6.Qc6+ Ka5 7.d4 Kb4 8.Bd2+
+M8 1.g4 Kd7 2.e3 Kc8 3.Qf3 Kd7 4.Qb7+ Ke8 5.Bb5+ Kf8 6.Bc4 Ke8 7.Be6 Kf8 8.Qf7+
+M7 1.Nh3 Kd8 2.e4 Ke7 3.Qg4 Kf6 4.Ng5 Kg6 5.Qe6+ Kh5 6.d4 Kh4 7.Qh3+
+M7 1.a3 Kd8 2.e4 Ke7 3.Qg4 Kf7 4.Qd7+ Kg8 5.d4 Kh8 6.Bh6 Kg8 7.Qg7+
+M7 1.a4 Kf7 2.e4 Ke6 3.Qg4+ Kf6 4.Qd7 Kg6 5.d4 Kf6 6.Bc4 Kg6 7.Qf7+
+M7 1.g3 Kd8 2.e4 Ke7 3.Qg4 Kf7 4.Qd7+ Kf8 5.b4 Kg8 6.Bc4+ Kh8 7.Bb2+
+M7 1.Na3 Kd8 2.e4 Ke7 3.Qg4 Kf7 4.Qd7+ Kg6 5.d4 Kf6 6.Bc4 Kg6 7.Qf7+
+M7 1.b3 Kd8 2.e4 Ke8 3.Qh5+ Ke7 4.Ba3+ Kd7 5.Qc5 Kd8 6.Qd6+ Kc8 7.Ba6+
+M7 1.b4 Kd7 2.e4 Kc8 3.Qg4+ Kc7 4.Qg7+ Kd8 5.Ba6 Ke8 6.Bb5+ Kd8 7.Qd7+
+M7 1.e3 Kd7 2.Qg4+ Ke7 3.Qg6 Kd7 4.Bb5+ Kc8 5.Qc6+ Kb8 6.Ba6 Ka7 7.Qb7+
+M7 1.Nc3 Kd7 2.e4 Ke6 3.Qf3 Kd7 4.Qf7+ Kc8 5.Nb5 Kb8 6.Qa7+ Kc8 7.Qc7+
+M7 1.d4 Kd7 2.e4 Ke7 3.Qh5 Ke6 4.d5+ Kd7 5.Qf7+ Kc8 6.Ba6+ Kb8 7.Qb7+
+M7 1.c3 Kf7 2.Qb3+ Ke7 3.Qb7+ Ke6 4.d4 Kf6 5.e4 Kg6 6.Qe7 Kh5 7.Qg5+
+M7 1.h3 Kd7 2.e4 Ke7 3.Qg4 Ke8 4.Qg7 Kd8 5.Bb5 Kc8 6.Qa7 Kd8 7.Qd7+
+M7 1.h4 Kd8 2.e4 Ke7 3.Qg4 Ke8 4.Qg7 Kd8 5.Bb5 Kc8 6.Bc6 Kb8 7.Qb7+
+M6 1.e4 Kd8 2.Qg4 Kc7 3.Qg7+ Kc8 4.Bb5 Kb8 5.Ba6 Ka8 6.Qb7+

-----------------------------------------------------

Position No. 2

[d]4k3/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1
Mate in 12 moves

All moves after 1.e4:

FEN: 4k3/pppppppp/8/8/4P3/8/PPPP1PPP/RNBQKBNR b KQ - 0 1

-M10 1. ... d5 2.Qg4 Kd8 3.Nf3 g6 4.Ne5 f5 5.exf5 h5 6.Qb4 Kc8 7.Qxe7 b5 8.Bxb5 Kb7 9.Bc6+ Ka6 10.Nd7 gxf5 11.Qa3+
-M10 1. ... e5 2.Qh5 h6 3.Qxe5+ Kd8 4.Qxg7 Ke7 5.d4 a6 6.Bc4 c6 7.Qxf7+ Kd8 8.Qf8+ Kc7 9.Bf4+ d6 10.Qxd6+ Kc8 11.Qc7+
-M10 1. ... c5 2.Qh5 a6 3.Qxc5 Kd8 4.Nc3 e6 5.Qf8+ Kc7 6.d4 d6 7.Bf4 Kb6 8.Bxd6 f5 9.Qd8+ Ka7 10.Nb5+ axb5 11.Qa5+
-M10 1. ... f5 2.Qh5+ g6 3.Qxh7 d6 4.d4 f4 5.Be2 Kd8 6.Bg4 c5 7.Nc3 Kc7 8.Qxe7+ Kb6 9.Qxd6+ Ka5 10.Qxc5+ Ka6 11.Qb5+
-M10 1. ... h5 2.Qxh5 d6 3.Bc4 g6 4.Qh8+ Kd7 5.Bxf7 Kc6 6.Nc3 Kc5 7.Nd5 Kb5 8.Qc3 a5 9.Qxc7 g5 10.Be8+ Ka6 11.Qb6+
-M10 1. ... b6 2.Qh5 h6 3.Nf3 e6 4.Ne5 g6 5.Qxh6 Ke7 6.d4 c5 7.Qh8 cxd4 8.Bh6 Kd6 9.Qb8+ Ke7 10.Qf8+ Kf6 11.Nxd7+
-M11 1. ... c6 2.Qh5 h6 3.d4 b6 4.Bc4 e6 5.Bxh6 Kf8 6.Nf3 f6 7.Bf4 Kg8 8.Qe8+ Kh7 9.Qxd7 a5 10.Bxe6 c5 11.Bf5+ Kh8 12.Qc8+
-M11 1. ... a5 2.Qh5 c6 3.Qxh7 d6 4.Qg8+ Kd7 5.Qb8 f6 6.Bc4 d5 7.exd5 b5 8.Qb7+ Ke8 9.d6 exd6 10.Be6 c5 11.Qd7+ Kf8 12.Qf7+
-M11 1. ... g5 2.Qh5 a6 3.d4 h6 4.Bxg5 d6 5.Bxe7 Kxe7 6.Bc4 Kd7 7.Qxf7+ Kc6 8.Nc3 Kb6 9.Na4+ Ka7 10.Qxc7 a5 11.Bd5 h5 12.Qxb7+
-M11 1. ... d6 2.Qh5 h6 3.Qb5+ Kd8 4.Qxb7 e6 5.e5 dxe5 6.b3 Ke7 7.Qxc7+ Kf6 8.Nf3 g5 9.Nxe5 h5 10.d4 Kf5 11.Bd3+ Kf6 12.Qxf7+
-M11 1. ... Kd8 2.Qh5 g5 3.Qxf7 c6 4.h4 h6 5.hxg5 h5 6.Rxh5 a6 7.Rh7 Kc7 8.Qxe7 Kb6 9.b4 a5 10.Qd8+ Ka7 11.Qxa5+ Kb8 12.Rh8+
-M11 1. ... a6 2.Qh5 h6 3.Bc4 e6 4.Nf3 d6 5.Bxe6 g6 6.Qxh6 fxe6 7.Qg7 Kd8 8.Nd4 c5 9.Nxe6+ Ke8 10.Nc3 a5 11.Nd5 b5 12.Qe7+
-M11 1. ... f6 2.Qh5+ Kd8 3.Qxh7 d6 4.Qg8+ Kd7 5.Bc4 d5 6.exd5 g6 7.Nc3 c6 8.Qe6+ Kd8 9.d6 exd6 10.Qxd6+ Ke8 11.Ne4 a5 12.Nxf6+
-M11 1. ... Kf8 2.Qh5 h6 3.Nf3 d6 4.Ng5 g6 5.Ne6+ Ke8 6.Ng7+ Kf8 7.Qxh6 e6 8.Qh8+ Ke7 9.d4 c5 10.Bg5+ Kd7 11.Bb5+ Kc7 12.Qd8+
-M11 1. ... g6 2.d4 d6 3.Qf3 c6 4.Qb3 b6 5.Qh3 f5 6.Qxh7 f4 7.Ba6 Kd7 8.Bxf4 b5 9.Qg8 Kc7 10.Qc8+ Kb6 11.b4 d5 12.Qb7+
-M11 1. ... b5 2.Qh5 c6 3.d4 h6 4.Nf3 d6 5.d5 e6 6.dxc6 a6 7.Bg5 a5 8.Bxb5 Kf8 9.c7 Kg8 10.c8Q+ Kh7 11.Qxf7 hxg5 12.Qh5+
-M11 1. ... e6 2.Qh5 d6 3.Qxh7 Ke7 4.Qxg7 a6 5.d4 b5 6.a4 d5 7.Bg5+ Kd7 8.axb5 a5 9.Rxa5 dxe4 10.Ra8 c6 11.Qxf7+ Kd6 12.Rd8+
-M11 1. ... h6 2.Qh5 g6 3.Qxh6 d6 4.d4 Kd7 5.Qf8 a6 6.Bc4 d5 7.Nc3 c6 8.Na4 dxc4 9.Bf4 b6 10.Nxb6+ Ke6 11.Qg7 a5 12.Qe5+

