TalkChess.com

Madeleine Birchfield wrote: ↑Tue Nov 03, 2020 9:15 pm

Terje wrote: ↑Tue Nov 03, 2020 5:29 pm You'll get him next time, Weiss

I remember you said at TCEC that you had plans to implement NNUE into your engine.

xr_a_y wrote: ↑Tue Nov 03, 2020 5:39 pm

Terje wrote: ↑Tue Nov 03, 2020 5:29 pm You'll get him next time, Weiss

Here is clear Weiss victory, and as Black , maybe Minic pushed it too hard on this one !

[pgn]
[Event "My Tournament"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "2020.11.03"]
[Round "415"]
[White "minic_3.00_nnue"]
[Black "weiss"]
[Result "0-1"]
[ECO "B04"]
[GameDuration "00:00:27"]
[GameEndTime "2020-11-03T17:19:34.409 CET"]
[GameStartTime "2020-11-03T17:19:07.295 CET"]
[Opening "Alekhine's defense"]
[PlyCount "104"]
[TimeControl "10+0.1"]
[Variation "Modern, Larsen Variation"]

1. e4 {book} Nf6 {book} 2. e5 {book} Nd5 {book} 3. d4 {book} d6 {book}
4. Nf3 {book} dxe5 {book} 5. Nxe5 {+1.06/14 0.54s} Nd7 {-0.42/15 0.46s}
6. Nxf7 {+1.59/16 0.64s} Kxf7 {0.00/17 0.30s} 7. Qh5+ {+1.96/16 0.63s}
Ke6 {0.00/18 0.29s} 8. c4 {+1.38/14 0.63s} N5f6 {+1.43/15 0.60s}
9. d5+ {+2.47/16 0.48s} Kd6 {+1.35/15 0.30s} 10. Qf7 {+2.46/18 0.55s}
Ne5 {+2.03/15 0.35s} 11. Bf4 {+2.67/13 0.36s} c5 {+1.78/15 0.32s}
12. Nc3 {+3.62/15 0.52s} a6 {+2.18/15 0.65s} 13. O-O-O {+3.21/14 0.51s}
g6 {+2.33/14 0.37s} 14. Bxe5+ {-0.26/11 0.36s} Kxe5 {+2.12/13 0.25s}
15. d6 {+0.08/13 0.34s} Bh6+ {+2.24/15 0.77s} 16. Kb1 {-1.75/13 0.48s}
Rf8 {+2.45/15 0.37s} 17. Qxe7+ {-1.91/16 0.43s} Qxe7 {+2.61/16 0.32s}
18. dxe7 {-2.51/15 0.43s} Re8 {+2.63/16 0.33s} 19. Nd5 {-2.55/14 0.26s}
Nxd5 {+4.46/16 0.28s} 20. Rxd5+ {-3.54/13 0.40s} Kf6 {+4.57/15 0.21s}
21. Bd3 {-4.07/16 0.36s} Rxe7 {+4.56/16 0.39s} 22. Rxc5 {-4.19/15 0.34s}
Be6 {+5.06/16 0.24s} 23. Be4 {-4.25/14 0.19s} Rd8 {+4.72/16 0.32s}
24. Bd5 {-4.72/14 0.35s} Bf5+ {+5.04/16 0.21s} 25. Ka1 {-4.35/13 0.35s}
Bd2 {+4.53/16 0.19s} 26. a3 {-3.87/12 0.29s} Be1 {+5.67/15 0.22s}
27. f4 {-4.59/13 0.32s} Bf2 {+6.93/18 0.23s} 28. Ra5 {-4.70/12 0.19s}
Bb6 {+7.10/18 0.23s} 29. Ra4 {-5.14/12 0.24s} a5 {+7.23/17 0.19s}
30. c5 {-5.61/14 0.26s} Bxc5 {+7.67/17 0.33s} 31. Bf3 {-6.39/15 0.28s}
b6 {+7.75/18 0.34s} 32. h4 {-7.42/12 0.27s} Re3 {+9.28/17 0.41s}
33. Rc4 {-8.15/11 0.15s} Rd2 {+9.64/14 0.18s} 34. Rc3 {-8.15/14 0.15s}
Rxc3 {+11.01/16 0.28s} 35. bxc3 {-8.62/14 0.24s} Bxa3 {+11.20/15 0.33s}
36. Re1 {-8.55/13 0.24s} Bb2+ {+12.42/15 0.17s} 37. Ka2 {-9.03/13 0.20s}
Bxc3+ {+14.33/15 0.19s} 38. Kb3 {-8.83/11 0.22s} Bb4 {+14.83/15 0.21s}
39. Rc1 {-10.95/13 0.20s} b5 {+15.27/14 0.18s} 40. Rc6+ {-11.35/20 0.17s}
Be6+ {+15.56/14 0.15s} 41. Rxe6+ {-11.62/17 0.18s} Kxe6 {+15.61/13 0.19s}
42. Bc6 {-12.02/16 0.18s} Kf5 {+16.08/16 0.23s} 43. g3 {-12.11/14 0.12s}
Rd3+ {+16.43/16 0.22s} 44. Kb2 {-12.60/15 0.18s} a4 {+20.08/15 0.14s}
45. Bxb5 {-12.82/12 0.12s} a3+ {+27.50/14 0.17s} 46. Kc1 {-14.61/13 0.11s}
Rxg3 {+27.88/17 0.19s} 47. Bd7+ {-14.41/13 0.14s} Kf6 {+28.50/16 0.14s}
48. h5 {-19.99/12 0.17s} a2 {+M21/18 0.24s} 49. Kb2 {-26.89/13 0.15s}
Ra3 {+M7/24 0.13s} 50. Be6 {-99.94/23 0.074s} a1=Q+ {+M5/127 0.032s}
51. Kc2 {-99.96/81 0.053s} Qc3+ {+M3/127 0.014s} 52. Kb1 {-99.98/121 0.022s}
Ra1# {+M1/127 0.013s, Black mates} 0-1
[/pgn]

