Kornrade Test

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MikeGL
Posts: 1010
Joined: Thu Sep 01, 2011 2:49 pm

Re: Kornrade Test

Post by MikeGL »

kasinp wrote: ↑Tue Sep 18, 2018 5:05 pm
zullil wrote: ↑Thu Sep 13, 2018 12:14 pm 17 Fishing Rod == [FEN "8/1B3b1p/7P/p2p4/P2pp1kp/Q7/1N1Pq2P/7K w - - 0 1"]

[d]8/1B3b1p/7P/p2p4/P2pp1kp/Q7/1N1Pq2P/7K w - - 0 1

Stockfish-dev solves this one, at about depth 60 on 20 cores. So I'd rate this one a 2; Stockfish seemed very confused for a long time.

Pretty study!
Houdini 6.03 on 14 cores gets this one in just over one minute and does see the draw. Seems it is able to zoom in on the solution quicker.
PK
By enabling No_Null_Moves, McBrain v3.0 (old TCEC Version) also gets the draw on my
slow laptop (Dual Core 2.0 Ghz) in less than 30 seconds. Tried 5 runs and hash cleared per run and it always gets it in under 30 seconds.
I told my wife that a husband is like a fine wine; he gets better with age. The next day, she locked me in the cellar.
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Dann Corbit
Posts: 12541
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2006 8:57 pm
Location: Redmond, WA USA

Re: Kornrade Test

Post by Dann Corbit »

Dann Corbit wrote: ↑Mon Sep 17, 2018 9:00 pm
Dann Corbit wrote: ↑Sat Sep 15, 2018 1:19 am I have some engines taking a peek at these positions over the weekend.
We'll see how well they did on Monday.
Engines used on moderately strong machines for one hour are: Stockfish (bleeding edge development version), Matefinder, McCain, Sting10 (crashed 2/3 of the way through), Houdini 6 Tactical 1.

Solved by move choice (05 has a bad score, but it stays put for many iterations):