-----------------------------------------------------

Position No. 3 (black castling rights)

[d]r3k3/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQq - 0 1
Mate in 15 moves
1.e4 e6 2.d4 a6 3.h4 c6 4.Rh3 Ke7 5.Qd2 d6 6.Qg5+ Kf8 7.Rg3 h6 8.Qxg7+ Ke7 9.Bxh6 c5 10.Rf3 Rf8 11.Qxf8+ Kd7 12.Rxf7+ Kc6 13.Qc8+ Kb6 14.Qc7+ Ka7 15.Qxb7+

-----------------------------------------------------

Position No. 4

[d]r3k3/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1
Mate in 15 moves
1.e4 d6 2.Qh5 e6 3.Qxh7 Kd7 4.a4 Rd8 5.Qxg7 Kc8 6.Ra3 Rd7 7.Rb3 a6 8.Bxa6 bxa6 9.d4 d5 10.Bg5 Rd6 11.Qf8+ Kd7 12.Qxf7+ Kc6 13.Qe8+ Rd7 14.Qxe6+ Rd6 15.exd5+

-----------------------------------------------------

Position No. 5

[d]2b1k3/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1
Mate in 14 moves
1.e4 g6 2.d4 d6 3.e5 h6 4.Bxh6 c6 5.d5 f6 6.Qf3 dxe5 7.dxc6 e4 8.Qxe4 Bf5 9.Qd5 bxc6 10.Qxc6+ Bd7 11.Qa8+ Bc8 12.Qxc8+ Kf7 13.Bc4+ e6 14.Qxe6+

-----------------------------------------------------

Position No. 6

[d]4kb2/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1
Mate in 16 moves
1.e4 g6 2.Qf3 Bg7 3.Qb3 b6 4.Qc4 c6 5.Qa6 Kd8 6.Qxa7 e6 7.d4 Ke8 8.Bf4 Ke7 9.Qc7 e5 10.dxe5 Ke8 11.Nc3 Bf8 12.0-0-0 Bd6 13.Qxd6 g5 14.Bxg5 f6 15.Qxf6 d5 16.Qe7+

-----------------------------------------------------

Position No. 7

[d]1n2k1n1/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1
Mate in 18 moves
1.d4 Nc6 2.e4 Nd8 3.Nc3 c6 4.e5 h6 5.Ne4 Ne6 6.d5 Nf8 7.Bc4 g5 8.dxc6 bxc6 9.Qf3 Ne6 10.Bxe6 fxe6 11.Qh5+ Kd8 12.Bd2 d6 13.Ba5+ Kd7 14.0-0-0 c5 15.Nxc5+ Kc6 16.Qe8+ Kxc5 17.b4+ Kc4 18.Qc6+

-----------------------------------------------------

Position No. 8

[d]1n2kb2/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1
Mate in 18 moves
1.d4 Nc6 2.Nc3 a6 3.e4 Nd8 4.Qh5 h6 5.Nd5 Ne6 6.Bc4 g6 7.Nxc7+ Nxc7 8.Qc5 Ne6 9.Bxe6 fxe6 10.h4 Bg7 11.Rh3 e5 12.Rf3 Kd8 13.Rc3 Ke8 14.Qc4 e6 15.Qc8+ Kf7 16.Qxd7+ Kg8 17.Rc7 Bf6 18.Qe8+

-----------------------------------------------------

Position No. 9

[d]2b1k1n1/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1
Mate in 18 moves
1.e4 d6 2.d4 g6 3.Qf3 h6 4.Bc4 e6 5.Nc3 a6 6.e5 d5 7.Nxd5 exd5 8.Qxd5 Be6 9.Qxb7 Bxc4 10.Qc8+ Ke7 11.b3 f5 12.Ba3+ c5 13.Bxc5+ Kf7 14.Qd7+ Ne7 15.Qxe7+ Kg8 16.bxc4 a5 17.Rb1 g5 18.Rb8+

-----------------------------------------------------

Position No. 10

[d]4kbn1/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1
Mate in 18 moves
1.e4 a6 2.d4 h6 3.d5 e6 4.dxe6 dxe6 5.Bf4 Bb4+ 6.Nc3 Ne7 7.Qd2 Nc6 8.Nf3 g5 9.Bxc7 Kf8 10.Ne5 Kg7 11.Qd7 Be7 12.Nxc6 Bf6 13.Ne5 Bxe5 14.Bxe5+ Kg6 15.Qe8 g4 16.Qg8+ Kh5 17.h3 gxh3 18.Rxh3+
Jouni
Posts: 3286
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2006 8:15 pm

Re: Initial position -x pieces for black

Post by Jouni »

Where is the old "favorite" :) ?
[d]3qk3/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1
Jouni
User avatar
Ajedrecista
Posts: 1969
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2011 9:04 pm
Location: Madrid, Spain.

Re: Initial position -x pieces for black.

Post by Ajedrecista »

Hello Andreas:
fastgm wrote: Mon Mar 29, 2021 7:04 pm The following 10 positions I have analyzed intensively with different engines during the past few months.
I have saved many analyzes for these positions. So hopefully I can answer one or the other question.

The positions with two black minor pieces are currently the maximum feasible with current hardware and software.
And that only with analyzes lasting for days.

