In Praise of The King

Discussion of anything and everything relating to chess playing software and machines.

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emadsen
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Re: In Praise of The King

Post by emadsen »

JVMerlino wrote: Sat Aug 18, 2018 8:13 am The King still surprises me sometimes. This is v3.12, from Chessmaster 9000 in 2002, on old hardware, getting around 585KNPS, and finding a mate in 15 in four seconds.
Very impressive by The King. MadChess solves it in 4 hours 19 minutes, ha ha.

Code: Select all

New game Line
4k1r1/pp4r1/2p1Pp2/2Q4p/3NP2p/1P6/P5P1/6K1 w - - 0 1

Analysis by MadChess 2.3:

1.Qxh5+ Kd8 2.e7+ Rxe7 3.Qxh4 Rf7 4.Qh5 Ke8 5.Ne6 b5 
  White is clearly winning: +- (5.23)  Depth: 10/17   00:00:00
1.Qxh5+ Kd8 2.e7+ Rxe7 3.Qxh4 Rf7 4.Qh5 Ke8 5.Ne6 Rg3 6.Qh8+ 
  White is clearly winning: +- (5.49)  Depth: 11/19   00:00:00
1.Nf5 Rxg2+ 2.Kh1 Rg1+ 3.Kh2 R1g2+ 4.Kh3 R2g3+ 5.Nxg3 hxg3 6.Kg2 Rg5 
  White is clearly winning: +- (6.48)  Depth: 12/21   00:00:00
1.Nf5 Rxg2+ 2.Kh1 Rg1+ 3.Kh2 R1g2+ 4.Kh3 R2g3+ 5.Nxg3 hxg3 6.Qxh5+ Kd8 7.Kg2 
  White is clearly winning: +- (8.10)  Depth: 13/21   00:00:00  551kN
1.Nf5 Rxg2+ 2.Kh1 Rg1+ 3.Kh2 R1g2+ 4.Kh3 R2g3+ 5.Nxg3 Rxg3+ 6.Kxh4 Rg4+ 7.Kh3 Rxe4 
  White is clearly winning: +- (7.19)  Depth: 14/21   00:00:01  864kN
1.Nf5 Rxg2+ 2.Kf1 Rg1+ 3.Kf2 R1g2+ 4.Ke3 R8g3+ 5.Nxg3 Rxg3+ 6.Kd4 Rg5 7.Qxa7 c5+ 8.Kc4 
  White is clearly winning: +- (7.21)  Depth: 15/23   00:00:01  1441kN
1.Nf5 Rxg2+ 2.Kh1 Rg1+ 3.Kh2 R1g2+ 4.Kh3 R2g3+ 5.Nxg3 Rxg3+ 6.Kxh4 Rg4+ 7.Kh3 Rxe4 8.Qxh5+ Ke7 
  White is clearly winning: +- (7.19)  Depth: 16/25   00:00:02  2118kN
1.Nf5 Rxg2+ 2.Kh1 Rg1+ 3.Kh2 R1g2+ 4.Kh3 R2g3+ 5.Nxg3 Rxg3+ 6.Kxh4 Rg4+ 7.Kh3 Rg5 8.Qxa7 Ke7 9.Qxb7+ 
  White is clearly winning: +- (8.58)  Depth: 17/25   00:00:03  2997kN
1.Nf5 Rxg2+ 2.Kh1 Rg1+ 3.Kh2 R1g2+ 4.Kh3 R2g3+ 5.Nxg3 Rxg3+ 6.Kxh4 Rg4+ 7.Kh3 Rg5 8.Qxa7 Ke7 9.Qxb7+ Kxe6 
  White is clearly winning: +- (8.58)  Depth: 18/29   00:00:03  4254kN
1.Nf5 Rxg2+ 2.Kh1 Rg1+ 3.Kh2 R1g2+ 4.Kh3 R2g3+ 5.Nxg3 Rxg3+ 6.Kxh4 Rg2 7.Qxh5+ Ke7 8.Qf7+ Kd6 9.Qxf6 Rh2+ 10.Kg5 
