New chess rig

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cma6
Posts: 178
Joined: Thu May 29, 2014 3:58 pm

New chess rig

Post by cma6 » Sat Jul 25, 2020 1:37 am

I'm considering building a new chess rig built around either the AMD Threadripper 3960X 3.7 GHz 24-Core Processor or
AMD Threadripper 3970X 3.7 GHz 32-Core Processor. Here is a first cut at other components and would appreciate advice from the expert builders.

CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-U14S TR4-SP3

Mobo: ASUS AMD AM4 ROG X570 Crosshair VIII Hero (Wi-Fi) ATX

Memory: G.Skill Trident Z RGB 128 GB (8 x 32 GB) DDR4-3200 CL16

2 X Intel 660p Series 1 TB M.2-2280 NVME SSD

Video Card: Asus GeForce GTX 1650 4 GB Phoenix OC

Since I am expecting game changing GPUs from AMD in the near future, there is no high end GPU in the system.

Can I do with slower RAM than the very expensive G.Skill 128 GB kit?

What about the mobo for high end TR chip?

Thanks in advance, CMA

Milos
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Joined: Wed Nov 25, 2009 12:47 am

Re: New chess rig

Post by Milos » Sat Jul 25, 2020 1:42 am

cma6 wrote:
Sat Jul 25, 2020 1:37 am
Since I am expecting game changing GPUs from AMD in the near future, there is no high end GPU in the system.
So basically you don't plan playing A-titled video games before RDNA2 comes out? I guess you are on a wrong forum. This one is about computer chess. AMD GPUs (present and future) are as relevant in chess/AI/ML as kitchen toasters. ;)

Zenmastur
Posts: 907
Joined: Sat May 31, 2014 6:28 am

Re: New chess rig

Post by Zenmastur » Sat Jul 25, 2020 2:32 am

cma6 wrote:
Sat Jul 25, 2020 1:37 am
I'm considering building a new chess rig built around either the AMD Threadripper 3960X 3.7 GHz 24-Core Processor or
AMD Threadripper 3970X 3.7 GHz 32-Core Processor. Here is a first cut at other components and would appreciate advice from the expert builders.

CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-U14S TR4-SP3

Mobo: ASUS AMD AM4 ROG X570 Crosshair VIII Hero (Wi-Fi) ATX

Memory: G.Skill Trident Z RGB 128 GB (8 x 32 GB) DDR4-3200 CL16

2 X Intel 660p Series 1 TB M.2-2280 NVME SSD

Video Card: Asus GeForce GTX 1650 4 GB Phoenix OC

Since I am expecting game changing GPUs from AMD in the near future, there is no high end GPU in the system.

Can I do with slower RAM than the very expensive G.Skill 128 GB kit?

What about the mobo for high end TR chip?

Thanks in advance, CMA
AMD ZEN CPU's benefit from faster memory upto about 3600Mhz or so. If you are going to use Noctua's NH-U14S make sure you get low profile ram that will actually fit under the 140mm fan. If the memory is too tall it will require the fan to be mounted much higher on the cooler, so it will be less effective. In addition, if you have a "normal" case you may not be able to put the side on with the fan in this position. There are cases that are wide enough to allow this to work, but mounting the fan that high isn't good for keeping the CPU cool. You could reduce the fan to 120mm but these aren't nearly as good with this cooler because of the heat-pipe locations. I would also buy a second 140mm fan for a push-pull configuration. Noctua includes a second mounting clip for another fan.

If you plan on upgrading to 256Gb in the future (I always plan on maxing the ram at some point) it's better to get 4x32GB sticks and NOT 8x16Gb sticks.

You don't need a high end MB. For most people there is little to no advantage. Unless the high end board has a feature you can't do without and no other board has this feature it's a waste of money IMHO. Just make sure it has a "good" VRM and several M.2 PCIe slots and you're good to go.

Make sure you spec the power supply with enough power for the CPU and any future GPU's you plan to install. Warning: the new Nvidia GPU's are real power hogs. So if there are multiple GPU's in your future buy a PS with enough to handle the expected requirements.

Good luck with the build!

Regards,

Zenmastur
Only 2 defining forces have ever offered to die for you.....Jesus Christ and the American Soldier. One died for your soul, the other for your freedom.

brianr
Posts: 441
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 2:01 pm

Re: New chess rig

Post by brianr » Sat Jul 25, 2020 4:49 am

I'm no expert, but here are some comments, FWIW.

SSDs in the M2 slots are great, so the slots are very valuable.
2TB SSDs are worth the premium, IMHO, depending on what you are doing.

Syzygy 6 piece alone will use 150GB. I also have another 200GB used for a few of the most popular 7 men files.
Most of my time is spent training nets which requires a LOT of input sample data, and the read speed can be a bottleneck.
Of course, your use case may well be quite different.

My system disk is a smaller 512GB SSD with Win10 and Ubuntu partitions.
There are somewhat different "rules" for SSDs used as system disk.
For capacity, 4TB HDDs are working well.

Been very happy with the Noctuas also, both 1 and 2 fan setups, but as was noted case size and memory room can be an issue. I had to remove RAM fins. the first time.

If you are at all interested in NN engines near term (other than SF-NNUE which is CPU) before getting a better one, that graphics card is quite low-end. EVGA b-stock Nvidia RTX GPUs are on sale most Wednesdays. An RTX 2060 is typically $300 and the best price/performance at the moment. Leela now supports AMD GPUs quite well with the DX12 backend. Intel just announced delays; perhaps other vendors will be pushing back new products too.