Position No. 1

[d]4k3/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1
Mate in 6 moves

+M8 1.f3 Kd8 2.d4 Kd7 3.Bf4 Ke7 4.Qd3 Kd8 5.Qh7 Ke8 6.Bc7 Kf8 7.Bd6+ Ke8 8.Qe7+
+M8 1.c4 Ke7 2.e4 Kd6 3.c5+ Kxc5 4.Qh5+ Kd6 5.Qf7 Kc6 6.d4 Kb6 7.Qd7 Ka5 8.Qb5+
+M8 1.Nf3 Kd8 2.e4 Kc8 3.Ne5 Kc7 4.Qg4 Kd6 5.Qg6+ Ke7 6.Ba6 Kd8 7.Qd6+ Ke8 8.Bb5+
+M8 1.d3 Kd7 2.e4 Kd6 3.Qg4 Kc7 4.Qf4+ Kb7 5.Qf7+ Kb8 6.d4 Ka8 7.Ba6 Kb8 8.Qb7+
+M8 1.f4 Kd8 2.e3 Kd7 3.Bb5+ Kd8 4.Qg4 Kc7 5.Qd7+ Kb6 6.Qc6+ Ka5 7.d4 Kb4 8.Bd2+
+M8 1.g4 Kd7 2.e3 Kc8 3.Qf3 Kd7 4.Qb7+ Ke8 5.Bb5+ Kf8 6.Bc4 Ke8 7.Be6 Kf8 8.Qf7+
+M7 1.Nh3 Kd8 2.e4 Ke7 3.Qg4 Kf6 4.Ng5 Kg6 5.Qe6+ Kh5 6.d4 Kh4 7.Qh3+
+M7 1.a3 Kd8 2.e4 Ke7 3.Qg4 Kf7 4.Qd7+ Kg8 5.d4 Kh8 6.Bh6 Kg8 7.Qg7+
+M7 1.a4 Kf7 2.e4 Ke6 3.Qg4+ Kf6 4.Qd7 Kg6 5.d4 Kf6 6.Bc4 Kg6 7.Qf7+
+M7 1.g3 Kd8 2.e4 Ke7 3.Qg4 Kf7 4.Qd7+ Kf8 5.b4 Kg8 6.Bc4+ Kh8 7.Bb2+
+M7 1.Na3 Kd8 2.e4 Ke7 3.Qg4 Kf7 4.Qd7+ Kg6 5.d4 Kf6 6.Bc4 Kg6 7.Qf7+
+M7 1.b3 Kd8 2.e4 Ke8 3.Qh5+ Ke7 4.Ba3+ Kd7 5.Qc5 Kd8 6.Qd6+ Kc8 7.Ba6+
+M7 1.b4 Kd7 2.e4 Kc8 3.Qg4+ Kc7 4.Qg7+ Kd8 5.Ba6 Ke8 6.Bb5+ Kd8 7.Qd7+
+M7 1.e3 Kd7 2.Qg4+ Ke7 3.Qg6 Kd7 4.Bb5+ Kc8 5.Qc6+ Kb8 6.Ba6 Ka7 7.Qb7+
+M7 1.Nc3 Kd7 2.e4 Ke6 3.Qf3 Kd7 4.Qf7+ Kc8 5.Nb5 Kb8 6.Qa7+ Kc8 7.Qc7+
+M7 1.d4 Kd7 2.e4 Ke7 3.Qh5 Ke6 4.d5+ Kd7 5.Qf7+ Kc8 6.Ba6+ Kb8 7.Qb7+
+M7 1.c3 Kf7 2.Qb3+ Ke7 3.Qb7+ Ke6 4.d4 Kf6 5.e4 Kg6 6.Qe7 Kh5 7.Qg5+
+M7 1.h3 Kd7 2.e4 Ke7 3.Qg4 Ke8 4.Qg7 Kd8 5.Bb5 Kc8 6.Qa7 Kd8 7.Qd7+
+M7 1.h4 Kd8 2.e4 Ke7 3.Qg4 Ke8 4.Qg7 Kd8 5.Bb5 Kc8 6.Bc6 Kb8 7.Qb7+
+M6 1.e4 Kd8 2.Qg4 Kc7 3.Qg7+ Kc8 4.Bb5 Kb8 5.Ba6 Ka8 6.Qb7+

-----------------------------------------------------

[...]
Supposing that the first position is a checkmate in six moves, it is feasible by brute force search since perft(11) value is not so high:

Code: Select all

Depth is 11.

----k---
--------
--------
--------  w KQ -
--------
--------
PPPPPPPP
RNBQKBNR

Na3        69,373,683,797
Nc3        84,453,875,979
Nf3        80,732,468,503
Nh3        67,361,063,296
a3         60,759,087,337
b3         76,669,900,391
c3         84,244,770,632
d3        151,524,694,248
e3        205,903,947,533
f3         56,885,600,901
g3         81,471,809,886
h3         60,744,019,812
a4         87,191,706,673
b4         77,071,669,332
c4         93,451,942,582
d4        177,826,708,814
e4        196,356,217,376
f4         66,254,794,198
g4         72,230,802,585
h4         87,270,539,592
TOTAL   1,937,779,303,467
Computed by gperft 1.1 perft counter.

The number of unique positions after 11 plies is 79,490,712 (computed by JetChess 1.0.0.0 perft counter).

Time to give the position to Chest 5.2:

Code: Select all

FEN: 4k3/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1 

ChestUCI:
FEN: 4k3/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ -   (16+1)
Stellungs-Analyse:  C0/R0/K6/P1/X5   W:10/20
Problem in Datenbank gefunden:  #6; 00:11;
Suche nach Matt in 10 ...  (Hash=64MB)
   6	00:01	           0	0	+M6	e2e4
Suche abgeschlossen ...  (Zeit=0.91s)
Matt in 6 gefunden !  (1 Lösung in 00:00)
  6/6	00:01	     747.149	823.758	+M6	e2e4 Ke8f8 Qd1g4 Kf8e8 Qg4g7 Ke8d8 Bf1b5 Kd8c8 Bb5c6 Kc8d8 Qg7d7+
It was already solved in Chest database. There are several solutions after playing 1.- e4, depending on the first move by black:

Code: Select all

FEN: 4k3/8/8/8/4P3/8/PPPP1PPP/RNBQKBNR b KQ - 0 1 

ChestUCI:
FEN: 4k3/8/8/8/4P3/8/PPPP1PPP/RNBQKBNR b KQ -   (16+1)
Stellungs-Analyse:  S:1/5
Suche nach Matt in -10 ...  (Hash=64MB)
Suche abgeschlossen ...  (Zeit=0.39s)
Matt in -5 gefunden !  (5 Lösungen in 00:00)
  5/5	00:00	     353.565	904.258	-M5	Ke8f7 Qd1g4 Kf7e7 Qg4g7+ Ke7e6 d2d4 Ke6d6 Bc1f4+ Kd6e6 d4d5+
  5/5	00:00	     353.565	904.258	-M5	Ke8d7 Qd1g4+ Kd7e7 Qg4g7+ Ke7e6 d2d4 Ke6d6 Bc1f4+ Kd6e6 d4d5+
  5/5	00:00	     353.565	904.258	-M5	Ke8e7 Qd1g4 Ke7f7 Qg4d7+ Kf7f8 d2d3 Kf8g8 Bc1h6 Kg8h8 Qd7g7+
  5/5	00:00	     353.565	904.258	-M5	Ke8d8 Qd1g4 Kd8e8 Qg4g7 Ke8d8 Bf1b5 Kd8c8 Bb5c6 Kc8d8 Qg7d7+
  5/5	00:00	     353.565	904.258	-M5	Ke8f8 Qd1g4 Kf8e8 Qg4g7 Ke8d8 Bf1b5 Kd8c8 Bb5c6 Kc8d8 Qg7d7+
It looks like 2.- Qg4 (or 2.- Qg4+) is compulsory in order to play the shortest lines. How many different ways are? This is another story.

Regards from Spain.

Ajedrecista.
fastgm
Posts: 818
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 6:57 pm

Re: Initial position -x pieces for black

Post by fastgm »

Thank you for this interesting additional information on position no. 1!
fastgm
Posts: 818
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 6:57 pm

Re: Initial position -x pieces for black

Post by fastgm »

Jouni wrote: Mon Mar 29, 2021 8:28 pm Where is the old "favorite" :) ?
[d]3qk3/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1
This position will be dealt with in the next series.
Coming soon :-)
User avatar
Ajedrecista
Posts: 1969
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2011 9:04 pm
Location: Madrid, Spain.

