Chess can be dangerous for kids
Moderators: hgm, Rebel, chrisw
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- Posts: 362
- Joined: Thu Mar 16, 2006 7:39 pm
- Location: Portugal
- Full name: Alvaro Cardoso
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- Posts: 1971
- Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2011 9:04 pm
- Location: Madrid, Spain.
Re: Chess can be dangerous for kids.
Hello Álvaro:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HhrvwHrceRg
Possible sequence of moves:
[pgn][Event "TV show"]
[Site "Russia"]
[Date "2016.11.??"]
[White "Osipov, Misha"]
[Black "Karpov, Anatoly"]
[Result "0-1"]
[PlyCount "34"]
1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Bb4 4.a3 Bxc3+ 5.bxc3 c5
6.dxc5 Na6 7.Nf3 Nxc5 8. g3 b6 9.Bg5 h6 10.Bxf6 Qxf6
11.Nd4 Bb7 12.f3 O-O 13.Bg2 Ba6 14.f4 Rac8 15.O-O Bxc4 {Draw offer by Karpov. Osipov declines it.}
16.f5 e5 17. Nf3 d5 {Draw offer by Karpov. Osipov flagged.} 0-1[/pgn]
They also featured three three-movers:
1) The same idea than in Chanda 1-0 Tiviakov (2007) (found thanks to the pages 253 and 254 of Formation Attacks book):
[pgn][Result "1-0"]
[Setup "1"]
[FEN "b5k1/1qrr1p1p/4nQ2/p4N2/1p4P1/1P3P1P/1P6/R1R3K1 w - - 0 1"]
1.Nh6+ Kf8 2.Qh8+ Ke7 3.Nf5# 1-0[/pgn]
2) Very old problem:
[pgn][Result "1-0"]
[Setup "1"]
[FEN "5K2/7r/4k1rn/4p3/4P3/5N2/8/3R1R2 w - - 0 1"]
1.Ng5+ Rxg5 2.Rf6+ Kxf6 3.Rd6# 1-0[/pgn]
3) Galitzky, 1900 (YACPDB #125088):
[pgn][Result "1-0"]
[Setup "1"]
[FEN "7k/4K1pp/7N/8/8/8/8/B7 w - - 0 1"]
1.Bf6 gxf6 2. Kf8 f5 3.Nf7# 1-0[/pgn]
Regards from Spain.
Ajedrecista.
There are gaps in the video. I found a longer video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HhrvwHrceRg
Possible sequence of moves:
[pgn][Event "TV show"]
[Site "Russia"]
[Date "2016.11.??"]
[White "Osipov, Misha"]
[Black "Karpov, Anatoly"]
[Result "0-1"]
[PlyCount "34"]
1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Bb4 4.a3 Bxc3+ 5.bxc3 c5
6.dxc5 Na6 7.Nf3 Nxc5 8. g3 b6 9.Bg5 h6 10.Bxf6 Qxf6
11.Nd4 Bb7 12.f3 O-O 13.Bg2 Ba6 14.f4 Rac8 15.O-O Bxc4 {Draw offer by Karpov. Osipov declines it.}
16.f5 e5 17. Nf3 d5 {Draw offer by Karpov. Osipov flagged.} 0-1[/pgn]
They also featured three three-movers:
1) The same idea than in Chanda 1-0 Tiviakov (2007) (found thanks to the pages 253 and 254 of Formation Attacks book):
[pgn][Result "1-0"]
[Setup "1"]
[FEN "b5k1/1qrr1p1p/4nQ2/p4N2/1p4P1/1P3P1P/1P6/R1R3K1 w - - 0 1"]
1.Nh6+ Kf8 2.Qh8+ Ke7 3.Nf5# 1-0[/pgn]
2) Very old problem:
[pgn][Result "1-0"]
[Setup "1"]
[FEN "5K2/7r/4k1rn/4p3/4P3/5N2/8/3R1R2 w - - 0 1"]
1.Ng5+ Rxg5 2.Rf6+ Kxf6 3.Rd6# 1-0[/pgn]
3) Galitzky, 1900 (YACPDB #125088):
[pgn][Result "1-0"]
[Setup "1"]
[FEN "7k/4K1pp/7N/8/8/8/8/B7 w - - 0 1"]
1.Bf6 gxf6 2. Kf8 f5 3.Nf7# 1-0[/pgn]
Regards from Spain.
Ajedrecista.
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- Posts: 626
- Joined: Sun Jul 25, 2010 10:07 pm
- Location: the Netherlands
- Full name: Jef Kaan
Re: Chess can be dangerous for kids
maybe the game was not cooked, but the problems obviously were,
even the toddler admitted this.
PS being Dutch, i would regard this as child abuse,
but then i've seen clips from Chinese girls at similar
age playing violin or piano, so nowadays nothing
is surprising me anymore in such areas.