  White is clearly winning: +- (10.66)  Depth: 19/29   00:00:07  8010kN
1.Nf5 Rxg2+ 2.Kh1 Rg1+ 3.Kh2 R1g2+ 4.Kh3 R2g3+ 5.Nxg3 Rxg3+ 6.Kxh4 Rg4+ 7.Kh3 Rg5 8.Qd4 Rg7 9.Qxf6 Rg4 10.Qf7+ Kd8 
  White is clearly winning: +- (10.72)  Depth: 20/29   00:00:09  10466kN
1.Nf5 Rxg2+ 2.Kh1 Rg1+ 3.Kh2 R1g2+ 4.Kh3 R2g3+ 5.Nxg3 Rxg3+ 6.Kxh4 Rg4+ 7.Kh3 Rf4 8.Qxh5+ Ke7 9.Qf7+ Kd6 10.Qd7+ Ke5 11.Qxb7 
  White is clearly winning: +- (11.56)  Depth: 21/32   00:00:17  20463kN
1.Nf5 Rxg2+ 2.Kh1 Rg1+ 3.Kh2 R1g2+ 4.Kh3 R2g3+ 5.Nxg3 Rxg3+ 6.Kxh4 Rg4+ 7.Kh3 Rg7 8.Qxa7 Ke7 9.Qxb7+ Kf8 10.Qa8+ Ke7 11.Qb7+ Kf8 
  White is clearly winning: +- (11.96)  Depth: 22/32   00:00:24  28961kN
1.Qd6 Rxg2+ 2.Kf1 Rg1+ 3.Ke2 R8g2+ 4.Ke3 Rg3+ 5.Nf3 Rxf3+ 6.Kxf3 Rg7 7.Qb8+ Ke7 8.Qxb7+ Kxe6 9.Qxg7 h3 10.Qc7 c5 11.Qc6+ Kf7 12.Qd7+ 
  White is clearly winning: +- (15.22)  Depth: 23/35   00:02:21  176MN
1.Qd6 Rxg2+ 2.Kf1 Rg1+ 3.Ke2 R8g2+ 4.Ke3 Rg3+ 5.Nf3 Rxf3+ 6.Kxf3 Rg7 7.Qb8+ Ke7 8.Qxb7+ Kxe6 9.Qxg7 c5 10.Qxa7 h3 11.Qb6+ Kf7 12.Qxc5 Kg6 
  White is clearly winning: +- (16.40)  Depth: 24/36   00:03:20  250MN
1.Qd6 Rxg2+ 2.Kf1 Rg1+ 3.Ke2 R8g2+ 4.Ke3 Rg3+ 5.Nf3 Rxf3+ 6.Kxf3 Rg7 7.Qb8+ Ke7 8.Qxb7+ Kxe6 9.Qxg7 a5 10.Qc7 h3 11.Qxc6+ Kf7 12.Qd7+ Kg6 13.Qxh3 
  White is clearly winning: +- (16.79)  Depth: 25/36   00:05:14  392MN
1.Qd6 Rxg2+ 2.Kf1 Rg1+ 3.Ke2 R8g2+ 4.Ke3 Rg3+ 5.Kd2 R1g2+ 6.Kc1 Rc3+ 7.Kb1 Rg1+ 8.Kb2 Rg2+ 9.Kxc3 Rg3+ 10.Kb4 c5+ 11.Ka3 Rxb3+ 12.Nxb3 f5 13.exf5 b5 
  White is clearly winning: +- (23.86)  Depth: 26/40   00:27:56  2201MN
1.Qd6 Rxg2+ 2.Kf1 Rg1+ 3.Kf2 R1g2+ 4.Ke1 Rg1+ 5.Kd2 R1g2+ 6.Kc3 R8g3+ 7.Kb4 a5+ 8.Ka3 Rxa2+ 9.Kxa2 Rg2+ 10.Ka3 Rg7 11.Qb8+ Ke7 12.Nf5+ Kxe6 13.Qe8+ Re7 14.Qxe7# 
  White mates: +- (#14)  Depth: 27/43   04:19:50  21885MN
My C# chess engine: https://www.madchess.net
Uri
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Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2007 9:34 pm

Re: In Praise of The King

Post by Uri »

Chessmaster is old.

Most of the games in Chessmaster 9000 are from 40 years ago, some even earlier than that. That's a long time ago.

People back then didn't have so much chess knowledge and understanding as we have amassed today.