Code: Select all

5k2/2p4p/6P1/1p3n2/3q4/PB4BN/KP5P/8 w - - acd 73; bm Ng5; c3 "Ng5"; ce 432; id "* Smothering II +-"; pm Ng5; pv Ng5; 
3k4/2pq3p/pp5R/4P3/P6P/2PN4/1PN3K1/8 w - - acd 64; bm Nd4; c1 "Hard"; c3 "Nd4"; ce 723; id "01 Constrictor  +-"; pm Nd4; pv Nd4; 
6Nk/pp2Np1p/2p2Pp1/2R2bP1/7K/P7/1q1n1Q2/5n2 w - - acd 69; bm Rxf5; c1 "diff=9"; c3 "Rxf5"; ce 1155; id "02 Mirror       +-"; pm Rxf5; pv Rxf5 gxf5; 
5B1q/3N3p/p3p2p/7k/B7/5PP1/K6P/8 w - - acd 56; bm Ne5; c3 "Ne5"; ce 32582; id "03 Walk         +-"; pm Ne5; pv Ne5 Qxf8 f4 Qd8 Bc6 Qd2+ Kb3 Qd1+ Kc3 Qe1+ Kc4 Qc1+ Kb4 Qb2+ Kc5 Qa3+ Kb6 Qd6 Kb7 Qe7+ Kc8 Qf8+ Kd7 Qg7+ Kxe6 Qg8+ Kf5 Qc8+ Ke4 Qd8 Ke3 Qb6+ Kf3 Qb3+ Kg2 Qc2+ Kh3 Qf5+ g4+ Qxg4+ Nxg4 Kg6 Be4+ Kf7 Bxh7 h5 Kh4 Ke7 Ne5 Kd8 Bd3 a5 Nc6+ Kc7 Nxa5 Kc8 Kxh5 Kd8 f5 Kd7 h3 Ke7 h4 Kf6 Nb3 Ke7 f6+ Kf7 Na1 Kg8 f7+ Kf8; 
8/b4kp1/2p1p3/5pB1/p1PP4/1p6/3K1P2/3N4 w - - acd 75; bm Kc3; c3 "Kc3"; ce -396; id "05 Stubbornness =="; pm Kc3; pv Kc3 Bxd4+ Kxd4 b2 Nxb2 a3 Nd3 a2 Ne5+ Ke8 f4 a1=Q+ Kc5 Qh1 Kd6 c5 Kxe6 Qd1 Bh4 Qb3 Bg5 Qa3 Kxf5 Qh3+ Ke4 Qe6 Ke3 Qf5 Kf3 Qb1 Kg4 Qd1+ Kg3 g6 Kh4 Qd6 Kg3 Qd4 Kf3 Qd1+ Ke3 Qh1 Ke2 Qg2+ Ke3 Qh3+ Kf2 Qh2+ Kf3 Qc2 Ke3 Kf8 Kf3 Qd1+ Kg3 Qd4 Kg4 Kg7 Kh3 Qe4 Kg3 Qe3+ Kg4 Qf2 Kh3 Qc2 Kg3 Qe4 Kg4 Qg2+ Kh4 Kf8 Bf6 Qh1+ Kg3 Qe1+ Kg4 Qe4 Kg3 Qe3+ Kg4 Qb3 Bh4 Ke8 Bg5 Qe3 Bh4 Qg1+ Kf3 Qd1+ Kg2 Qe2+ Kg3 Qc2 Bg5 Qe4 Kg4; 
q7/b1p5/kp1p4/p2PN3/PPP5/1K6/8/5B2 w - - acd 92; bm c5+; c1 "Hard"; c3 "c5+"; ce 1892; id "08 Slowness     +-"; pm c5+; pv c5+ Kb7 Ba6+ Kxa6 b5+ Kb7 c6+ Kc8 Nf7 Kb8 Kc4 Kc8 Kc3 Bb8 Kc2 Qa7 Kb3 Qa8 Kc4 Ba7; 
1N4K1/1pp1p3/7k/2r3pP/p2pp1P1/P6N/8/2B5 w - - acd 47; bm Nc6; c0 "http://www.chessvideos.tv/forum/viewtopic.php?t=10770"; c3 "Nc6"; ce 0; id "09 Standstill   =="; pm Nc6; pv Nc6 bxc6 Nxg5 Rxg5+ Kh8 e3 Bxe3 d3 Bf4 c5 Bc1 e5 Bf4 c4 Bc1 c3 Be3 e4 Bd2 cxd2; 
4B3/k1K1pp2/p3bq2/2p1p3/1p2P1P1/4P2Q/nR6/8 w - - acd 53; bm g5; c3 "g5"; ce 0; id "10 Shelter      =="; pm g5; pv g5 Qxg5 Qxe6 fxe6 Rxa2 Qg8 Ra4 Qxe8 Rxa6+ Kxa6; 
4N2k/4PB1p/7P/B1p5/2P5/3q2Pp/1P3P1K/2r5 w - - acd 62; bm Bc3+; c3 "Bc3+"; ce 696; id "11 Chase        +-"; pm Bc3+; pv Bc3+; 
2b5/1pr4p/3bp1pk/1p6/1PpN2PP/K1P1n3/P3N1R1/3R4 w - - acd 58; bm Nxb5; c3 "Nxb5"; ce 0; id "12 Desperation  =="; pm Nxb5; pv Nxb5 Nxd1 Nxd6 e5 Nxc8 Rxc8 Ka4 Ra8+ Kb5 Rxa2 Rg1 Nf2 Ng3 Nxg4 Kb6 Nf6 Kxb7 Rc2 Kc6 Rxc3 b5 Rb3 b6 c3 Rc1 Ng8 b7 Ne7+ Kc7 Nd5+ Kd6 Nf4 Kc7; 
3B2r1/n3Pp2/P7/5k1p/q3NP2/7K/5P2/4NB2 w - - acd 56; bm Nf6; c3 "Nf6"; ce 299; id "14 Fork-field   +-"; pm Nf6; pv Nf6 Rh8; 
8/q1p1N1p1/3p1p1p/pk5P/1p2BB2/8/PK3P2/8 w - - acd 86; bm Be3; c3 "Be3"; ce 170; id "15 Harassment   +-"; pm Be3; pv Be3; 
6kq/2p4p/6P1/5nN1/K7/2P5/7B/3B4 w - - acd 63; bm Bb3+; c3 "Bb3+"; ce 1814; id "16 Smothering   +-"; pm Bb3+; pv Bb3+; 
8/1B3b1p/7P/p2p4/P2pp1kp/Q7/1N1Pq2P/7K w - - acd 61; bm Qh3+; c3 "Qh3+"; ce 0; id "17 Fishing Rod  =="; pm Qh3+; pv Qh3+ Kxh3 Bc8+ Qg4 Nd1 e3 d3 Bg6 Bf5 Bh5 Be6 Be8 Bd7 Qxd7 Nf2+ exf2; 
8/pr1Pq3/br1kP3/1R2RQ2/5p2/1nPK4/5P2/8 w - - acd 67; bm Qxf4; c3 "Qxf4"; ce 0; id "19 Evil Eye     =="; pm Qxf4; pv Qxf4 Rxb5 Rxb5+ Kxe6 Qc4+ Kxd7 Rxb7+ Bxb7 Qxb3 Qe4+ Kd2 Qf4+ Ke1 Bc6 Qb4 Qc1+ Ke2 Qa1 Qb3 Qa5 Qf7+ Kc8 Qf8+ Kc7 Qf4+ Kb7 Qb4+ Qxb4 cxb4; 
4b3/5p2/2p4p/P1p1PN2/2pn2P1/P2k4/Pr1npKN1/B7 w - - acd 62; bm Ne1+; c3 "Ne1+"; ce 0; id "20 Roundabout   +-"; pm Ne1+; pv Ne1+ Kc3 Ng3 Bd7 a6 Bc8 a7 Bb7 Kg2 Ba8 Kf2;
Not solved:
7q/b1p5/1p1Npkb1/pPP2ppP/P1P5/3B2P1/5P1R/K3R3 w - - acd 54; bm Nb7; c0 "http://www.yacpdb.org/#340530"; c1 "Hard"; c2 "Neghina, Mihai; Euxinus Pontus (13/E4) 2010-07"; c3 "hxg6"; ce 0; id "04 Detour +-"; pm Nb7; pv Nb7 Ke7+ Ka2 Qc3 Rd1 Qb4 Bc2 Qxc4+ Kb1 Qb4+ Ka2;
2k4N/Q1np4/2p2Bpp/1p1P4/pPP1p2P/P7/7q/1K6 w - - acd 55; bm Bb2; c3 "Nf7"; ce 0; id "06 Guard Change +-"; pm Bb2; pv Bb2 Qh3 dxc6 Qd3+ Ka2 Qxc4+ Ka1 Qf1+ Ka2;
8/4Pr1N/8/6PN/8/3K1ppp/4prkb/4Bbnn w - - acd 74; bm e8=Q; c3 "Nf8"; ce 0; id "13 Shield +-"; pm e8=Q; pv e8=Q Rd7+ Qxd7;
6k1/1qr1p2p/ppN5/3p1N2/6p1/1P1P2Pp/PP2PP1P/2RK4 w - - acd 51; bm Rc3; c3 "Ncxe7+"; ce -564; id "18 Stronghold =="; pm Rc3; pv Rc3 h5;
For the not solved positions, I tried analyzing the position after the solution move is performed. No help.