Re: Initial position -x pieces for black

Post by Ajedrecista »

Hello Jouni:
Jouni wrote: Mon Mar 29, 2021 8:28 pm Where is the old "favorite" :) ?
[d]3qk3/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1
SF 13 with NNUE enabled returns mate in 12 evals for 1.- e4, 1.- Nc3 and 1.- d4 in a fairly short run:

Code: Select all

FEN: 3qk3/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1 

Stockfish_13_win_x64_modern:
[...]
 71/28	16:31	5.432.875.185	5.477.138	+M14	h2h3 Qd8f6 e2e3 Ke8d8 Qd1f3 Qf6e6 Nb1c3 Kd8e7 Nc3d5+ Ke7d6 Qf3f4+ Qe6e5 Qf4b4+ Kd6d7 Bf1b5+ Kd7c8 Bb5c6 Qe5c7 Nd5xc7 Kc8xc7 Qb4c5 Kc7b8 Qc5e7 Kb8c8 Qe7b7+ Kc8d8 Qb7d7+
 71/26	16:31	5.432.875.185	5.477.138	+M13	d2d3 Qd8e7 e2e4 Ke8f7 Nb1c3 Qe7e6 Qd1h5+ Qe6g6 Qh5b5 Kf7e7 d3d4 Ke7f7 Bf1c4+ Kf7e7 Bc1g5+ Qg6xg5 Qb5xg5+ Ke7d7 Qg5g7+ Kd7c8 Qg7e7 Kc8b8 Bc4a6 Kb8a8 Qe7b7+
 71/26	16:31	5.432.875.185	5.477.138	+M13	Ng1f3 Qd8e7 e2e3 Qe7f7 Nf3d4 Ke8e7 Nb1c3 Ke7e8 Qd1g4 Ke8f8 Nd4e6+ Kf8e7 Qg4g5+ Ke7xe6 Bf1c4+ Ke6d7 Bc4xf7 Kd7c7 Qg5c5+ Kc7b7 Bf7d5+ Kb7a6 Qc5d6+ Ka6a7 Nc3b5+
 71/26	16:31	5.432.875.185	5.477.138	+M13	e2e3 Qd8d7 Ng1f3 Qd7f7 Nf3d4 Ke8e7 Nb1c3 Ke7e8 Qd1g4 Ke8f8 Nd4e6+ Kf8e7 Qg4g5+ Ke7xe6 Bf1c4+ Ke6d7 Bc4xf7 Kd7c7 Qg5c5+ Kc7b7 Bf7d5+ Kb7a6 Qc5d6+ Ka6a7 Nc3b5+
 71/24	16:31	5.432.875.185	5.477.138	+M12	d2d4 Qd8a5+ Nb1c3 Qa5h5 e2e4 Qh5xd1+ Nc3xd1 Ke8f8 h2h4 Kf8g7 h4h5 Kg7g8 h5h6 Kg8h7 Bf1d3 Kh7g6 h6h7 Kg6f7 h7h8Q Kf7e7 Qh8g7+ Ke7e6 Rh1h6+
 71/24	16:31	5.432.875.185	5.477.138	+M12	Nb1c3 Qd8d4 e2e4 Ke8f7 Qd1g4 Qd4c5 Qg4d7+ Qc5e7 Bf1c4+ Kf7f8 Qd7f5+ Kf8e8 Nc3d5 Qe7d6 d2d4 Qd6b4+ Nd5xb4 Ke8d8 Nb4d5 Kd8e8 Bc4b5+ Ke8d8 Bc1g5+
 71/24	16:31	5.432.875.185	5.477.138	+M12	e2e4 Qd8d4 Qd1f3 Qd4g7 d2d4 Qg7g6 Nb1c3 Qg6f7 Bf1b5+ Ke8e7 Bc1g5+ Ke7f8 Bg5h6+ Kf8g8 Bb5c4 Kg8h7 Qf3xf7+ Kh7xh6 Qf7f6+ Kh6h7 Qf6g5 Kh7h8 Qg5g8+
I did not look if there were TB hits to the full set of 3, 4 and 5-man Syzygy EGTB. I think that mate in 12 can be considered an upper bound, but more powerful computers and much longer analysis are required.

Regards from Spain.

Ajedrecista.
User avatar
Ajedrecista
Posts: 1969
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2011 9:04 pm
Location: Madrid, Spain.

Re: Initial position -x pieces for black.

Post by Ajedrecista »

Hello:
Ajedrecista wrote: Mon Mar 29, 2021 9:12 pm Hello Jouni:
Jouni wrote: Mon Mar 29, 2021 8:28 pm Where is the old "favorite" :) ?
[d]3qk3/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1
SF 13 with NNUE enabled returns mate in 12 evals for 1.- e4, 1.- Nc3 and 1.- d4 in a fairly short run:

Code: Select all

FEN: 3qk3/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1

Stockfish_13_win_x64_modern:
[...]
 71/28	16:31	5.432.875.185	5.477.138	+M14	h2h3 Qd8f6 e2e3 Ke8d8 Qd1f3 Qf6e6 Nb1c3 Kd8e7 Nc3d5+ Ke7d6 Qf3f4+ Qe6e5 Qf4b4+ Kd6d7 Bf1b5+ Kd7c8 Bb5c6 Qe5c7 Nd5xc7 Kc8xc7 Qb4c5 Kc7b8 Qc5e7 Kb8c8 Qe7b7+ Kc8d8 Qb7d7+
 71/26	16:31	5.432.875.185	5.477.138	+M13	d2d3 Qd8e7 e2e4 Ke8f7 Nb1c3 Qe7e6 Qd1h5+ Qe6g6 Qh5b5 Kf7e7 d3d4 Ke7f7 Bf1c4+ Kf7e7 Bc1g5+ Qg6xg5 Qb5xg5+ Ke7d7 Qg5g7+ Kd7c8 Qg7e7 Kc8b8 Bc4a6 Kb8a8 Qe7b7+
 71/26	16:31	5.432.875.185	5.477.138	+M13	Ng1f3 Qd8e7 e2e3 Qe7f7 Nf3d4 Ke8e7 Nb1c3 Ke7e8 Qd1g4 Ke8f8 Nd4e6+ Kf8e7 Qg4g5+ Ke7xe6 Bf1c4+ Ke6d7 Bc4xf7 Kd7c7 Qg5c5+ Kc7b7 Bf7d5+ Kb7a6 Qc5d6+ Ka6a7 Nc3b5+
 71/26	16:31	5.432.875.185	5.477.138	+M13	e2e3 Qd8d7 Ng1f3 Qd7f7 Nf3d4 Ke8e7 Nb1c3 Ke7e8 Qd1g4 Ke8f8 Nd4e6+ Kf8e7 Qg4g5+ Ke7xe6 Bf1c4+ Ke6d7 Bc4xf7 Kd7c7 Qg5c5+ Kc7b7 Bf7d5+ Kb7a6 Qc5d6+ Ka6a7 Nc3b5+
 71/24	16:31	5.432.875.185	5.477.138	+M12	d2d4 Qd8a5+ Nb1c3 Qa5h5 e2e4 Qh5xd1+ Nc3xd1 Ke8f8 h2h4 Kf8g7 h4h5 Kg7g8 h5h6 Kg8h7 Bf1d3 Kh7g6 h6h7 Kg6f7 h7h8Q Kf7e7 Qh8g7+ Ke7e6 Rh1h6+
 71/24	16:31	5.432.875.185	5.477.138	+M12	Nb1c3 Qd8d4 e2e4 Ke8f7 Qd1g4 Qd4c5 Qg4d7+ Qc5e7 Bf1c4+ Kf7f8 Qd7f5+ Kf8e8 Nc3d5 Qe7d6 d2d4 Qd6b4+ Nd5xb4 Ke8d8 Nb4d5 Kd8e8 Bc4b5+ Ke8d8 Bc1g5+
 71/24	16:31	5.432.875.185	5.477.138	+M12	e2e4 Qd8d4 Qd1f3 Qd4g7 d2d4 Qg7g6 Nb1c3 Qg6f7 Bf1b5+ Ke8e7 Bc1g5+ Ke7f8 Bg5h6+ Kf8g8 Bb5c4 Kg8h7 Qf3xf7+ Kh7xh6 Qf7f6+ Kh6h7 Qf6g5 Kh7h8 Qg5g8+
I did not look if there were TB hits to the full set of 3, 4 and 5-man Syzygy EGTB. I think that mate in 12 can be considered an upper bound, but more powerful computers and much longer analysis are required.