xr_a_y wrote: ↑Tue Nov 03, 2020 1:49 pm Second year anniversary for Minic ! and a new version number 3.00

Porting Stockfish NNUE implementation inside Minic was fun and instructive. This has clearly raised my interest in NN technologies and in this sense is a success.
As you already know, I was never comfortable with the big copy/paste of SF code involved, nor with the use of SF based nets of course.
This is why I first trained a net with my own data (but using Nodchip learner), namely the "napping nexus" net and then merged the learner directly inside Minic in order to train the pure Minic net named "nascent nutrient". Still, this was not enough to make me feel this technology and code can be inside Minic this way and in no way this can be considered as an "official" version of Minic as soon as a NNUE net is in use. This is why I decided to not use SF implementation anymore. This means that, starting from version 3, Minic is no more compatible with SF nets. Only versions 2.47 to 2.53 can read and use SF nets (and only using NNUE version 0x7AF32F16u nets).

In the meantime, I discovered Seer engine by Connor McMonigle (https://github.com/connormcmonigle/seer-nnue), and was very impressed by its code quality. This engine propose a very clear and simple to understand and use NNUE implementation. This implementation allows to very easily change architecture of the net and implements an engine-independent training code using pytorch. I decided to borrow this code base and adapt it to Minic (was very easy). This is a good compromise for me, a code base I can understand and work with, a very good starting point.

I then trained a first net for it, named "nefarious nucleus" (available here : https://github.com/tryingsomestuff/NNUE-Nets) that performs even with standard Minic2.53 eval at short TC (10s+0.1). Maybe better at longer TC...

My hope is of course to train better nets, probably try other architectures and also speed-up the code that is for now quite slow.

Please note that Minic 3.00 with no net loaded is weaker than version 2.53 because it has less nps. So that there is probably no need for testing for now ...

So for now this is a just a new forum thread for a new story

xr_a_y wrote: ↑Tue Nov 03, 2020 1:49 pm Second year anniversary for Minic ! and a new version number 3.00

Porting Stockfish NNUE implementation inside Minic was fun and instructive. This has clearly raised my interest in NN technologies and in this sense is a success.
As you already know, I was never comfortable with the big copy/paste of SF code involved, nor with the use of SF based nets of course.
This is why I first trained a net with my own data (but using Nodchip learner), namely the "napping nexus" net and then merged the learner directly inside Minic in order to train the pure Minic net named "nascent nutrient". Still, this was not enough to make me feel this technology and code can be inside Minic this way and in no way this can be considered as an "official" version of Minic as soon as a NNUE net is in use. This is why I decided to not use SF implementation anymore. This means that, starting from version 3, Minic is no more compatible with SF nets. Only versions 2.47 to 2.53 can read and use SF nets (and only using NNUE version 0x7AF32F16u nets).