Lastly, as was mentioned, the power supply is no place to cut costs.
Having had several finally fail, fully modular makes replacing much easier.

Milos
Posts: 3824
Joined: Wed Nov 25, 2009 12:47 am

Re: New chess rig

Post by Milos » Sat Jul 25, 2020 6:24 am

brianr wrote:
Sat Jul 25, 2020 4:49 am
If you are at all interested in NN engines near term (other than SF-NNUE which is CPU) before getting a better one, that graphics card is quite low-end. EVGA b-stock Nvidia RTX GPUs are on sale most Wednesdays. An RTX 2060 is typically $300 and the best price/performance at the moment. Leela now supports AMD GPUs quite well with the DX12 backend. Intel just announced delays; perhaps other vendors will be pushing back new products too.
Hehe, runs quite well is quite an overstatement. Could you give us typical benchmark number of T60 net on RX 5700 XT for example? Should be comparable to similarly priced RTX 2070S, except it's nowhere near ;).

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M ANSARI
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Re: New chess rig

Post by M ANSARI » Sat Jul 25, 2020 6:45 am

I am in the same boat and went on Newegg yesterday to sort out a system. I already have a RTX 2080Ti card and 1200 watt PS and a box able to handle extended ATX motherboards and of course a good monitor. Basically I went with the following

1. Threadripper 3970x
2. Fractal Design S36 water coolign
3. GIGABYTE TRX40 AORUS MASTER sTRX4 AMD TRX40 SATA 6Gb/s Extended ATX AMD Motherboard (I always found MSI and GIgabyte mobos as the most stable)
4. 2 x Corsair MP600 SSD's @ 1TB each (plan is to have them in a RAID 0 array for highest possible speed)
5. CORSAIR Vengeance LPX 64GB (4 x 16GB) 288-Pin DDR4 SDRAM DDR4 2400 (I can add another 4 x 16GB if I need later ... although I think no need)
6. WD Gold 12TB Enterprise Class Hard Disk Drive - 7200 RPM Class SATA 6Gb/s 256MB Cache 3.5 Inch

I already have a Synology backup system with 40TB backup for my house so no need for redundancy on my HDD as Synology already backs up all computers at home. Would be nice to add some faster networking ability as I already wired up my house with Cat 6a cable ... so maybe I will upgrade network to 10G. I still haven't bought this but that is where I got started and I just need to check that everything is compatible and maybe some things need changing. I used to really go crazy with builds and have Vapor Cooling ... but these days I just want the ultimate 100% stability. The sticker shock is pretty high though and maybe not for everyone.

Ras
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Re: New chess rig

Post by Ras » Sat Jul 25, 2020 7:56 am

cma6 wrote:
Sat Jul 25, 2020 1:37 am
Mobo: ASUS AMD AM4 ROG X570 Crosshair VIII Hero (Wi-Fi) ATX
Memory: G.Skill Trident Z RGB 128 GB (8 x 32 GB) DDR4-3200 CL16
That won't work because the mobo has only four RAM slots, like every mobo that isn't a server one designed for server (registered) RAM.
Rasmus Althoff
https://www.ct800.net

Zenmastur
Posts: 907
Joined: Sat May 31, 2014 6:28 am

Re: New chess rig

Post by Zenmastur » Sat Jul 25, 2020 8:55 am

Ras wrote:
Sat Jul 25, 2020 7:56 am
cma6 wrote:
Sat Jul 25, 2020 1:37 am
Mobo: ASUS AMD AM4 ROG X570 Crosshair VIII Hero (Wi-Fi) ATX
Memory: G.Skill Trident Z RGB 128 GB (8 x 32 GB) DDR4-3200 CL16
That won't work because the mobo has only four RAM slots, like every mobo that isn't a server one designed for server (registered) RAM.
I didn't even notice the MB he picked isn't even the right socket for the CPU!

LOL! :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

I suggest he picks a MB that actually supports the CPU he plans to get!
Only 2 defining forces have ever offered to die for you.....Jesus Christ and the American Soldier. One died for your soul, the other for your freedom.

Ras
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Re: New chess rig

Post by Ras » Sat Jul 25, 2020 9:19 am

Zenmastur wrote:
Sat Jul 25, 2020 8:55 am
I didn't even notice the MB he picked isn't even the right socket for the CPU!
Oh, me neither - but yeah, the mobo offers AM4 while Threadripper requires the sTRX4 socket.

On top of that, the Noctua NH-U14S TR4-SP3 cooler is rated for 180W TDP while the 3970X and 3960X are listed with 280W TDP, so the cooling looks underdimensioned. Maybe a Thermalright Silver Arrow TR4 with up to 320W would be better, but that won't be silent at full speed, of course. Water cooling could be an alternative.
Rasmus Althoff
https://www.ct800.net

jdart
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Re: New chess rig

Post by jdart » Sat Jul 25, 2020 9:47 am

I am also building a Threadripper system. I considered an Epyc CPU instead: not as fast but can be more easily air-cooled and may be a better choice for 24/7 operation. But the Epyc CPUs are quite costly and significantly slower.

I did not want to use water cooling. Everything I've read indicates that water coolers have reliability problems I am using this cooler: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07J5 ... UTF8&psc=1 and a lot of case fans.

--Jon

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