Regards from Spain.

Ajedrecista.
I tried Chest 5.2 and it has got the position in its database with the label #11:

Code: Select all

FEN: 3qk3/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1 

ChestUCI:
FEN: 3qk3/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ -   (16+2)
Stellungs-Analyse:  C0/R0/K5/P2/X20   W:10/20
Problem in Datenbank gefunden:  #11;
Suche nach Matt in 12 ...  (Hash=1024MB)
Berechnung abgebrochen !
A search with Chest 5.2 in normal mode would have taken a lot of hours in my PC given the time that shallower depths took.

Then I tried SF 13 SSE4.1 with NNUE enabled (default net), 4 threads and the full set of 3, 4 and 5-man Syzygy EGTB, like the other day, but now setting Multi-PV = 6 instead of 7 and raising hash from 256 MB to 1 GB. It paid off and found a mate in 11 at depth 76:

Code: Select all

FEN: 3qk3/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1 

Stockfish_13_win_x64_modern:
[...]
 75/26	29:01	9.486.011.151	5.446.722	+M13	Ng1f3 Ke8d7 d2d4 Qd8a5+ Nb1c3 Qa5a6 e2e4 Qa6d6 Nf3g1 Kd7c6 Qd1g4 Kc6b7 Bc1f4 Qd6d8 Qg4e6 Qd8b6 Qe6d7+ Kb7a8 Qd7d5+ Ka8a7 Nc3b5+ Qb6xb5 Qd5xb5 Ka7a8 Qb5a6+
 75/26	29:01	9.486.011.151	5.446.722	+M13	d2d3 Ke8f7 e2e4 Qd8d6 Qd1h5+ Kf7g7 Nb1c3 Qd6g6 Qh5c5 Qg6f7 d3d4 Qf7g6 Qc5c8 Qg6f7 Bf1c4 Qf7xc4 Qc8xc4 Kg7f8 Qc4c7 Kf8e8 Nc3d5 Ke8f8 Bc1h6+ Kf8e8 Nd5f6+
 75/24	29:01	9.486.011.151	5.446.722	+M12	e2e3 Qd8c7 Qd1f3 Ke8d7 d2d4 Qc7a5+ Nb1c3 Kd7c7 e3e4 Kc7b8 Qf3f8+ Kb8b7 Bc1f4 Qa5c7 Bf4xc7 Kb7xc7 Qf8c5+ Kc7b8 Nc3b5 Kb8b7 Qc5a7+ Kb7c6 d4d5+
 75/24	29:01	9.486.011.151	5.446.722	+M12	d2d4 Qd8a5+ Nb1c3 Qa5h5 e2e4 Qh5g6 Qd1f3 Qg6f7 Bf1b5+ Ke8e7 Bc1g5+ Ke7f8 Bg5h6+ Kf8g8 Bb5c4 Kg8h7 Qf3xf7+ Kh7xh6 Qf7f6+ Kh6h7 Qf6g5 Kh7h8 Qg5g8+
 75/24	29:01	9.486.011.151	5.446.722	+M12	Nb1c3 Qd8d4 e2e4 Qd4g7 d2d4 Qg7g6 Qd1f3 Qg6f7 Bf1b5+ Ke8e7 Bc1g5+ Ke7f8 Bg5h6+ Kf8g8 Bb5c4 Kg8h7 Qf3xf7+ Kh7xh6 Qf7f6+ Kh6h7 Qf6g5 Kh7h8 Qg5g8+
 75/24	29:01	9.486.011.151	5.446.722	+M12	e2e4 Qd8d4 Qd1f3 Qd4g7 d2d4 Qg7g6 Nb1c3 Qg6f7 Bf1b5+ Ke8e7 Bc1g5+ Ke7f8 Bg5h6+ Kf8g8 Bb5c4 Kg8h7 Qf3xf7+ Kh7xh6 Qf7f6+ Kh6h7 Qf6g5 Kh7h8 Qg5g8+
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
 76/26	33:20	10.989.767.227	5.492.460	+M13	Ng1f3 Ke8d7 d2d4 Qd8a5+ Nb1c3 Qa5a6 e2e4 Qa6d6 Nf3g1 Kd7c6 Qd1g4 Kc6b7 Bc1f4 Qd6d8 Qg4e6 Qd8b6 Qe6d7+ Kb7a8 Qd7d5+ Ka8a7 Nc3b5+ Qb6xb5 Qd5xb5 Ka7a8 Qb5a6+
 76/26	33:20	10.989.767.227	5.492.460	+M13	d2d3 Ke8f7 e2e4 Qd8d6 Qd1h5+ Kf7g7 Nb1c3 Qd6g6 Qh5c5 Qg6f7 d3d4 Qf7g6 Qc5c8 Qg6f7 Bf1c4 Qf7xc4 Qc8xc4 Kg7f8 Qc4c7 Kf8e8 Nc3d5 Ke8f8 Bc1h6+ Kf8e8 Nd5f6+
 76/24	33:20	10.989.767.227	5.492.460	+M12	e2e3 Qd8c7 Qd1f3 Ke8d7 d2d4 Qc7a5+ Nb1c3 Kd7c7 e3e4 Kc7b8 Qf3f8+ Kb8b7 Bc1f4 Qa5c7 Bf4xc7 Kb7xc7 Qf8c5+ Kc7b8 Nc3b5 Kb8b7 Qc5a7+ Kb7c6 d4d5+
 76/24	33:20	10.989.767.227	5.492.460	+M12	d2d4 Qd8a5+ Nb1c3 Qa5h5 e2e4 Qh5g6 Qd1f3 Qg6f7 Bf1b5+ Ke8e7 Bc1g5+ Ke7f8 Bg5h6+ Kf8g8 Bb5c4 Kg8h7 Qf3xf7+ Kh7xh6 Qf7f6+ Kh6h7 Qf6g5 Kh7h8 Qg5g8+
 76/24	33:20	10.989.767.227	5.492.460	+M12	Nb1c3 Qd8d4 e2e4 Qd4g7 d2d4 Qg7g6 Qd1f3 Qg6f7 Bf1b5+ Ke8e7 Bc1g5+ Ke7f8 Bg5h6+ Kf8g8 Bb5c4 Kg8h7 Qf3xf7+ Kh7xh6 Qf7f6+ Kh6h7 Qf6g5 Kh7h8 Qg5g8+
 76/24	33:20	10.989.767.227	5.492.460	+M11	e2e4 Qd8d4 Qd1g4 Ke8d8 Nb1c3 Qd4d7 Qg4f4 Kd8c8 Bf1a6+ Kc8d8 Ba6b5 Qd7e6 Nc3d5 Qe6xd5 e4xd5 Kd8c8 Qf4f7 Kc8b8 Bb5a6 Kb8a8 Qf7b7+
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
 77/26	35:30	11.737.898.238	5.508.378	+M13	Ng1f3 Ke8d7 d2d4 Qd8a5+ Nb1c3 Qa5a6 e2e4 Qa6d6 Nf3g1 Kd7c6 Qd1g4 Kc6b7 Bc1f4 Qd6d8 Qg4e6 Qd8b6 Qe6d7+ Kb7a8 Qd7d5+ Ka8a7 Nc3b5+ Qb6xb5 Qd5xb5 Ka7a8 Qb5a6+
 77/26	35:30	11.737.898.238	5.508.378	+M13	d2d3 Ke8f7 e2e4 Qd8d6 Qd1h5+ Kf7g7 Nb1c3 Qd6g6 Qh5c5 Qg6f7 d3d4 Qf7g6 Qc5c8 Qg6f7 Bf1c4 Qf7xc4 Qc8xc4 Kg7f8 Qc4c7 Kf8e8 Nc3d5 Ke8f8 Bc1h6+ Kf8e8 Nd5f6+
 77/24	35:30	11.737.898.238	5.508.378	+M12	e2e3 Qd8c7 Qd1f3 Ke8d7 d2d4 Qc7a5+ Nb1c3 Kd7c7 e3e4 Kc7b8 Qf3f8+ Kb8b7 Bc1f4 Qa5c7 Bf4xc7 Kb7xc7 Qf8c5+ Kc7b8 Nc3b5 Kb8b7 Qc5a7+ Kb7c6 d4d5+
 77/24	35:30	11.737.898.238	5.508.378	+M12	d2d4 Qd8a5+ Nb1c3 Qa5h5 e2e4 Qh5g6 Qd1f3 Qg6f7 Bf1b5+ Ke8e7 Bc1g5+ Ke7f8 Bg5h6+ Kf8g8 Bb5c4 Kg8h7 Qf3xf7+ Kh7xh6 Qf7f6+ Kh6h7 Qf6g5 Kh7h8 Qg5g8+