Magnus Carlsen won't make the same positional mistakes as world champions did back then like Paul Morphy, Emmanuel Lasker or Wilhelm Steinitz for example.

Chessmaster 9000 is good for a history lesson about the history of chess but it's not more useful than that.
mephisto
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Re: In Praise of The King

Post by mephisto »

Interesting read here on the 19th July about the new Millennium King Module.

https://translate.google.com/translate? ... 1,15700201
What's my next move? - to the fridge for another beer !!
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mclane
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Full name: Thorsten Czub

Re: In Praise of The King

Post by mclane »

I would advice NOT to trust the website you quoted when it is about millennium products.
In opposite I would advise to read the official millennium product website that is

In german:
http://computerchess.de

In english:
http://computerchess.de/en/
What seems like a fairy tale today may be reality tomorrow.
Here we have a fairy tale of the day after tomorrow....
rcmaddox
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Re: In Praise of The King

Post by rcmaddox »

JVMerlino wrote: Sat Aug 18, 2018 8:13 am The King still surprises me sometimes. This is v3.12, from Chessmaster 9000 in 2002, on old hardware, getting around 585KNPS, and finding a mate in 15 in four seconds. I tried several other engines, and only Crafty 25 (JA build) came close at 7 seconds (at 1 core, like The King), even though it needed more than 10x the nodes. To be fair, Crafty did improve to Mate in 14 much faster than The King did.
I can't replicate this at all. I tried with Chessmaster GM Edition (King 3.50) and mate was not found. I gave up after about 45 minutes.
Colin-G
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Location: England

Re: In Praise of The King

Post by Colin-G »

rcmaddox wrote: Sun Aug 26, 2018 4:55 am
JVMerlino wrote: Sat Aug 18, 2018 8:13 am The King still surprises me sometimes. This is v3.12, from Chessmaster 9000 in 2002, on old hardware, getting around 585KNPS, and finding a mate in 15 in four seconds. I tried several other engines, and only Crafty 25 (JA build) came close at 7 seconds (at 1 core, like The King), even though it needed more than 10x the nodes. To be fair, Crafty did improve to Mate in 14 much faster than The King did.
I can't replicate this at all. I tried with Chessmaster GM Edition (King 3.50) and mate was not found. I gave up after about 45 minutes.
I can confirm that Chessmaster9000 does find a mate very quickly.
On my computer which runs Windows XP 32 bit with an Athlon64 2.2Ghz cpu it takes just 6 seconds.

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JVMerlino
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Re: In Praise of The King

Post by JVMerlino »

From the image, and the personality name, I can see that you're using a custom personality. Did you choose the settings yourself?
rcmaddox
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Re: In Praise of The King

Post by rcmaddox »

Colin-G wrote: Sun Aug 26, 2018 12:50 pm
rcmaddox wrote: Sun Aug 26, 2018 4:55 am
JVMerlino wrote: Sat Aug 18, 2018 8:13 am The King still surprises me sometimes. This is v3.12, from Chessmaster 9000 in 2002, on old hardware, getting around 585KNPS, and finding a mate in 15 in four seconds. I tried several other engines, and only Crafty 25 (JA build) came close at 7 seconds (at 1 core, like The King), even though it needed more than 10x the nodes. To be fair, Crafty did improve to Mate in 14 much faster than The King did.
I can't replicate this at all. I tried with Chessmaster GM Edition (King 3.50) and mate was not found. I gave up after about 45 minutes.
I can confirm that Chessmaster9000 does find a mate very quickly.
On my computer which runs Windows XP 32 bit with an Athlon64 2.2Ghz cpu it takes just 6 seconds.
OK, I was today able to replicate the result with Chessmaster GM (11). Amazing that the program reports a mate in 15 at a nominal search depth of 3.
Colin-G
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Location: England

Re: In Praise of The King

Post by Colin-G »

JVMerlino wrote: Sun Aug 26, 2018 7:19 pm From the image, and the personality name, I can see that you're using a custom personality. Did you choose the settings yourself?
I just used the standard default settings apart from hash = 64 MB and pondering off.
The latest patch for the program had been applied a long time ago.
i.e. chessmaster_9k_v1.02a.exe

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JVMerlino
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Re: In Praise of The King

Post by JVMerlino »

Got it. Thanks!

And, yes...that was looooong ago. :D