Sure no one here can beat this simple free smartphone engine!

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Milos
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Re: Sure no one here can beat this simple free smartphone engine!

Post by Milos » Tue Aug 04, 2020 5:30 am

Chessqueen wrote:
Mon Aug 03, 2020 1:36 pm
Mr. Milos the reason why I am using Shredder Gui and Larry uses Fritz Gui is because the Arena Gui causes Komodo to play either too fast or ignore that it first has to reach certain Depth before it let the engine select the candidate move. Take a look at this game where Jorge Sammour FIDE rated 2458 easily beat Komodo after Komodo made a quick move and it placed its Queen 20.Qe4 ? where Jorge Sammour forced it to move and got a Rook for a knight exchanged under Arena 3.51
Fixed depth games are standard UCI protocol thing and they work perfectly for bunch of engines in Arena.
Moreover in fixed depth games for depths under 10 all moves are practically instant. There is no such thing as too fast playing.
So if an engine takes time in your GUI to make a move it just seems that GUI is broken and doesn't follow UCI protocol.
Komodo 11 (the one that I have coz I don't think it's ever worth buying it) works perfectly fine in Arena in fixed depth games. This can be trivially verified by checking debug log.
So I really don't know what you are talking about.

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Ovyron
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Re: Sure no one here can beat this simple free smartphone engine!

Post by Ovyron » Wed Aug 05, 2020 10:31 am

Milos wrote:
Mon Aug 03, 2020 3:53 am
And second, if you are testing engine vs engine, never use fixed depth (unless it is depth=1) but instead fixed nodes (ofc assuming that are nodes at least roughly reported in a similar fashion)
That's a big assumption. Just like depth comparison is meaningless between engines, node comparison is meaningless between engines. The only time it's valid it's when they're derived from the same engine (so it makes sense to compare the nodes of Black Diamond with the nodes of ShashChess), otherwise, any conclusion coming from nodes comparison could be the opposite of truth (mainly, we don't have Komodo's sources, it could be deflating its nodes so it appears to have more advanced evaluation or whatever.)

S.Taylor
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Re: Sure no one here can beat this simple free smartphone engine!

Post by S.Taylor » Sun Aug 09, 2020 6:58 pm

Milos wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 1:32 am
S.Taylor wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 12:39 am
I'm sure this engine, for your pocket android, and free, is way way stronger than the monster deeper blue that beat kasparov in 1997.
I have no idea which engine is behind, but I played against SF fixed depth 10 and SF lost after some struggle. Than I tried SF depth 16 and it totally mopped the floor with chess.com app engine level 25.
Somehow I don't think that SF depth 16 would easily beat Carlsen or Kasparov. SF depth 16 makes on average around 2M nodes per move in opening. Around 10000 times less nodes than what Deep Blue was evaluating per move in opening.
How ever much slower the node count of the app at chess.com than deeper blue of 1997, i'm still sure that the this mere smartphone app would trounce deeper blue in every game, with simple android hardware (like samsung s9).
Deeper blue was still slighy primitive and experimental, and was not that great when given less power.
So if you ever had wishful dreams, 23 years ago, of touching such a computer, let alone owning one in your front room, well, you have tons better than that in your pocket!!!

Milos
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Re: Sure no one here can beat this simple free smartphone engine!

Post by Milos » Sun Aug 09, 2020 9:44 pm

S.Taylor wrote:
Sun Aug 09, 2020 6:58 pm
Milos wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 1:32 am
S.Taylor wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 12:39 am
I'm sure this engine, for your pocket android, and free, is way way stronger than the monster deeper blue that beat kasparov in 1997.
I have no idea which engine is behind, but I played against SF fixed depth 10 and SF lost after some struggle. Than I tried SF depth 16 and it totally mopped the floor with chess.com app engine level 25.
Somehow I don't think that SF depth 16 would easily beat Carlsen or Kasparov. SF depth 16 makes on average around 2M nodes per move in opening. Around 10000 times less nodes than what Deep Blue was evaluating per move in opening.
How ever much slower the node count of the app at chess.com than deeper blue of 1997, i'm still sure that the this mere smartphone app would trounce deeper blue in every game, with simple android hardware (like samsung s9).
Deeper blue was still slighy primitive and experimental, and was not that great when given less power.
So if you ever had wishful dreams, 23 years ago, of touching such a computer, let alone owning one in your front room, well, you have tons better than that in your pocket!!!
Your "simple android hardware" (like Samsung S9) is actually stronger than 50% of brand new budget laptops, not to mention older ones. Smartphone hardware made a huge progress in recent years, you seems not to be fully aware of it ;).
Droidfish (SF on Android) on S9 pulls like 5Mnps from a starting position. That is "only" 40 times less than Deep Blue. Considering that SF engine is at least 1000 Elo stronger than Deep Blue when searching the same number of nodes that simply means that SF on Android on virtually any smartphone that came out in last 5 years would totally destroy Deep Blue.
Chess.com app is a totally different story. It's not even GM level, i.e. any 2500 Elo engine would totally wipe a floor with it.

S.Taylor
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Re: Sure no one here can beat this simple free smartphone engine!

Post by S.Taylor » Mon Aug 10, 2020 1:19 pm

Doesn't look to me like its not gm level at instant, level 25.
Didn't someone say it's actually komodo?