In the meantime, I discovered Seer engine by Connor McMonigle (https://github.com/connormcmonigle/seer-nnue), and was very impressed by its code quality. This engine propose a very clear and simple to understand and use NNUE implementation. This implementation allows to very easily change architecture of the net and implements an engine-independent training code using pytorch. I decided to borrow this code base and adapt it to Minic (was very easy). This is a good compromise for me, a code base I can understand and work with, a very good starting point.

I then trained a first net for it, named "nefarious nucleus" (available here : https://github.com/tryingsomestuff/NNUE-Nets) that performs even with standard Minic2.53 eval at short TC (10s+0.1). Maybe better at longer TC...

My hope is of course to train better nets, probably try other architectures and also speed-up the code that is for now quite slow.

Please note that Minic 3.00 with no net loaded is weaker than version 2.53 because it has less nps. So that there is probably no need for testing for now ...

So for now this is a just a new forum thread for a new story

carldaman wrote: ↑Wed Nov 04, 2020 12:01 am

xr_a_y wrote: ↑Tue Nov 03, 2020 1:49 pm Second year anniversary for Minic ! and a new version number 3.00

Porting Stockfish NNUE implementation inside Minic was fun and instructive. This has clearly raised my interest in NN technologies and in this sense is a success.
As you already know, I was never comfortable with the big copy/paste of SF code involved, nor with the use of SF based nets of course.
This is why I first trained a net with my own data (but using Nodchip learner), namely the "napping nexus" net and then merged the learner directly inside Minic in order to train the pure Minic net named "nascent nutrient". Still, this was not enough to make me feel this technology and code can be inside Minic this way and in no way this can be considered as an "official" version of Minic as soon as a NNUE net is in use. This is why I decided to not use SF implementation anymore. This means that, starting from version 3, Minic is no more compatible with SF nets. Only versions 2.47 to 2.53 can read and use SF nets (and only using NNUE version 0x7AF32F16u nets).

In the meantime, I discovered Seer engine by Connor McMonigle (https://github.com/connormcmonigle/seer-nnue), and was very impressed by its code quality. This engine propose a very clear and simple to understand and use NNUE implementation. This implementation allows to very easily change architecture of the net and implements an engine-independent training code using pytorch. I decided to borrow this code base and adapt it to Minic (was very easy). This is a good compromise for me, a code base I can understand and work with, a very good starting point.

I then trained a first net for it, named "nefarious nucleus" (available here : https://github.com/tryingsomestuff/NNUE-Nets) that performs even with standard Minic2.53 eval at short TC (10s+0.1). Maybe better at longer TC...

My hope is of course to train better nets, probably try other architectures and also speed-up the code that is for now quite slow.

Please note that Minic 3.00 with no net loaded is weaker than version 2.53 because it has less nps. So that there is probably no need for testing for now ...

So for now this is a just a new forum thread for a new story

Very interesting release , but following the link to Minic (on github), I don't see version 3.00, but only 2.53 and older.

Charly wrote: ↑Sat Nov 07, 2020 10:51 pm Salut Vivien,

Félicitations pour Minic 3 !

Je viens de lancer un tournoi de 100 parties en 40/2 contre Arasan 22.1.

Minic 3.0 joue avec Nefarious Nucleus. Joli coup : 41 Td5 !


Event "Test Minic 3.00 Nefarious Nucleus"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "2020.11.07"]
[Round "4"]
[White "Minic 3.00 & Nefarious Nucleus"]
[Black "Arasan 22.1 x64 bmi2"]
[Result "1-0"]
[BlackElo "3288"]
[ECO "B90"]
[Opening "Sicilian"]
[Time "22:36:25"]
[Variation "Najdorf, Adams Attack, 1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 d6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 a6 6.h3"]
[WhiteElo "3200"]
[TimeControl "40/120:40/120:40/120"]
[Termination "adjudication"]
[PlyCount "112"]
[WhiteType "program"]
[BlackType "program"]