PS2 keep in mind many prodigies can fail in later life
(yes, even in chess, violin, or piano)
even the toddler admitted this.
PS being Dutch, i would regard this as child abuse,
but then i've seen clips from Chinese girls at similar
age playing violin or piano, so nowadays nothing
is surprising me anymore in such areas.
PS2 keep in mind many prodigies can fail in later life
(yes, even in chess, violin, or piano)
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- Posts: 496
- Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2006 9:45 pm
- Location: Portland, OR
Re: Chess can be dangerous for kids.
Very old indeed, older than chess itself! It is a modification of one of the handful of ancient (>1000 year old) Shatranj problems which are still valid in the modern game of chess. See Murray's "History of Chess", problem #53:Ajedrecista wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 8:58 pm Hello Álvaro:
There are gaps in the video. I found a longer video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HhrvwHrceRg
They also featured three three-movers:
2) Very old problem:
[pgn][Result "1-0"]
[Setup "1"]
[FEN "5K2/7r/4k1rn/4p3/4P3/5N2/8/3R1R2 w - - 0 1"]
1.Ng5+ Rxg5 2.Rf6+ Kxf6 3.Rd6# 1-0[/pgn]
Regards from Spain.
Ajedrecista.
[d]6K1/3r3r/5kn1/5p2/5P2/6N1/8/4R1R1 w
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- Posts: 1971
- Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2011 9:04 pm
- Location: Madrid, Spain.
Re: Chess can be dangerous for kids.
Hello Ian:
https://web.archive.org/web/20110717133 ... tion%2Fpdf
Problems 58, 63, 64 and 97 at least (pages 284, 292, 294 and 356, respectively) thanks to 'Abu Naam' references (other Internet sources spell "Abu Na'im"). It is funny that Chessmaster 9000 make its appearance at the page 280 of this PDF when talking about the smothered mate because this checkmate pattern is featured in the opening animated sequence of the game. Absolutely true since I have got Chessmaster 9000 and saw it many times, though I have not used it for years despite being really amazing.
I also found the exact setup of the problem of my previous post at page 138 of the Lucena's book of 1497:
https://bvpb.mcu.es/es/catalogo_imagene ... sicion=138
White moves and says he will checkmate black in three moves neither more nor less. The first, check with the knight at g5, then check with the rook at f6 and checkmate with the other rook at d6.
Regards from Spain.
Ajedrecista.
Thank you for the reference of Murray's book! I found some variants with the same idea in the book Libro de los juegos of 1283, thanks to a transcription:IanO wrote: ↑Sun Nov 08, 2020 5:04 pmVery old indeed, older than chess itself! It is a modification of one of the handful of ancient (>1000 year old) Shatranj problems which are still valid in the modern game of chess. See Murray's "History of Chess", problem #53:Ajedrecista wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 8:58 pm Hello Álvaro:
There are gaps in the video. I found a longer video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HhrvwHrceRg
They also featured three three-movers:
2) Very old problem:
[pgn][Result "1-0"]
[Setup "1"]
[FEN "5K2/7r/4k1rn/4p3/4P3/5N2/8/3R1R2 w - - 0 1"]
1.Ng5+ Rxg5 2.Rf6+ Kxf6 3.Rd6# 1-0[/pgn]
Regards from Spain.
Ajedrecista.
[d]6K1/3r3r/5kn1/5p2/5P2/6N1/8/4R1R1 w
https://web.archive.org/web/20110717133 ... tion%2Fpdf
Problems 58, 63, 64 and 97 at least (pages 284, 292, 294 and 356, respectively) thanks to 'Abu Naam' references (other Internet sources spell "Abu Na'im"). It is funny that Chessmaster 9000 make its appearance at the page 280 of this PDF when talking about the smothered mate because this checkmate pattern is featured in the opening animated sequence of the game. Absolutely true since I have got Chessmaster 9000 and saw it many times, though I have not used it for years despite being really amazing.
I also found the exact setup of the problem of my previous post at page 138 of the Lucena's book of 1497:
https://bvpb.mcu.es/es/catalogo_imagene ... sicion=138
White moves and says he will checkmate black in three moves neither more nor less. The first, check with the knight at g5, then check with the rook at f6 and checkmate with the other rook at d6.
Regards from Spain.
Ajedrecista.
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- Posts: 496
- Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2006 9:45 pm
- Location: Portland, OR
Re: Chess can be dangerous for kids
Thank you so much for those references! I guess there were quite a few variations on that theme.
I'm delighted that we can still enjoy the creative brilliance of the finest minds of a thousand years ago, even though the game has changed. (See also Al-Suli's Diamond, a corresponding-square Shatranj endgame study which took a thousand years to solve!)
I'm delighted that we can still enjoy the creative brilliance of the finest minds of a thousand years ago, even though the game has changed. (See also Al-Suli's Diamond, a corresponding-square Shatranj endgame study which took a thousand years to solve!)