IQ wrote:peter wrote:
If this is your mainline, how does White win after e.g. 59...g5 instead of ...Qd6?
As this whole Bd5 line is my invention, I feel obliged to take over. If I remember my analysis correctly, this move order is inaccurate. After
58. Rf4 Re6 you take immidiately on e6 instead of playing a5:
59. Bxe6! dxe6
60. a5
now Qd6 transposes to the lines which end in a lomosov win. But Rd7 also looses. For example:
60. ... Rd7
61. Qc8+ Rd8
62. Qc6+ Rd7
63. Qc3 (creates Zugzwang)
64. ... a6 (what else)
65. Qc8+ Ke7
66. Qxa6 +-
Your new line as for 59th onwards is better then your old one was, Roberto, but such a clear win as you always keep on telling to us it still isn't.
Even if it's engine- chess only again, I simply did let H6 play it out against SF with the same conditions as last time, 12 threads and 8G hash each, full Syzygys, ponder on:
[pgn]
[Event "Lang 60m+30s"]
[Site "Dort"]
[Date "2018.01.05"]
[Round "1"]
[White "Houdini 6.03 Pro x64-popc"]
[Black "Stockfish 020118 64 POPCNT"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[ECO "E15"]
[Annotator "Martan,Peter"]
[PlyCount "169"]
[TimeControl "3600+30"]
1. Nf3 Nf6 2. c4 b6 3. d4 e6 4. g3 Ba6 5. Qc2 c5 6. d5 exd5 7. cxd5 Bb7 8. Bg2
Nxd5 9. O-O Nc6 10. Rd1 Be7 11. Qf5 Nf6 12. e4 g6 13. Qf4 O-O 14. e5 Nh5 15.
Qg4 Re8 16. Nc3 Qb8 17. Nd5 Bf8 18. Bf4 Qc8 19. h3 Ne7 20. Ne3 Bc6 21. Rd6 Ng7
22. Rf6 Qb7 23. Bh6 Nd5 24. Nxd5 Bxd5 25. Rd1 Ne6 26. Bxf8 Rxf8 27. Qh4 Bc6 28.
Qh6 Rae8 29. Rd6 Bxf3 30. Bxf3 Qa6 31. h4 Qa5 32. Rd1 c4 33. Rd5 Qe1+ 34. Kg2
c3 35. bxc3 Qxc3 36. h5 Re7 37. Bd1 Qe1 38. Bb3 Rd8 39. Rf3 Qe4 40. Qd2 Qg4 41.
Bd1 Qe4 42. h6 Nc7 43. Rd6 Ne6 44. Bb3 Qxe5 45. Rd5 Qh8 46. Qb4 Nc5 47. Rxc5
bxc5 48. Qh4 Rde8 49. Rf6 Kf8 50. Bd5 Rc8 51. Qf4 Qg8 52. Bb7 Rce8 53. Qd6 c4
54. a4 c3 55. Bd5 Rd8 56. Qc7 Ke8 57. Qxc3 Qf8 58. Rf4 Re6 59. Bxe6 dxe6 60. a5
Rd7 61. Qc8+ Rd8 62. Qc6+ Rd7 63. Qc3 a6 64. Qc8+ Ke7 65. Qxa6 Qb8 {[%eval 87,
47] [%emt 0:16:13]} 66. Ra4 {[%eval 91,33] [%emt 0:07:01]} Rd6 {[%eval 88,52]
[%emt 0:00:00] (Db1)} 67. Qf1 {[%eval 98,33] [%emt 0:02:54]} Qa8+ {[%eval 87,
44] [%emt 0:07:05] (Db7+)} 68. Kg1 {[%eval 99,39] [%emt 0:18:31]} Qa6 {[%eval
87,56] [%emt 0:00:00]} 69. Qc1 {[%eval 97,37] [%emt 0:05:02] (De1)} e5 {[%eval
141,38] [%emt 0:05:01]} 70. Qb2 {[%eval 97,38] [%emt 0:00:00] (Kh2)} Ke6 {
[%eval 92,43] [%emt 0:06:38]} 71. Qb3+ {[%eval 96,39] [%emt 0:00:00]} Kf6 {
[%eval 91,42] [%emt 0:03:59]} 72. Ra1 {[%eval 97,39] [%emt 0:01:13]} Rd3 {
[%eval 67,39] [%emt 0:01:17]} 73. Qb4 {[%eval 97,38] [%emt 0:02:39]} Kf5 {
[%eval 59,39] [%emt 0:00:00] (Td4)} 74. Qh4 {[%eval 97,38] [%emt 0:04:17] (Kh2)
} g5 {[%eval 14,33] [%emt 0:01:43] (Ke6)} 75. Qa4 {[%eval 26,35] [%emt 0:06:55]
} Rd6 {[%eval 12,46] [%emt 0:00:00] (e4)} 76. g4+ {[%eval 23,34] [%emt 0:03:11]
} Kg6 {[%eval 12,53] [%emt 0:00:00]} 77. Qe4+ {[%eval 23,35] [%emt 0:00:45]}
Kxh6 {[%eval 12,54] [%emt 0:02:03]} 78. Kg2 {[%eval 23,40] [%emt 0:02:09]} Rf6
{[%eval 12,56] [%emt 0:00:00]} 79. Rh1+ {[%eval 23,39] [%emt 0:00:51]} Kg7 {
[%eval 12,57] [%emt 0:00:00]} 80. Rxh7+ {[%eval 24,43] [%emt 0:05:07] (Dxh7+)}
Kg8 {[%eval 12,60] [%emt 0:01:47]} 81. Rh5 {[%eval 24,44] [%emt 0:00:00]} Qxa5
{[%eval 12,62] [%emt 0:01:59]} 82. Rxg5+ {[%eval 25,46] [%emt 0:02:26]} Kf8 {
[%eval 12,64] [%emt 0:01:09]} 83. Rxe5 {[%eval 25,45] [%emt 0:00:27]} Qd2 {
[%eval 12,66] [%emt 0:03:36]} 84. Qe3 {[%eval 25,49] [%emt 0:00:00]} Qxe3 {
[%eval 12,69] [%emt 0:01:52]} 85. Rxe3 {[%eval 27,49] [%emt 0:00:00] 7some draw
} 1/2-1/2
[/pgn]
Again quote for evals.
And then about the whole line of yours or of whom or of which engine(s) ever:
Starting with 50...Rc8 52...Rce8 for Black doesn't seem very "human" to me neither.
You already admitted that the first one 7some position reached by Peer was won for White to move and drawn with Black's turn.
But you start your line with a given away tempo for Black, so what does that tell you about the outcome of this one line (with or without single one transposition in question) and what exactly did you want to show us in that way about "engine- lines"?
If you don't see a difference in quality of 49...Rf8 (??) and ...Kf8, saying there wasn't any blunder, cause the position was lost anyhow, the discussion about that single one point of matter to me doesn't make any sense to me anymore, your definition of blunder is too much different from mine.