1. e4 {+0.62/18 2} c5 2. Nf3 {+0.68/17 2} d6 3. d4 {+0.73/18 1} cxd4 4.
Nxd4 {+0.73/18 3} Nf6 5. Nc3 {+0.69/18 2} a6 6. h3 {+0.87/17 1} e5 7. Nf3
{+0.78/17 2} Be6 8. Ng5 {+0.77/19 1} Nc6 9. a3 {+0.53/16 1} b5 {-0.25/23 3}
10. Nxe6 {+0.61/17 2} fxe6 {-0.32/24 2} 11. g4 {+0.62/18 1} h6 {-0.10/23 3}
12. h4 {+0.69/18 1} Be7 {-0.23/23 3} 13. Bg2 {+0.77/18 2} Nd7 {0.00/25 2}
14. Be3 {+0.84/19 3} Qa5 {-0.11/22 3} 15. Kf1 {+0.76/19 3} b4 {0.00/22 3}
16. Ne2 {+1.30/20 2} Nc5 {-0.35/24 10} 17. Kg1 {+1.26/20 3} bxa3 {-0.44/23
3} 18. Rxa3 {+1.06/20 1} Qb5 {-0.40/23 3} 19. Ra2 {+1.49/18 2} a5 {-0.44/21
3} 20. Ng3 {+1.36/18 3} Qc4 {-0.18/24 3} 21. b3 {+1.54/20 2} Qb4 {-0.32/21
4} 22. Ra1 {+1.60/19 2} Rd8 {-0.37/21 4} 23. Bd2 {+1.67/19 3} Qb6 {-0.14/21
4} 24. g5 {+1.50/20 3} Kd7 {-0.28/23 5} 25. Rb1 {+1.69/18 2} Rb8 {-0.69/22
6} 26. Be3 {+1.76/21 3} Nb4 {-0.67/22 3} 27. Bh3 {+2.08/17 2} hxg5
{-0.79/22 4} 28. hxg5 {+1.73/20 2} g6 {-1.02/25 3} 29. Bg2 {+1.99/20 3}
Rxh1+ {-0.28/24 3} 30. Kxh1 {+1.70/18 2} Qc6 {-0.33/26 3} 31. Kg1 {+1.53/19
3} Nca6 {-0.49/22 2} 32. Rc1 {+2.14/23 3} Nc5 {-0.71/25 5} 33. Bf1
{+2.02/20 4} a4 {-0.61/22 2} 34. bxa4 {+1.83/21 3} Nxa4 {-0.64/24 2} 35.
Qf3 {+1.76/21 2} Na2 {-1.00/27 3} 36. Ra1 {+2.16/23 2} Qxc2 {-1.21/24 2}
37. Bh3 {+2.04/22 4} Qb2 {-1.46/22 2} 38. Rf1 {+2.01/22 3} Rf8 {-1.25/24 3}
39. Qg4 {+1.90/25 4} Qb3 {-1.26/26 1} 40. Rd1 {+2.34/25 8} N2c3 {-1.01/19
1} 41. Rd5 {+3.45/24 2} Rf5 {-3.92/26 7} 42. Ra5 {+3.84/24 2} Rf8 {-4.10/26
4} 43. Ra7+ {+4.76/25 2} Kd8 {-4.50/30 5} 44. Qh4 {+5.15/23 1} Nb5
{-4.50/27 2} 45. Ra8+ {+5.20/26 2} Kd7 {-4.53/29 2} 46. Rxf8 {+5.33/24 1}
Bxf8 {-4.46/28 3} 47. Qh7+ {+5.22/25 2} Be7 {-4.49/26 2} 48. Qxg6 {+5.45/22
1} Bxg5 {-4.51/25 2} 49. Qf7+ {+5.32/23 1} Kc6 {-4.54/28 3} 50. Bxg5
{+5.16/24 2} Nc7 {-4.57/29 2} 51. Bd8 {+5.29/22 1} Qb7 {-4.62/29 2} 52.
Bxc7 {+5.31/26 1} Nc5 {-4.07/28 2} 53. Bxe6 {+5.39/27 1} Nxe6 {-4.29/29 3}
54. Qxe6 {+21.37/26 2} Qxc7 {-6.16/28 3} 55. Qc4+ {+23.34/24 0} Kd7
{-6.43/30 3} 56. Qxc7+ {+25.18/35 2} Kxc7 {-13.85/31 6 Adjugé par Arena}
1-0

Si le pgn du tournoi t'intéresse je pourrai te l'envoyer.

Charly