 77/24	35:30	11.737.898.238	5.508.378	+M12	Nb1c3 Qd8d4 e2e4 Qd4g7 d2d4 Qg7g6 Qd1f3 Qg6f7 Bf1b5+ Ke8e7 Bc1g5+ Ke7f8 Bg5h6+ Kf8g8 Bb5c4 Kg8h7 Qf3xf7+ Kh7xh6 Qf7f6+ Kh6h7 Qf6g5 Kh7h8 Qg5g8+
 77/22	35:30	11.737.898.238	5.508.378	+M11	e2e4 Qd8d4 Qd1g4 Ke8d8 Nb1c3 Qd4d7 Qg4f4 Kd8c8 Bf1a6+ Kc8d8 Ba6b5 Qd7e6 Nc3d5 Qe6xd5 e4xd5 Kd8c8 Qf4f7 Kc8b8 Bb5a6 Kb8a8 Qf7b7+
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
 78/26	37:49	12.535.133.363	5.522.299	+M13	Ng1f3 Ke8d7 d2d4 Qd8a5+ Nb1c3 Qa5a6 e2e4 Qa6d6 Nf3g1 Kd7c6 Qd1g4 Kc6b7 Bc1f4 Qd6d8 Qg4e6 Qd8b6 Qe6d7+ Kb7a8 Qd7d5+ Ka8a7 Nc3b5+ Qb6xb5 Qd5xb5 Ka7a8 Qb5a6+
 78/26	37:49	12.535.133.363	5.522.299	+M13	d2d3 Ke8f7 e2e4 Qd8d6 Qd1h5+ Kf7g7 Nb1c3 Qd6g6 Qh5c5 Qg6f7 d3d4 Qf7g6 Qc5c8 Qg6f7 Bf1c4 Qf7xc4 Qc8xc4 Kg7f8 Qc4c7 Kf8e8 Nc3d5 Ke8f8 Bc1h6+ Kf8e8 Nd5f6+
 78/24	37:49	12.535.133.363	5.522.299	+M12	e2e3 Qd8c7 Qd1f3 Ke8d7 d2d4 Qc7a5+ Nb1c3 Kd7c7 e3e4 Kc7b8 Qf3f8+ Kb8b7 Bc1f4 Qa5c7 Bf4xc7 Kb7xc7 Qf8c5+ Kc7b8 Nc3b5 Kb8b7 Qc5a7+ Kb7c6 d4d5+
 78/24	37:49	12.535.133.363	5.522.299	+M12	d2d4 Qd8a5+ Nb1c3 Qa5h5 e2e4 Qh5g6 Qd1f3 Qg6f7 Bf1b5+ Ke8e7 Bc1g5+ Ke7f8 Bg5h6+ Kf8g8 Bb5c4 Kg8h7 Qf3xf7+ Kh7xh6 Qf7f6+ Kh6h7 Qf6g5 Kh7h8 Qg5g8+
 78/24	37:49	12.535.133.363	5.522.299	+M12	Nb1c3 Qd8d4 e2e4 Qd4g7 d2d4 Qg7g6 Qd1f3 Qg6f7 Bf1b5+ Ke8e7 Bc1g5+ Ke7f8 Bg5h6+ Kf8g8 Bb5c4 Kg8h7 Qf3xf7+ Kh7xh6 Qf7f6+ Kh6h7 Qf6g5 Kh7h8 Qg5g8+
 78/22	37:49	12.535.133.363	5.522.299	+M11	e2e4 Qd8d4 Qd1g4 Ke8d8 Nb1c3 Qd4d7 Qg4f4 Kd8c8 Bf1a6+ Kc8d8 Ba6b5 Qd7e6 Nc3d5 Qe6xd5 e4xd5 Kd8c8 Qf4f7 Kc8b8 Bb5a6 Kb8a8 Qf7b7+
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
 79/26	40:03	13.277.812.532	5.524.652	+M13	Ng1f3 Ke8d7 d2d4 Qd8a5+ Nb1c3 Qa5a6 e2e4 Qa6d6 Nf3g1 Kd7c6 Qd1g4 Kc6b7 Bc1f4 Qd6d8 Qg4e6 Qd8b6 Qe6d7+ Kb7a8 Qd7d5+ Ka8a7 Nc3b5+ Qb6xb5 Qd5xb5 Ka7a8 Qb5a6+
 79/26	40:03	13.277.812.532	5.524.652	+M13	d2d3 Ke8f7 e2e4 Qd8d6 Qd1h5+ Kf7g7 Nb1c3 Qd6g6 Qh5c5 Qg6f7 d3d4 Qf7g6 Qc5c8 Qg6f7 Bf1c4 Qf7xc4 Qc8xc4 Kg7f8 Qc4c7 Kf8e8 Nc3d5 Ke8f8 Bc1h6+ Kf8e8 Nd5f6+
 79/24	40:03	13.277.812.532	5.524.652	+M12	e2e3 Qd8c7 Qd1f3 Ke8d7 d2d4 Qc7a5+ Nb1c3 Kd7c7 e3e4 Kc7b8 Qf3f8+ Kb8b7 Bc1f4 Qa5c7 Bf4xc7 Kb7xc7 Qf8c5+ Kc7b8 Nc3b5 Kb8b7 Qc5a7+ Kb7c6 d4d5+
 79/24	40:03	13.277.812.532	5.524.652	+M12	d2d4 Qd8a5+ Nb1c3 Qa5h5 e2e4 Qh5g6 Qd1f3 Qg6f7 Bf1b5+ Ke8e7 Bc1g5+ Ke7f8 Bg5h6+ Kf8g8 Bb5c4 Kg8h7 Qf3xf7+ Kh7xh6 Qf7f6+ Kh6h7 Qf6g5 Kh7h8 Qg5g8+
 79/24	40:03	13.277.812.532	5.524.652	+M12	Nb1c3 Qd8d4 e2e4 Qd4g7 d2d4 Qg7g6 Qd1f3 Qg6f7 Bf1b5+ Ke8e7 Bc1g5+ Ke7f8 Bg5h6+ Kf8g8 Bb5c4 Kg8h7 Qf3xf7+ Kh7xh6 Qf7f6+ Kh6h7 Qf6g5 Kh7h8 Qg5g8+
 79/22	40:03	13.277.812.532	5.524.652	+M11	e2e4 Qd8d4 Qd1g4 Ke8d8 Nb1c3 Qd4d7 Qg4f4 Kd8c8 Bf1a6+ Kc8d8 Ba6b5 Qd7e6 Nc3d5 Qe6xd5 e4xd5 Kd8c8 Qf4f7 Kc8b8 Bb5a6 Kb8a8 Qf7b7+
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
 80/26	43:08	14.314.705.245	5.529.789	+M13	Ng1f3 Ke8d7 d2d4 Qd8a5+ Nb1c3 Qa5a6 e2e4 Qa6d6 Nf3g1 Kd7c6 Qd1g4 Kc6b7 Bc1f4 Qd6d8 Qg4e6 Qd8b6 Qe6d7+ Kb7a8 Qd7d5+ Ka8a7 Nc3b5+ Qb6xb5 Qd5xb5 Ka7a8 Qb5a6+
 80/26	43:08	14.314.705.245	5.529.789	+M13	d2d3 Ke8f7 e2e4 Qd8d6 Qd1h5+ Kf7g7 Nb1c3 Qd6g6 Qh5c5 Qg6f7 d3d4 Qf7g6 Qc5c8 Qg6f7 Bf1c4 Qf7xc4 Qc8xc4 Kg7f8 Qc4c7 Kf8e8 Nc3d5 Ke8f8 Bc1h6+ Kf8e8 Nd5f6+
 80/24	43:08	14.314.705.245	5.529.789	+M12	e2e3 Qd8c7 Qd1f3 Ke8d7 d2d4 Qc7a5+ Nb1c3 Kd7c7 e3e4 Kc7b8 Qf3f8+ Kb8b7 Bc1f4 Qa5c7 Bf4xc7 Kb7xc7 Qf8c5+ Kc7b8 Nc3b5 Kb8b7 Qc5a7+ Kb7c6 d4d5+
 80/24	43:08	14.314.705.245	5.529.789	+M12	d2d4 Qd8a5+ Nb1c3 Qa5h5 e2e4 Qh5g6 Qd1f3 Qg6f7 Bf1b5+ Ke8e7 Bc1g5+ Ke7f8 Bg5h6+ Kf8g8 Bb5c4 Kg8h7 Qf3xf7+ Kh7xh6 Qf7f6+ Kh6h7 Qf6g5 Kh7h8 Qg5g8+
 80/24	43:08	14.314.705.245	5.529.789	+M12	Nb1c3 Qd8d4 e2e4 Qd4g7 d2d4 Qg7g6 Qd1f3 Qg6f7 Bf1b5+ Ke8e7 Bc1g5+ Ke7f8 Bg5h6+ Kf8g8 Bb5c4 Kg8h7 Qf3xf7+ Kh7xh6 Qf7f6+ Kh6h7 Qf6g5 Kh7h8 Qg5g8+
 80/22	43:08	14.314.705.245	5.529.789	+M11	e2e4 Qd8d4 Qd1g4 Ke8d8 Nb1c3 Qd4d7 Qg4f4 Kd8c8 Bf1a6+ Kc8d8 Ba6b5 Qd7e6 Nc3d5 Qe6xd5 e4xd5 Kd8c8 Qf4f7 Kc8b8 Bb5a6 Kb8a8 Qf7b7+
I stopped the analysis once depth 80 was fully searched. There were not any TB hits.