Code: Select all

2k4N/Q1np4/2p2Bpp/1p1P4/pPP1p2P/P7/7q/1K6 w - - acd 59; acs 7003; acn 111711952034; ce 0; bm dxc6; pv dxc6 dxc6 Bb2 Qh3 cxb5 Qd3+ Ka2 Qb3+ Ka1 Qd1+ Ka2;
2k5/Q1np1N2/2p2Bpp/1p1P4/pPP1p2P/P7/7q/1K6 b - - acd 63; acs 7229; acn 107865300722; ce 0; bm Qg3; pv Qg3 Be5 Qe1+ Ka2 Qe2+ Ka1 Qd1+ Kb2 Qd2+ Ka1;
5N2/4Pr2/8/6PN/8/3K1ppp/4prkb/4Bbnn b - - acd 119; acs 5751; acn 81754711310; ce 0; bm Rxf8; pv Rxf8 exf8Q;
8/4Pr1N/8/6PN/8/3K1ppp/4prkb/4Bbnn w - - acd 80; acs 7097; acn 94636349997; ce 0; bm e8Q; pv e8Q Rd7+ Qxd7;
6k1/1qr1N2p/pp6/3p1N2/6p1/1P1P2Pp/PP2PP1P/2RK4 b - - acd 20; acs 4; acn 5119874; ce 483; bm Kf8; pv Kf8 Rxc7 Qxc7 d4 Qd7 Kd2 Qb5 Ke3 Qa5 Kf4 Qd2+ Kxg4 Qxe2+ Kxh3 Kf7 Kg2 Ke6 b4 Qxb2 g4 Qxb4 Nc6 Qb1 Ne5 Qxa2 Nf3;
6k1/1qr1p2p/ppN5/3p1N2/6p1/1P1P2Pp/PP2PP1P/2RK4 w - - acd 43; acs 6373; acn 100204981924; ce -782; bm Rc3; pv Rc3 h5;
7q/b1p5/1p1Npkb1/pPP2ppP/P1P5/3B2P1/5P1R/K3R3 w - - acd 57; acs 6495; acn 97597643532; ce 0; bm Nb7; pv Nb7 Ke7+ Ka2 Qc3 Rd1 Qb4 Bc2 Qxc4+ Kb2 Qb4+ Bb3 bxc5 hxg6 c4 Nxa5 Qxa5 g7 Qb4 Rd7+ Kxd7 g8Q Qxb3+ Kc1 Qc3+ Kd1 Qd3+ Ke1 Qb1+ Ke2 Qd3+;
7q/b1p5/1p1NpkP1/pPP2pp1/P1P5/3B2P1/5P1R/K3R3 b - - acd 65; acs 6265; acn 109895671441; ce 0; bm Qxh2; pv Qxh2 Rxe6+ Kxe6 g7 Qh1+ Kb2 Qa8 Nxf5 Kf6 c6 Qe8 Kb3 Qe6 Be4 Qxe4 g8Q Qxf5 Qd8+ Kg6 Qxc7 Qd3+ Kb2 Qd2+ Kb3;
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But sharing ideas is an even greater virtue. We have another word for this. It is called teaching.
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lech
Posts: 1136
Joined: Sun Feb 14, 2010 10:02 pm

Re: Kornrade Test

Post by lech »

The author (YAPCDB) "Shield" solution is:
[pgn] [FEN "8/4Pr1N/8/6PN/8/3K1ppp/4prkb/4Bbnn w - - 0 1"] 1. Nf8 Rxf8 2. e8Q Rf7 3. Qe7 Rf6 4. Qe6 Rf5 5. Qe5 Rf8 6. Qd4 Rf5 {other moves lead to duals} 7. Kc2 Rc5 8. Kb3 Rb5 9. Ka4 Rf5 10. Qd8 Rf8 11. g6 Rf5 12. Qg5 Rf8 {I like 12... Rf7 much better} 13. g7 Rf7 14. g8N [/pgn]
A wonderful very deep study!
Maybe, I can't be friendly, but let me be useful.
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peter
Posts: 3186
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2008 7:38 am
Full name: Peter Martan

Re: Kornrade Test

Post by peter »

lech wrote: ↑Wed Sep 19, 2018 2:51 pm Give me the last chance!

