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Dann Corbit wrote: ↑Fri Apr 05, 2019 8:12 pm

Rebel wrote: ↑Fri Apr 05, 2019 9:27 am Many of the ideas you mentioned I would love to see them in a GUI as well but it seems to me the nature of the ideas fit better in a database program like SCID.

The GUI needs to be attached both to engines and to databases.
Otherwise, it is just a thing that scrolls through games.

sovaz1997 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 05, 2019 8:50 pm

Dann Corbit wrote: ↑Fri Apr 05, 2019 8:12 pm

Rebel wrote: ↑Fri Apr 05, 2019 9:27 am Many of the ideas you mentioned I would love to see them in a GUI as well but it seems to me the nature of the ideas fit better in a database program like SCID.

The GUI needs to be attached both to engines and to databases.
Otherwise, it is just a thing that scrolls through games.

Do you mean somehow combine these things?
In the sense that when you do an analysis, it is stored in the database and compared with a specific engine, its version, its settings. And when this position is reopened, the analysis will be saved.

Dann Corbit wrote: ↑Fri Apr 05, 2019 9:10 pm

sovaz1997 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 05, 2019 8:50 pm

Dann Corbit wrote: ↑Fri Apr 05, 2019 8:12 pm

Rebel wrote: ↑Fri Apr 05, 2019 9:27 am Many of the ideas you mentioned I would love to see them in a GUI as well but it seems to me the nature of the ideas fit better in a database program like SCID.

The GUI needs to be attached both to engines and to databases.
Otherwise, it is just a thing that scrolls through games.

Do you mean somehow combine these things?
In the sense that when you do an analysis, it is stored in the database and compared with a specific engine, its version, its settings. And when this position is reopened, the analysis will be saved.

SCID is a chess GUI. And a chess database. And an engine platform. It is still a long way from what I want, but the GUI and the database must be combined.
You can say that Chessbase is also a GUI and a database. And Aquarium is also a GUI and a database.
But I suggest that none of them are really database systems. They just store chess information. A database system has a real database underneath.
One that is exposed, that is. I think Aquarium uses an ODBC connection for its queries, but I do not know what the underlying database is so I cannot query it directly.

sovaz1997 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 05, 2019 8:50 pm

Dann Corbit wrote: ↑Fri Apr 05, 2019 8:12 pm

Rebel wrote: ↑Fri Apr 05, 2019 9:27 am Many of the ideas you mentioned I would love to see them in a GUI as well but it seems to me the nature of the ideas fit better in a database program like SCID.

The GUI needs to be attached both to engines and to databases.
Otherwise, it is just a thing that scrolls through games.

Do you mean somehow combine these things?
In the sense that when you do an analysis, it is stored in the database and compared with a specific engine, its version, its settings. And when this position is reopened, the analysis will be saved.

sovaz1997 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 05, 2019 9:15 pm {snip}
Now I understand what you are talking about. Yes, I think there is a definite advantage to having a general-purpose database for this: unlimited expansion options and more flexibility in data management. The ability to make your own requests of any complexity.
But I am afraid that such a database may take up more space and have a lower access speed.

Dann Corbit wrote: ↑Fri Apr 05, 2019 9:45 pm If we use MonetDB, then the data will be accessed at (approximately) memory speed.

Dann Corbit wrote: ↑Fri Apr 05, 2019 9:45 pm

sovaz1997 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 05, 2019 9:15 pm {snip}
Now I understand what you are talking about. Yes, I think there is a definite advantage to having a general-purpose database for this: unlimited expansion options and more flexibility in data management. The ability to make your own requests of any complexity.
But I am afraid that such a database may take up more space and have a lower access speed.

If we use MonetDB, then the data will be accessed at (approximately) memory speed.
And the AMD 7nm Epyc stuff is coming this summer.
$3500 will buy you 18 TB of enterprise class SSD.
A little more, if you want m.2 gumsticks.

Compute power is not the problem.
Utilization of that power for optimal purpose is the problem.

Fulvio wrote: ↑Fri Apr 05, 2019 10:01 pm

Dann Corbit wrote: ↑Fri Apr 05, 2019 9:45 pm If we use MonetDB, then the data will be accessed at (approximately) memory speed.

Do you have some concrete benchmark?
Let's say a 10 million games database: how long it takes to find the games (not just the positions, if I would like to study the ending I need to see the continuation) with for example a king+rook vs king+rook+pawn ending?

sovaz1997 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 05, 2019 10:05 pm For the ending, there are other solutions - the Nalimov tables, the Syzygy tables. I don't think that the database is suitable for this.