Elo - elo - ELO

Discussion of anything and everything relating to chess playing software and machines.

Moderators: bob, hgm, Harvey Williamson

Forum rules
This textbox is used to restore diagrams posted with the [d] tag before the upgrade.
User avatar
Ovyron
Posts: 3348
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2007 2:30 am

Re: Elo - elo - ELO

Post by Ovyron » Mon Jan 06, 2020 3:11 pm

MikeB wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 2:47 pm
So maybe it should be lower case when used in that context and upper case when when talking about the rating system.
Why are people so obsessed on making some things being right and others being wrong? Is it because they feel satisfaction when someone else does it in the "wrong" way and they correct them? Is it because of the feeling of control that they get when people that used to be free about doing things now do them in their "right" way?

I don't get what creating a circlejerk of people that decide how Elo/elo/ELO should be spelled like depending on the context, just so they can point out to other people they're doing it wrong, would achieve, other than making people feel bad (and ignorant, and stuff.) I just hope the satisfaction people get when correcting others is worth it, is it like winning chess games?

smatovic
Posts: 1086
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2010 9:18 pm
Location: Hamburg, Germany
Full name: Srdja Matovic
Contact:

Re: Elo - elo - ELO

Post by smatovic » Mon Jan 06, 2020 4:45 pm

Ovyron wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 3:11 pm
MikeB wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 2:47 pm
So maybe it should be lower case when used in that context and upper case when when talking about the rating system.
Why are people so obsessed on making some things being right and others being wrong? Is it because they feel satisfaction when someone else does it in the "wrong" way and they correct them? Is it because of the feeling of control that they get when people that used to be free about doing things now do them in their "right" way?

I don't get what creating a circlejerk of people that decide how Elo/elo/ELO should be spelled like depending on the context, just so they can point out to other people they're doing it wrong, would achieve, other than making people feel bad (and ignorant, and stuff.) I just hope the satisfaction people get when correcting others is worth it, is it like winning chess games?
Daer Oyrvon,

the fnnuy tnhig aubot wtretin wrods is dieptse its ntotioan most plepoe are able
to get what you wish to say. Ntrheelsvees some knid of sdnaatrd smees ufuesl,
sniayg that, I, slef-dcereald master of the Elo noatotin, ganrt you hbeery the
rgiht to use wahveetr noaotitn sutis you.

--
Srdja

crem
Posts: 151
Joined: Wed May 23, 2018 7:29 pm

Re: Elo - elo - ELO

Post by crem » Mon Jan 06, 2020 6:34 pm

MikeB wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 2:47 pm
crem wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 10:04 am
Unlike "ampere, watt, newton, etc.", Elo is not a unit of measure, it's a name of a rating system.
It has become both , people talking about gaining or losing elo all the time. So maybe it should be lower case when used in that context and upper case when when talking about the rating system. For those of us who remember when Arpad was alive, it's not natural to use his name in lower case - even for me in the above sentence.
People still don't use it as countable noun, like they would if it was unit of measure. People don't say "I lost 30 elos".
I think people still mean "Elo rating" when they say "ELO", similarly to like people sometimes mean "IP address" when they say "IP".

MikeB
Posts: 3704
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 5:34 am
Location: Pen Argyl, Pennsylvania

Re: Elo - elo - ELO

Post by MikeB » Mon Jan 06, 2020 10:33 pm

crem wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 6:34 pm
MikeB wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 2:47 pm
crem wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 10:04 am
Unlike "ampere, watt, newton, etc.", Elo is not a unit of measure, it's a name of a rating system.
It has become both , people talking about gaining or losing elo all the time. So maybe it should be lower case when used in that context and upper case when when talking about the rating system. For those of us who remember when Arpad was alive, it's not natural to use his name in lower case - even for me in the above sentence.
People still don't use it as countable noun, like they would if it was unit of measure. People don't say "I lost 30 elos".
I think people still mean "Elo rating" when they say "ELO", similarly to like people sometimes mean "IP address" when they say "IP".
Actually to the contrary , at least with engine developers , patches are often referred as to “gaining 2.7 Elo” or “losing 1.3 Elo” , et. . ( note: not ‘Elos’). Under those circumstances , it is often referred to and used as a unit of measurement.