[pgn] [FEN "8/4Pr1N/8/6PN/8/3K1ppp/4prkb/4Bbnn w - - 0 1"] 1. Nf8 Rxf8 2. e8Q Rf7 3. Qe7 Rf6 4. Qe6 Rf5 5. Qe5 Rf8 6. Qd4 Rf7 7. Kc2 Rc7 8. Kb3 Rf7 9. Qe5 Rb7 10. Ka4 Ra7 11. Qa5 Rf7 12. Qc7 Rf6 13. Qd6 Rf7 14. Qe7 Rf5 15. Qd8 Rf8 16. g6 Rf5 17. Qg5 Rf7 18. g7 Ra7 19. Qa5 Rf7 20. g8N Rf5 21. Ne7 Rxh5 22. Ng6 Rxa5 23. Bxa5 [/pgn]
Ok.
:)
In this one line you gave away only 4 moves, shortest way to mate might be 20.
After Backward (strongly forbidden way of solving of course :)) of Mihai's solution- line:

12: Mihai Neghina12 - Shield, White to move and win 9
8/4Pr1N/8/6PN/8/3K1ppp/4prkb/4Bbnn w - - 0 1

Analysis by MateFinder 120918 64:

1.Nf8 Rxf8 2.e8Q Rf7 3.Qe7 Rf6 4.Qe6 Rf8 5.Qd5 Rf6 6.Qd4 Rf7 7.Kc3 Rf6 8.Kb3 Rf5 9.Qd5 Rf7 10.Qd8 Rf5 11.Ka3 Rf6 12.g6 Rf5 13.Qg5 Rf7 14.Ka4 Rf5 15.g7 Rf8 16.g8N Ra8+ 17.Qa5 Rf8 18.Ne7 Rf6 19.Nd5 Ra6 20.Ne3#
+- (#20) Depth: 43/50 00:04:00 7159MN
Peter.
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Vinvin
Posts: 5228
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 9:40 am
Full name: Vincent Lejeune

Re: Kornrade Test

Post by Vinvin »

Vinvin wrote: ↑Wed Sep 19, 2018 2:35 pm
peter wrote: ↑Tue Sep 18, 2018 1:39 pm So you didn't get the demanded winning eval for 2 (Mirror), 6 (Guard Change), 16 (Smothering 2), and 20 (Roundabout) , nor the demanded drawing eval for 5 (Stubbornness) and 9 (Shelter). And that just among those at which the first move was found at all.
...
I started some 1 hour search for this 6 positions, trying to reach the theorical eval (+- or =) :

2 (Mirror) 1. Rxf5 ; +-
5 (Stubbornness) 1. Kc3 ; =
6 (Guard Change) 1. Nf7; +-
9 (Shelter) 1. g5 ; =
16 (Smothering 2) 1. Ng5; +-
20 (Roundabout) 1. Ne1+; +-

Results this evening.
After 1 hour (still with Stockfish_180910) :

Code: Select all

  1) Rc5xf5             Rc5xf5  * 0 Sec	       Rc5xf5  * 0 Sec	     Rc5xf5  * 0 Sec
  2) Kd2-c3             Kd2-c3  * 67 Sec       Kd2-c3  * 62 Sec	     Kd2-c3  * 83 Sec
  3) Nh8-f7             d5xc6    	       d5xc6    	     d5xc6    
  4) g4-g5              Rb2-d2   	       g4-g5   * 853 Sec     g4-g5   * 1089 Sec
  5) Nh3-g5             g6xh7    	       g6xh7    	     Nh3-g5  * 0 Sec
  6) Ng2-e1             Ng2-e1  * 0 Sec	       Ng2-e1  * 0 Sec	     Ng2-e1  * 0 Sec
Eval at the end of the search:

Code: Select all

 1 Rxf5	           67/12	34:21	23 851 894 156	11 569 356	 0,00	1.Rxf5  gxf5  2.Nh6  Nf3+  3.Qxf3  Qh2+  4.Qh3  Qf2+  5.Kh5  Qe2+  6.Kh4
 1 Rxf5	           69/12	52:50	36 317 614 347	11 453 629	 0,00	1.Rxf5  gxf5  2.Nh6  Nf3+  3.Qxf3  Qh2+  4.Qh3  Qf2+  5.Kh5  Qe2+  6.Kh4
 1 Rxf5	           70/14	59:20	43 267 378 177	12 153 672	 0,00	1.Rxf5  gxf5  2.Nh6  Nf3+  3.Qxf3  Qh2+  4.Qh3  Qf2+  5.Kh5  Qe2+  6.Kh4