Here is the line proposed by SF 13 at depth 80:

[pgn][FEN "3qk3/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1"]
1.e4 Qd4 2.Qg4 Kd8 3.Nc3 Qd7 4.Qf4 Kc8 5.Ba6+ Kd8 6.Bb5 Qe6 7.Nd5 Qxd5 8.exd5 Kc8 9.Qf7 Kb8 10.Ba6 Ka8 11.Qb7# 1-0[/pgn]

Regards from Spain.

Ajedrecista.
MOBMAT
Posts: 385
Joined: Sat Feb 04, 2017 11:57 pm
Location: USA

Re: Initial position -x pieces for black

Post by MOBMAT »

[d]3qk3/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1
Less than 5:00 for Houdini 6 (N6) and M11

Code: Select all

FEN: 3qk3/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQ - 0 1
Houdini 6 (N6):

 46	01:41	1,969,683,948	19,409,000	+M12	1.d4 Qa5+ 2.Nc3 Qh5 3.e4 Qxd1+ 4.Nxd1 Kf7 5.Bc4+ Ke7 6.a4 Kd7 7.a5 Ke7 8.a6 Ke8 9.a7 Kd8 10.a8Q+ Kd7 11.Ra7+ Kd6 12.Qd5+
 46	01:41	1,969,683,948	19,409,000	+M12	1.Nc3 Qd4 2.e3 Qf6 3.Qf3 Kf7 4.Qxf6+ Kxf6 5.a4 Kg7 6.a5 Kg6 7.a6 Kh6 8.a7 Kh5 9.a8Q Kg6 10.Ra6+ Kh5 11.Qd5+ Kh4 12.Ra4+
 46	01:41	1,969,683,948	19,409,000	+M12	1.e4 Qd4 2.Qg4 Kd8 3.Nc3 Qd7 4.Qg3 Qe8 5.Qf4 Qc6 6.Nd5 Qc5 7.Qb8+ Qc8 8.Qb6+ Ke8 9.Qf6 Kd7 10.Bb5+ Qc6 11.Bxc6+ Kc8 12.Qf8+
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
 47	02:05	2,453,682,896	19,512,000	+M12	1.d4 Qa5+ 2.Nc3 Qh5 3.e4 Qxd1+ 4.Nxd1 Kf7 5.Bc4+ Ke7 6.a4 Kd7 7.a5 Ke7 8.a6 Ke8 9.a7 Kd8 10.a8Q+ Kd7 11.Ra7+ Kd6 12.Qd5+
 47	02:05	2,453,682,896	19,512,000	+M12	1.Nc3 Qd4 2.e3 Qf6 3.Qf3 Kf7 4.Qxf6+ Kxf6 5.a4 Kg7 6.a5 Kg6 7.a6 Kh6 8.a7 Kh5 9.a8Q Kg6 10.Ra6+ Kh5 11.Qd5+ Kh4 12.Ra4+
 47	02:05	2,453,682,896	19,512,000	+M11	1.e4 Kf8 2.Qg4 Kf7 3.Bc4+ Ke8 4.Nc3 Qd4 5.Nd5 Kf8 6.Qe6 Kg7 7.Ne7 Qxe4+ 8.Qxe4 Kf6 9.Qe6+ Kg7 10.Qf7+ Kh8 11.Ng6+
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
 48	02:22	2,791,304,686	19,637,000	+M12	1.d4 Qa5+ 2.Nc3 Qh5 3.e4 Qxd1+ 4.Nxd1 Kf7 5.Bc4+ Ke7 6.a4 Kd7 7.a5 Ke7 8.a6 Ke8 9.a7 Kd8 10.a8Q+ Kd7 11.Ra7+ Kd6 12.Qd5+
 48	02:22	2,791,304,686	19,637,000	+M12	1.Nc3 Qd4 2.e3 Qf6 3.Qf3 Kf7 4.Qxf6+ Kxf6 5.a4 Kg7 6.a5 Kg6 7.a6 Kh6 8.a7 Kh5 9.a8Q Kg6 10.Ra6+ Kh5 11.Qd5+ Kh4 12.Ra4+
 48	02:22	2,791,304,686	19,637,000	+M11	1.e4 Kf8 2.Qg4 Kf7 3.Bc4+ Ke8 4.Nc3 Qd4 5.Nd5 Kf8 6.Qe6 Kg7 7.Ne7 Qxe4+ 8.Qxe4 Kf6 9.Qe6+ Kg7 10.Qf7+ Kh8 11.Ng6+
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
 49	02:44	3,242,646,027	19,752,000	+M12	1.d4 Qa5+ 2.Nc3 Qh5 3.e4 Qxd1+ 4.Nxd1 Kf7 5.Bc4+ Ke7 6.a4 Kd7 7.a5 Ke7 8.a6 Ke8 9.a7 Kd8 10.a8Q+ Kd7 11.Ra7+ Kd6 12.Qd5+
 49	02:44	3,242,646,027	19,752,000	+M11	1.Nc3 Qd4 2.e4 Kf8 3.Qg4 Qg7 4.Qc8+ Ke7 5.Bc4 Qe5 6.d3 Qa5 7.Bh6 Qh5 8.Bf8+ Kf6 9.Qe6+ Kg5 10.Qf5+ Kh4 11.g3+
 49	02:44	3,242,646,027	19,752,000	+M11	1.e4 Kf8 2.Qg4 Kf7 3.Bc4+ Ke8 4.Nc3 Qd4 5.Nd5 Kf8 6.Qe6 Kg7 7.Ne7 Qxe4+ 8.Qxe4 Kf6 9.Qe6+ Kg7 10.Qf7+ Kh8 11.Ng6+
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
 50	02:56	3,491,766,262	19,818,000	+M12	1.d4 Qa5+ 2.Nc3 Qh5 3.e4 Qxd1+ 4.Nxd1 Kf7 5.Bc4+ Ke7 6.a4 Kd7 7.a5 Ke7 8.a6 Ke8 9.a7 Kd8 10.a8Q+ Kd7 11.Ra7+ Kd6 12.Qd5+