Dann Corbit
Posts: 10291
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2006 7:57 pm
Location: Redmond, WA USA
Contact:

Re: Elo - elo - ELO

Post by Dann Corbit » Tue Jan 07, 2020 5:25 pm

Elo is Correct. ELO and elo are ignorance.
That having been said, I've probably made both mistakes.
It's like degrees Celsius. Would you write CELCIUS or celcius?
Taking ideas is not a vice, it is a virtue. We have another word for this. It is called learning.
But sharing ideas is an even greater virtue. We have another word for this. It is called teaching.

User avatar
Kotlov
Posts: 215
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 7:23 pm
Location: Russia

Re: Elo - elo - ELO

Post by Kotlov » Tue Jan 07, 2020 8:00 pm

Dann Corbit wrote:
Tue Jan 07, 2020 5:25 pm
Elo is Correct. ELO and elo are ignorance.
That having been said, I've probably made both mistakes.
It's like degrees Celsius. Would you write CELCIUS or celcius?
℃ the best choice ))

I propose "É" as symbol.
example +20É ))
Eugene Kotlov
Hedgehog 2.0 64-bit coming soon...

User avatar
Ovyron
Posts: 3348
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2007 2:30 am

Re: Elo - elo - ELO

Post by Ovyron » Wed Jan 08, 2020 2:46 am

Dann Corbit wrote:
Tue Jan 07, 2020 5:25 pm
Elo is Correct.
I guess doing otherwise would get one an F in some exam? Or fired by a boss?

Being wrong has consequences, saying ELO or elo doesn't, other than getting under the skin of people that are looking for something to get offended about, but, if they like getting offended then one just saves them time by spelling Elo "incorrectly".

IMO, YMMV :P

smatovic
Posts: 1086
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2010 9:18 pm
Location: Hamburg, Germany
Full name: Srdja Matovic
Contact:

Re: Elo - elo - ELO

Post by smatovic » Wed Jan 08, 2020 6:56 am

Ovyron wrote:
Wed Jan 08, 2020 2:46 am
Dann Corbit wrote:
Tue Jan 07, 2020 5:25 pm
Elo is Correct.
I guess doing otherwise would get one an F in some exam? Or fired by a boss?

Being wrong has consequences, saying ELO or elo doesn't, other than getting under the skin of people that are looking for something to get offended about, but, if they like getting offended then one just saves them time by spelling Elo "incorrectly".

IMO, YMMV :P
Writing ELO and elo has consequences. When I entered this chess community I was
confused by the different spellings, and I simply concluded that it must be some
kind of abbreviation like CPU/cpu and did not bother to look up and started to
imitate the spelling without knowing better...

--
Srdja

User avatar
Ovyron
Posts: 3348
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2007 2:30 am

Re: Elo - elo - ELO

Post by Ovyron » Wed Jan 08, 2020 11:32 am

smatovic wrote:
Wed Jan 08, 2020 6:56 am
Writing ELO and elo has consequences. When I entered this chess community I was
confused by the different spellings, and I simply concluded that it must be some
kind of abbreviation like CPU/cpu and did not bother to look up and started to
imitate the spelling without knowing better...
So, the only consequence was that you were spelling it "incorrectly"?

Good grief, they surely could have made us a favor and made ELO and elo correct "alternative ways", but no... you have to teach something to kids, and it must include a way to be wrong so kids can be ranked, kids that are more right have more value than kids that are less right, you know...

smatovic
Posts: 1086
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2010 9:18 pm
Location: Hamburg, Germany
Full name: Srdja Matovic
Contact:

Re: Elo - elo - ELO

Post by smatovic » Wed Jan 08, 2020 12:46 pm

Ovyron wrote:
Wed Jan 08, 2020 11:32 am
smatovic wrote:
Wed Jan 08, 2020 6:56 am
Writing ELO and elo has consequences. When I entered this chess community I was
confused by the different spellings, and I simply concluded that it must be some
kind of abbreviation like CPU/cpu and did not bother to look up and started to
imitate the spelling without knowing better...
So, the only consequence was that you were spelling it "incorrectly"?

Good grief, they surely could have made us a favor and made ELO and elo correct "alternative ways", but no... you have to teach something to kids, and it must include a way to be wrong so kids can be ranked, kids that are more right have more value than kids that are less right, you know...
Funny, you really don't get it.

The point is that I thought it was an abbreviation cos people like you used ELO
instead of Elo, and there was no-one who corrected you, and I continued in a
wrong belief to do something right, and no-one corrected me. Maybe you can sense
a principle in this story, maybe not, at least I tried...

--
Srdja

Locked