 2 Kc3             75/91	48:48	31 413 016 113	10 727 023	-3,56	1.Kc3  Bxd4+  2.Kxd4  b2  3.Nxb2  a3  4.Nd3  a2  5.Ne5+  Ke8  6.f4  a1Q+  7.Kc5  Qa6  8.Kd6  Qc8  9.Be7  c5  10.Bh4  Kf8  11.Be7+  Kg8  12.Bh4  Kh7  13.Bg5  g6  14.Bh4  Kh6  15.Bg5+  Kg7  16.Bh4  Kh7  17.Bg5  Qf8+  18.Be7  Qb8+  19.Kxe6  Qc7  20.Bf6  Qa5  21.Be7  Qa3  22.Bf6  Qa6+  23.Kf7  Qc8  24.Bg5  Qg8+  25.Ke7  Qb8  26.Ke6  Qa7  27.Kd5  Kg8  28.Kd6  Qa3  29.Ke6  Qb4  30.Kd5  Kh7  31.Ke6  Qa4  32.Be7  Kg8  33.Bh4  Qa8  34.Be7  Qa6+  35.Kd5  Kh7  36.Bg5  Qa7  37.Ke6  Kg7  38.Kd5  Qa3  39.Ke6  Kg8  40.Kf6  Qa6+  41.Ke7  Kg7  42.Bh4  Qb6  43.Bg5  Qb4  44.Ke6  Qd2  45.Bf6+  Kh6
 2 Kc3             77/97	55:52	42 494 368 054	12 676 432	-3,77	1.Kc3  Bxd4+  2.Kxd4  b2  3.Nxb2  a3  4.Nd3  a2  5.Ne5+  Ke8  6.f4  a1Q+  7.Kc5  Qa6  8.Bh4  Qc8  9.Bg5  Qc7  10.Bh4  Kf8  11.Bg5  Kg8  12.Bh4  Kh7  13.Bg5  Qc8  14.Kd6  c5  15.Bh4  Kg8  16.Bg5  Kh8  17.Ng6+  Kh7  18.Ne5  g6  19.Ke7  Kg8  20.Bh4  Qa6  21.Bg5  Qb6  22.Bh4  Qb3  23.Kxe6  Qe3  24.Bg5  Qd4  25.Bh6  Qa1  26.Kd6  Qa7  27.Bg5  Kg7  28.Bd8  Qa3  29.Bg5  Qe3  30.Ke6  Qe2  31.Bf6+  Kh7  32.Bg5  Qg2  33.Bf6  Qb2  34.Bh4  Qd2  35.Bg5  Qc1  36.Kd5  Qe3  37.Ke6  Qa3  38.Kd5  Kg8  39.Kd6  Kg7  40.Ke6  Qa6+  41.Kd5  Qa7  42.Bh4  Qa3  43.Ke6  Qa6+  44.Kd5  Qa7  45.Bg5  Qc7  46.Nc6  Qb6  47.Be7  Kf7  48.Bg5  Qb7  49.Kxc5  Qc8
 2 Kc3             78/96	58:11	30 270 211 972	8 668 793	-4,06	1.Kc3  Bxd4+  2.Kxd4  b2  3.Nxb2  a3  4.Nd3  a2  5.Ne5+  Ke8  6.f4  a1Q+  7.Kc5  Qa6  8.Kd6  Qc8  9.Be7  c5  10.Bh4  Kf8  11.Bg5  Kg8  12.Bh4  Kh8  13.Be7  Kh7  14.Bg5  g6  15.Bf6  Qa8  16.Kxe6  Qe4  17.Bg5  Qd4  18.Kf6  Qd6+  19.Kf7  Qc7+  20.Ke6  Qa5  21.Kf7  Qc3  22.Be7  Qa1  23.Bg5  Qf1  24.Kf6  Qb1  25.Kf7  Qb3  26.Be7  Qb8  27.Bf6  Qg8+  28.Ke7  Qc8  29.Kf7  Qb8  30.Ke6  Qa8  31.Bg5  Kg8  32.Kd6  Qa3  33.Ke6  Qa6+  34.Kd5  Qa5  35.Ke6  Kg7  36.Bf6+  Kh6  37.Kf7  Qc7+  38.Ke6  Qb7  39.Bg5+  Kg7  40.Bf6+  Kg8  41.Be7  Qb6+  42.Kd5  Kh7  43.Bg5  Kg7  44.Be7  Qc7  45.Bg5  Qa7  46.Nc6  Qa3  47.Ne7  Kf7

 3 Nf7 	           58/10	54:15	38 134 537 393	11 712 703	 0,00	1.dxc6  dxc6  2.Bb2  Qh3  3.cxb5  Qd3+  4.Ka2  Qb3+  5.Kb1
 3 Nf7 	           58/12	54:28	39 340 619 569	12 035 673	 0,00	1.dxc6  dxc6  2.Bb2  Qh3  3.cxb5  Qd3+  4.Ka2  Qb3+  5.Ka1  Qd1+  6.Ka2
 3 Nf7 	           58/21	56:41	41 260 323 358	12 129 313	 0,00	1.dxc6  dxc6  2.Bb2  Qh3  3.cxb5  Qd3+  4.Kc1  Nxb5  5.Qxa4  e3  6.Qa8+  Kd7  7.Qb7+  Nc7  8.Be5  Qd2+  9.Kb1  Qd1+  10.Kb2  Qd2+

 4 g5 	           49/72-	54:52	40 456 638 267	12 289 275	-7,42	1.Rd2  Bc4
 4 g5 	           63/13	57:49	30 912 832 628	8 910 284	 0,00	1.g5  Qxg5  2.Qxe6  fxe6  3.Rxa2  Qg8  4.Ra5  c4  5.Ra4  Qxe8  6.Rxa6+  Kxa6
 4 g5 	           63/15	56:41	33 352 225 036	9 805 278	 0,00	1.g5  Qxg5  2.Qxe6  fxe6  3.Rxa2  Qg8  4.Ra4  b3  5.Ra3  c4  6.Ra4  Qxe8  7.Rxa6+  Kxa6