(I personally used to be at least around 2300. I came to talkchess in the first place because of my craze for chess).

S.Taylor
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Location: Jerusalem Israel

Re: Sure no one here can beat this simple free smartphone engine!

Post by S.Taylor » Mon Aug 10, 2020 1:29 pm

Milos wrote:
Sun Aug 09, 2020 9:44 pm
S.Taylor wrote:
Sun Aug 09, 2020 6:58 pm
Milos wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 1:32 am
S.Taylor wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 12:39 am

Your "simple android hardware" (like Samsung S9) is actually stronger than 50% of brand new budget laptops, not to mention older ones. Smartphone hardware made a huge progress in recent years, you seems not to be fully aware of it ;).
Thanks. I didn't realize that.

Chessqueen
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Full name: Nancy M Pichardo

Re: Sure no one here can beat this simple free smartphone engine!

Post by Chessqueen » Tue Aug 11, 2020 12:39 pm

S.Taylor wrote:
Mon Aug 10, 2020 1:29 pm
Milos wrote:
Sun Aug 09, 2020 9:44 pm
S.Taylor wrote:
Sun Aug 09, 2020 6:58 pm
Milos wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 1:32 am
S.Taylor wrote:
Sun Aug 02, 2020 12:39 am

Your "simple android hardware" (like Samsung S9) is actually stronger than 50% of brand new budget laptops, not to mention older ones. Smartphone hardware made a huge progress in recent years, you seems not to be fully aware of it ;).
Thanks. I didn't realize that.
I also have a Samsung Galaxy S9+, and I will play a few games with Droifish which is Stockfish against Samsung Cromebook Plus with an intel 1.5 to see which is stronger, and I heard that my other Cell phone the iphone Xs Max which I can Download SmallFish is even stronger than my S9+. :roll:

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M ANSARI
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Re: Sure no one here can beat this simple free smartphone engine!

Post by M ANSARI » Tue Aug 11, 2020 2:31 pm

I have the Chess.com application for Iphone and it estimates that on full power it rated 3000 ELO + with even one thread. On my Iphone it gives me the option of 3 threads. I am guessing this is probably a SF android version. If so, this would make it incredibly strong and I doubt even top GM's would have a chance. You have to realize that hardware is not the only thing that has dramatically improved with chess engines ... the software also has become incredibly strong. This is especially true now that there is a NN version of SF. I think on Iphone a version of SF today would wipe out Deep Blue of years back even though DB hardware is much more powerful.

Chessqueen
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Full name: Nancy M Pichardo

Re: Sure no one here can beat this simple free smartphone engine!

Post by Chessqueen » Wed Aug 12, 2020 12:47 pm

M ANSARI wrote:
Tue Aug 11, 2020 2:31 pm
I have the Chess.com application for Iphone and it estimates that on full power it rated 3000 ELO + with even one thread. On my Iphone it gives me the option of 3 threads. I am guessing this is probably a SF android version. If so, this would make it incredibly strong and I doubt even top GM's would have a chance. You have to realize that hardware is not the only thing that has dramatically improved with chess engines ... the software also has become incredibly strong. This is especially true now that there is a NN version of SF. I think on Iphone a version of SF today would wipe out Deep Blue of years back even though DB hardware is much more powerful.
I would first like to say that the engine in chess.com is Komodo, NOT Stockfish.
Now I I said a few days ago that I was going to pit Samsung Galaxy S9+, using Droidfish which is Stockfish against Samsung Chromebook Plus with an intel 1.5 to see which is stronger I only play 5 games at T/C 10+5 sec increment S9+ Won 3.5 out of 5 games. I Believe that Droidfish with S9+ is as strong as a Chromebook with an i5, But My other Cell phone iphone Xs Max with smallfish = to stockfish for Aple is equal to a Chromebook with i7 CPU. I also played 5 games between S9+ Vs iphone Xs Max the total score ended in 3 to 5 in favor of the iphone. but the S9+ almost did not win the only game if it was NOT for the excellent opening Book Goi 6.2.3.

Smallfish for Stockfish: Best Chess App for iPhone?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jkYkrDTmgbw

Here is the Goi Opening Book for Android only reason why S9+ won the single game versus my iphones Xs Max https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ah0Dn0p6bMU

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towforce
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Location: Birmingham UK

Re: Sure no one here can beat this simple free smartphone engine!

Post by towforce » Wed Aug 12, 2020 5:03 pm

Chessqueen wrote:
Wed Aug 12, 2020 12:47 pm
Now I I said a few days ago that I was going to pit Samsung Galaxy S9+, using Droidfish which is Stockfish against Samsung Chromebook Plus with an intel 1.5 to see which is stronger I only play 5 games at T/C 10+5 sec increment S9+ Won 3.5 out of 5 games.

I would expect that result. I cannot praise Chromebooks highly enough, and in general, they're a great choice of laptop (or maybe a spare device for casual use in the TV room while watching dramas), and so many Windows issues just simply don't even exist on a Chromebook! They can even do general video editing reasonably well (if you're a professional who does heavy video editing, probably choose a different device). However, if you're planning to do tasks that require intensive processing, they're probably not the best choice: if I was obliged to do processor intensive work on a Chromebook, I would consider using my free cloud processing units and farm the actual processing to there! :)
The future is more important than the past.

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