 50	02:56	3,491,766,262	19,818,000	+M11	1.Nc3 Qd4 2.e4 Kf8 3.Qg4 Qg7 4.Qc8+ Ke7 5.Bc4 Qe5 6.d3 Qa5 7.Bh6 Qh5 8.Bf8+ Kf6 9.Qe6+ Kg5 10.Qf5+ Kh4 11.g3+
 50	02:56	3,491,766,262	19,818,000	+M11	1.e4 Kf8 2.Qg4 Kf7 3.Bc4+ Ke8 4.Nc3 Qd4 5.Nd5 Kf8 6.Qe6 Kg7 7.Ne7 Qxe4+ 8.Qxe4 Kf6 9.Qe6+ Kg7 10.Qf7+ Kh8 11.Ng6+
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
 51	03:20	3,998,069,354	19,936,000	+M12	1.d4 Qa5+ 2.Nc3 Qh5 3.e4 Qxd1+ 4.Nxd1 Kf7 5.Bc4+ Ke7 6.a4 Kd7 7.a5 Ke7 8.a6 Ke8 9.a7 Kd8 10.a8Q+ Kd7 11.Ra7+ Kd6 12.Qd5+
 51	03:20	3,998,069,354	19,936,000	+M11	1.Nc3 Qd4 2.e4 Kf8 3.Qg4 Qg7 4.Qc8+ Ke7 5.Bc4 Qe5 6.d3 Qa5 7.Bh6 Qh5 8.Bf8+ Kf6 9.Qe6+ Kg5 10.Qf5+ Kh4 11.g3+
 51	03:20	3,998,069,354	19,936,000	+M11	1.e4 Kf8 2.Qg4 Qe8 3.b3 Qc6 4.Ba3+ Ke8 5.Qf5 Kd8 6.Bb5 Qb7 7.Bd6 Qe7 8.Bxe7+ Kc7 9.Ba6 Kc6 10.Qb5+ Kc7 11.Qb7+
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
 52	03:41	4,444,461,326	20,047,000	+M12	1.d4 Qa5+ 2.Nc3 Qh5 3.e4 Qxd1+ 4.Nxd1 Kf7 5.Bc4+ Ke7 6.a4 Kd7 7.a5 Ke7 8.a6 Ke8 9.a7 Kd8 10.a8Q+ Kd7 11.Ra7+ Kd6 12.Qd5+
 52	03:41	4,444,461,326	20,047,000	+M11	1.Nc3 Qd4 2.e4 Kf8 3.Qg4 Qg7 4.Qc8+ Ke7 5.Bc4 Qe5 6.d3 Qa5 7.Bh6 Qh5 8.Bf8+ Kf6 9.Qe6+ Kg5 10.Qf5+ Kh4 11.g3+
 52	03:41	4,444,461,326	20,047,000	+M11	1.e4 Kf8 2.Qg4 Qe7 3.d4 Qf7 4.Bb5 Ke7 5.Bg5+ Kf8 6.Bh6+ Ke7 7.Qd7+ Kf6 8.Qf5+ Ke7 9.Qc5+ Kf6 10.Qg5+ Ke6 11.Qe5+
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
 53	04:19	5,247,414,274	20,251,000	+M12	1.d4 Qa5+ 2.Nc3 Qh5 3.e4 Qxd1+ 4.Nxd1 Kf7 5.Bc4+ Ke7 6.a4 Kd7 7.a5 Ke7 8.a6 Ke8 9.a7 Kd8 10.a8Q+ Kd7 11.Ra7+ Kd6 12.Qd5+
 53	04:19	5,247,414,274	20,251,000	+M11	1.Nc3 Qd4 2.e4 Kf8 3.Qg4 Qg7 4.Qc8+ Ke7 5.Bc4 Qe5 6.d3 Qa5 7.Bh6 Qh5 8.Bf8+ Kf6 9.Qe6+ Kg5 10.Qf5+ Kh4 11.g3+
 53	04:19	5,247,414,274	20,251,000	+M11	1.e4 Kf8 2.Qg4 Qe7 3.d4 Qf7 4.Bb5 Ke7 5.Bg5+ Kf8 6.Bh6+ Ke7 7.Qd7+ Kf6 8.Qf5+ Ke7 9.Qc5+ Kf6 10.Qg5+ Ke6 11.Qe5+
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
 54	04:39	5,691,913,846	20,338,000	+M12	1.d4 Qa5+ 2.Nc3 Qh5 3.e4 Qxd1+ 4.Nxd1 Kf7 5.Bc4+ Ke7 6.a4 Kd7 7.a5 Ke7 8.a6 Ke8 9.a7 Kd8 10.a8Q+ Kd7 11.Ra7+ Kd6 12.Qd5+
 54	04:39	5,691,913,846	20,338,000	+M11	1.Nc3 Qd4 2.e4 Kf8 3.Qg4 Qg7 4.Qc8+ Ke7 5.Bc4 Qe5 6.d3 Qa5 7.Bh6 Qh5 8.Bf8+ Kf6 9.Qe6+ Kg5 10.Qf5+ Kh4 11.g3+
 54	04:39	5,691,913,846	20,338,000	+M11	1.e4 Kf8 2.Qg4 Qe7 3.d4 Qf7 4.Bb5 Ke7 5.Bg5+ Kf8 6.Bh6+ Ke7 7.Qd7+ Kf6 8.Qf5+ Ke7 9.Qc5+ Kf6 10.Qg5+ Ke6 11.Qe5+
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
 54	04:44	5,779,619,621	20,340,000	+M12	1.d4 Qa5+ 2.Nc3 Qh5 3.e4 Qxd1+ 4.Nxd1 Kf7 5.Bc4+ Ke7 6.a4 Kd7 7.a5 Ke7 8.a6 Ke8 9.a7 Kd8 10.a8Q+ Kd7 11.Ra7+ Kd6 12.Qd5+
 54	04:44	5,779,619,621	20,340,000	+M11	1.Nc3 Qd4 2.e4 Kf8 3.Qg4 Qg7 4.Qc8+ Ke7 5.Bc4 Qe5 6.d3 Qa5 7.Bh6 Qh5 8.Bf8+ Kf6 9.Qe6+ Kg5 10.Qf5+ Kh4 11.g3+
 55	04:44	5,779,619,621	20,340,000	+M11	1.e4 Kf8 2.Qg4 Qe7 3.d4 Qf7 4.Bb5 Ke7 5.Bg5+ Kf8 6.Bh6+ Ke7 7.Qd7+ Kf6 8.Qf5+ Ke7 9.Qc5+ Kf6 10.Qg5+ Ke6 11.Qe5+

i7-6700K @ 4.00Ghz 32Gb, Win 10 Home, EGTBs on PCI SSD
Benchmark: Stockfish15.1 NNUE x64 bmi2 (nps): 1277K