 5 Ng5	 	   66/76	37:57	18 581 932 295	8 158 089	 0,00	1.Ng5  Qh8  2.gxh7  Nxg3  3.hxg3  b4  4.a4  Ke7  5.Bg8  Qe5  6.g4  b3+  7.Bxb3  Qh2  8.Bg8  Qc2  9.Ka3  Qd3+  10.b3  Qc3  11.Ne4  Qa1+  12.Kb4  Kf8  13.Nc5  Qe1+  14.Kb5  Kg7  15.Ne6+  Kh8  16.g5  Qe2+  17.Kc6  Qf3+  18.Kb5
 5 Ng5	 	   70/18	59:20	33 474 874 353	9 402 243	 0,00	1.gxh7  Qh8  2.Ng5  Nxg3  3.hxg3  b4  4.axb4  Ke7  5.Kb1  Qf6  6.Bg8  Qd4  7.Nf7  Qd1+  8.Ka2  Qa4+  9.Kb1
 5 Ng5	 	   70/34	57:11	32 007 407 622	9 327 986	 0,00	1.gxh7  Qh8  2.Ng5  Nxg3  3.hxg3  b4  4.a4  Ke7  5.a5  Kf6  6.Ne4+  Kg6  7.Bg8  Qe5  8.Nc5  Kg7  9.Ne6+  Kh8  10.Nd8  b3+  11.Kxb3  Qb5+  12.Kc3  Qxa5+  13.b4  Qe5+  14.Kc4  Qe2+  15.Kc3

 6 Ne1+            60/12	39:27	22 375 285 436	9 452 439	 0,00	1.Ne1+  Kc3  2.Ng3  Bd7  3.a6  Bc8  4.a7  Bb7  5.Kg2  Ba8  6.Kf2
 6 Ne1+            60/12	55:34	27 258 505 007	8 174 102	 0,00	1.Ne1+  Kc3  2.Ng3  Bd7  3.a6  Bc8  4.a7  Bb7  5.Kg2  Ba8  6.Kf2
 6 Ne1+            63/12	58:51	33 636 319 436	9 525 213	 0,00	1.Ne1+  Kc3  2.Ng3  Bd7  3.a6  Bc8  4.a7  Bb7  5.Kg2  Ba8  6.Kf2
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peter
Posts: 3186
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2008 7:38 am
Full name: Peter Martan

Re: Kornrade Test

Post by peter »

Vinvin wrote: ↑Fri Sep 21, 2018 3:15 am After 1 hour (still with Stockfish_180910) :

Code: Select all

  1) Rc5xf5             Rc5xf5  * 0 Sec	       Rc5xf5  * 0 Sec	     Rc5xf5  * 0 Sec
  2) Kd2-c3             Kd2-c3  * 67 Sec       Kd2-c3  * 62 Sec	     Kd2-c3  * 83 Sec
  3) Nh8-f7             d5xc6    	       d5xc6    	     d5xc6    
  4) g4-g5              Rb2-d2   	       g4-g5   * 853 Sec     g4-g5   * 1089 Sec
  5) Nh3-g5             g6xh7    	       g6xh7    	     Nh3-g5  * 0 Sec
  6) Ng2-e1             Ng2-e1  * 0 Sec	       Ng2-e1  * 0 Sec	     Ng2-e1  * 0 Sec
Eval at the end of the search:

Code: Select all

 1 Rxf5	           67/12	34:21	23 851 894 156	11 569 356	 0,00	1.Rxf5  gxf5  2.Nh6  Nf3+  3.Qxf3  Qh2+  4.Qh3  Qf2+  5.Kh5  Qe2+  6.Kh4
 1 Rxf5	           69/12	52:50	36 317 614 347	11 453 629	 0,00	1.Rxf5  gxf5  2.Nh6  Nf3+  3.Qxf3  Qh2+  4.Qh3  Qf2+  5.Kh5  Qe2+  6.Kh4
 1 Rxf5	           70/14	59:20	43 267 378 177	12 153 672	 0,00	1.Rxf5  gxf5  2.Nh6  Nf3+  3.Qxf3  Qh2+  4.Qh3  Qf2+  5.Kh5  Qe2+  6.Kh4

 2 Kc3             75/91	48:48	31 413 016 113	10 727 023	-3,56	1.Kc3  Bxd4+  2.Kxd4  b2  3.Nxb2  a3  4.Nd3  a2  5.Ne5+  Ke8  6.f4  a1Q+  7.Kc5  Qa6  8.Kd6  Qc8  9.Be7  c5  10.Bh4  Kf8  11.Be7+  Kg8  12.Bh4  Kh7  13.Bg5  g6  14.Bh4  Kh6  15.Bg5+  Kg7  16.Bh4  Kh7  17.Bg5  Qf8+  18.Be7  Qb8+  19.Kxe6  Qc7  20.Bf6  Qa5  21.Be7  Qa3  22.Bf6  Qa6+  23.Kf7  Qc8  24.Bg5  Qg8+  25.Ke7  Qb8  26.Ke6  Qa7  27.Kd5  Kg8  28.Kd6  Qa3  29.Ke6  Qb4  30.Kd5  Kh7  31.Ke6  Qa4  32.Be7  Kg8  33.Bh4  Qa8  34.Be7  Qa6+  35.Kd5  Kh7  36.Bg5  Qa7  37.Ke6  Kg7  38.Kd5  Qa3  39.Ke6  Kg8  40.Kf6  Qa6+  41.Ke7  Kg7  42.Bh4  Qb6  43.Bg5  Qb4  44.Ke6  Qd2  45.Bf6+  Kh6
 2 Kc3             77/97	55:52	42 494 368 054	12 676 432	-3,77	1.Kc3  Bxd4+  2.Kxd4  b2  3.Nxb2  a3  4.Nd3  a2  5.Ne5+  Ke8  6.f4  a1Q+  7.Kc5  Qa6  8.Bh4  Qc8  9.Bg5  Qc7  10.Bh4  Kf8  11.Bg5  Kg8  12.Bh4  Kh7  13.Bg5  Qc8  14.Kd6  c5  15.Bh4  Kg8  16.Bg5  Kh8  17.Ng6+  Kh7  18.Ne5  g6  19.Ke7  Kg8  20.Bh4  Qa6  21.Bg5  Qb6  22.Bh4  Qb3  23.Kxe6  Qe3  24.Bg5  Qd4  25.Bh6  Qa1  26.Kd6  Qa7  27.Bg5  Kg7  28.Bd8  Qa3  29.Bg5  Qe3  30.Ke6  Qe2  31.Bf6+  Kh7  32.Bg5  Qg2  33.Bf6  Qb2  34.Bh4  Qd2  35.Bg5  Qc1  36.Kd5  Qe3  37.Ke6  Qa3  38.Kd5  Kg8  39.Kd6  Kg7  40.Ke6  Qa6+  41.Kd5  Qa7  42.Bh4  Qa3  43.Ke6  Qa6+  44.Kd5  Qa7  45.Bg5  Qc7  46.Nc6  Qb6  47.Be7  Kf7  48.Bg5  Qb7  49.Kxc5  Qc8
 2 Kc3             78/96	58:11	30 270 211 972	8 668 793	-4,06	1.Kc3  Bxd4+  2.Kxd4  b2  3.Nxb2  a3  4.Nd3  a2  5.Ne5+  Ke8  6.f4  a1Q+  7.Kc5  Qa6  8.Kd6  Qc8  9.Be7  c5  10.Bh4  Kf8  11.Bg5  Kg8  12.Bh4  Kh8  13.Be7  Kh7  14.Bg5  g6  15.Bf6  Qa8  16.Kxe6  Qe4  17.Bg5  Qd4  18.Kf6  Qd6+  19.Kf7  Qc7+  20.Ke6  Qa5  21.Kf7  Qc3  22.Be7  Qa1  23.Bg5  Qf1  24.Kf6  Qb1  25.Kf7  Qb3  26.Be7  Qb8  27.Bf6  Qg8+  28.Ke7  Qc8  29.Kf7  Qb8  30.Ke6  Qa8  31.Bg5  Kg8  32.Kd6  Qa3  33.Ke6  Qa6+  34.Kd5  Qa5  35.Ke6  Kg7  36.Bf6+  Kh6  37.Kf7  Qc7+  38.Ke6  Qb7  39.Bg5+  Kg7  40.Bf6+  Kg8  41.Be7  Qb6+  42.Kd5  Kh7  43.Bg5  Kg7  44.Be7  Qc7  45.Bg5  Qa7  46.Nc6  Qa3  47.Ne7  Kf7

 3 Nf7 	           58/10	54:15	38 134 537 393	11 712 703	 0,00	1.dxc6  dxc6  2.Bb2  Qh3  3.cxb5  Qd3+  4.Ka2  Qb3+  5.Kb1
 3 Nf7 	           58/12	54:28	39 340 619 569	12 035 673	 0,00	1.dxc6  dxc6  2.Bb2  Qh3  3.cxb5  Qd3+  4.Ka2  Qb3+  5.Ka1  Qd1+  6.Ka2
 3 Nf7 	           58/21	56:41	41 260 323 358	12 129 313	 0,00	1.dxc6  dxc6  2.Bb2  Qh3  3.cxb5  Qd3+  4.Kc1  Nxb5  5.Qxa4  e3  6.Qa8+  Kd7  7.Qb7+  Nc7  8.Be5  Qd2+  9.Kb1  Qd1+  10.Kb2  Qd2+

 4 g5 	           49/72-	54:52	40 456 638 267	12 289 275	-7,42	1.Rd2  Bc4
 4 g5 	           63/13	57:49	30 912 832 628	8 910 284	 0,00	1.g5  Qxg5  2.Qxe6  fxe6  3.Rxa2  Qg8  4.Ra5  c4  5.Ra4  Qxe8  6.Rxa6+  Kxa6
 4 g5 	           63/15	56:41	33 352 225 036	9 805 278	 0,00	1.g5  Qxg5  2.Qxe6  fxe6  3.Rxa2  Qg8  4.Ra4  b3  5.Ra3  c4  6.Ra4  Qxe8  7.Rxa6+  Kxa6

 5 Ng5	 	   66/76	37:57	18 581 932 295	8 158 089	 0,00	1.Ng5  Qh8  2.gxh7  Nxg3  3.hxg3  b4  4.a4  Ke7  5.Bg8  Qe5  6.g4  b3+  7.Bxb3  Qh2  8.Bg8  Qc2  9.Ka3  Qd3+  10.b3  Qc3  11.Ne4  Qa1+  12.Kb4  Kf8  13.Nc5  Qe1+  14.Kb5  Kg7  15.Ne6+  Kh8  16.g5  Qe2+  17.Kc6  Qf3+  18.Kb5
 5 Ng5	 	   70/18	59:20	33 474 874 353	9 402 243	 0,00	1.gxh7  Qh8  2.Ng5  Nxg3  3.hxg3  b4  4.axb4  Ke7  5.Kb1  Qf6  6.Bg8  Qd4  7.Nf7  Qd1+  8.Ka2  Qa4+  9.Kb1
 5 Ng5	 	   70/34	57:11	32 007 407 622	9 327 986	 0,00	1.gxh7  Qh8  2.Ng5  Nxg3  3.hxg3  b4  4.a4  Ke7  5.a5  Kf6  6.Ne4+  Kg6  7.Bg8  Qe5  8.Nc5  Kg7  9.Ne6+  Kh8  10.Nd8  b3+  11.Kxb3  Qb5+  12.Kc3  Qxa5+  13.b4  Qe5+  14.Kc4  Qe2+  15.Kc3

 6 Ne1+            60/12	39:27	22 375 285 436	9 452 439	 0,00	1.Ne1+  Kc3  2.Ng3  Bd7  3.a6  Bc8  4.a7  Bb7  5.Kg2  Ba8  6.Kf2
 6 Ne1+            60/12	55:34	27 258 505 007	8 174 102	 0,00	1.Ne1+  Kc3  2.Ng3  Bd7  3.a6  Bc8  4.a7  Bb7  5.Kg2  Ba8  6.Kf2
 6 Ne1+            63/12	58:51	33 636 319 436	9 525 213	 0,00	1.Ne1+  Kc3  2.Ng3  Bd7  3.a6  Bc8  4.a7  Bb7  5.Kg2  Ba8  6.Kf2
So still only for Shelter (nr.9) at two of three trials correct solution after one hour.

Thanks again, Vincent.
Peter.
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MikeGL
Posts: 1010
Joined: Thu Sep 01, 2011 2:49 pm

Re: Kornrade Test

Post by MikeGL »

In short, this is the toughest problem of this Kornrade Test Suite.
Only one left unsolved.

Code: Select all

6 (Guard Change) 1. Nf7; +-
[d]2k4N/Q1np4/2p2Bpp/1p1P4/pPP1p2P/P7/7q/1K6 w - - 0 1

Not a Null Move problem.
Looks like this is a mobility issue, trapping both Q and K of black with a long term plan of creating a passer for the win.
Sounds like this is the forte of Lc0 and other NN+MCTS engines.
I told my wife that a husband is like a fine wine; he gets better with age. The next day, she locked me in the cellar.
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peter
Posts: 3186
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2008 7:38 am
Full name: Peter Martan

Re: Kornrade Test

Post by peter »

Hi Mike!
MikeGL wrote: ↑Fri Sep 21, 2018 8:21 pm In short, this is the toughest problem of this Kornrade Test Suite.
Only one left unsolved.

Code: Select all

6 (Guard Change) 1. Nf7; +-
[d]2k4N/Q1np4/2p2Bpp/1p1P4/pPP1p2P/P7/7q/1K6 w - - 0 1

Not a Null Move problem.
It yet is, as for studies it's called cyclic Zugzwang, what's to be solved here, together with the long way of the King, as for engines this one second criterion is called lazy King eval.

BTW, because you call it the only one unsolved, which of your engines solves nr.4(Detour) and nr.5(Stubbornness) with correct eval?
Nr.12(Shield) is very hard too, but Vincent Lejeune showed at two of three trials correct solution and eval after an hour with SF dev.
Peter.
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Dann Corbit
Posts: 12541
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2006 8:57 pm
Location: Redmond, WA USA

Re: Kornrade Test

Post by Dann Corbit »

For this position: [d]6k1/1qr1p2p/ppN5/3p1N2/6p1/1P1P2Pp/PP2PP1P/2RK4 w - - computers can find the winning plan, and the score does not change for tens of iterations, but the score is bad. However, the computers would achieve the draw.

Drawing plan found by SF:
Ncxe7+ Kf8 Rxc7 Qxc7 e3 Qe5 Ng6+ hxg6 Nd4 Kf7 a3 Qc7 Kd2 Kf6 Kd1 b5 Kd2 Qe7 Ke2 Qc5 Kd1 Ke5 Kd2 Qf8 Ke2 Qf7 Ke1 Kf6 Kd1 Ke7 Ke2 Kf8 Ke1 Ke8 Ke2 Ke7 Kf1 Kf6 Ke1 Qd7 Kd2 Qc7 Kd1 Ke5 Kd2 b4 a4 Kd6 Kd1 Kd7 Kd2 Qc8 Kd1 Ke7 Kd2 Qf8 Ke1 Kd6 Ke2 Qf7 Ke1 Kc5
Taking ideas is not a vice, it is a virtue. We have another word for this. It is called learning.
But sharing ideas is an even greater virtue. We have another word for this. It is called teaching.
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MikeGL
Posts: 1010
Joined: Thu Sep 01, 2011 2:49 pm

Re: Kornrade Test

Post by MikeGL »

Thanks for the pointers.
Would try those specific ones now, (by cheating)
I mean tweaking some engine settings in case I get lucky :mrgreen:
peter wrote: ↑Fri Sep 21, 2018 8:35 pm Hi Mike!
MikeGL wrote: ↑Fri Sep 21, 2018 8:21 pm In short, this is the toughest problem of this Kornrade Test Suite.
Only one left unsolved.

Code: Select all

6 (Guard Change) 1. Nf7; +-
[d]2k4N/Q1np4/2p2Bpp/1p1P4/pPP1p2P/P7/7q/1K6 w - - 0 1

Not a Null Move problem.
It yet is, as for studies it's called cyclic Zugzwang, what's to be solved here, together with the long way of the King, as for engines this one second criterion is called lazy King eval.

BTW, because you call it the only one unsolved, which of your engines solves nr.4(Detour) and nr.5(Stubbornness) with correct eval?
Nr.12(Shield) is very hard too, but Vincent Lejeune showed at two of three trials correct solution and eval after an hour with SF dev.
I told my wife that a husband is like a fine wine; he gets better with age. The next day, she locked me in the cellar.
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