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Re: Statement from the Moderation Team
Posted: Thu May 26, 2016 12:39 pm
by Rebel
JVMerlino wrote: 4) We are, however, sensitive to another stated reason that can be summarized as "posts about tournaments that require human participation would get lost in the midst of other frequently updated threads". Therefore, we are offering to add a sticky to any applicable topic posted in the T&M forum, as long as the OP requests it (either within the original post or via private message to the moderators) AND specifies a reasonable date after which the sticky will be removed.
What about if a trusted member offers to maintain a tournament calender put as sticky in the main or T&M forum.
Re: Statement from the Moderation Team
Posted: Thu May 26, 2016 12:51 pm
by hgm
Graham Banks wrote:hgm wrote:You are still trying to justify pointless hurting of others. Why?
I'm just pointing out what anybody can read, nothing else.
That seems too easy a way of weasling out. You could also have posted that this board is "Hosted by Your Move Chess & Games", which is also something that everyone can read. But the fact that you did refer to the description of the forum sections strongly suggests that this was not intended as a random off-topic remark, but had some bearing on the discussion. And in particular that you think that these descriptions can be a jusification for some people to hurt others, and hurt computer Chess in general.
If that was not your intention, you better correct it in public.
Do you think such discriptions can justify the act of hurting others? (A simple yes or no would do.)
Re: Statement from the Moderation Team
Posted: Thu May 26, 2016 12:56 pm
by Rebel
HGM, I assume this was directed at Graham?
Re: Statement from the Moderation Team
Posted: Thu May 26, 2016 1:01 pm
by hgm
Indeed, our postings crossed. I now edited in a quote from Graham's post to reflect that.
Re: Statement from the Moderation Team
Posted: Thu May 26, 2016 2:02 pm
by hgm
Rebel wrote:What about if a trusted member offers to maintain a tournament calender put as sticky in the main or T&M forum.
Well, apart from the technical problem that the board software might only distinguish the categories guest / member / moderator / admin, so that either everyone could post there or only moderators, sticky threats do have some drawbacks.
For one, they do not seem to solve any problem (not even imagined ones), as they would on the average be visible far more often than the occasional announcement of a participation event (which would be quickly buried after the event is over, after which it would take months before a new one is announced.)
Another disadvantage is that you cannot see from the title when there are new announcements, alnd also likely not from the name of the latest poster (as this would always be the 'trusted person', (a moderator)). So you could only recognize from the date if there is something new in it, and then you would still have no idea what was is inside it.
It also makes it pretty cumbersome for organizers to get something there. They would become dependent on the trusted person, who might be on holiday or otherwise busy.
Re: Statement from the Moderation Team
Posted: Thu May 26, 2016 3:57 pm
by Rebel
Correct, it's not perfect.
Re: Statement from the Moderation Team
Posted: Thu May 26, 2016 9:59 pm
by Graham Banks
hgm wrote:Graham Banks wrote:hgm wrote:You are still trying to justify pointless hurting of others. Why?
I'm just pointing out what anybody can read, nothing else.
That seems too easy a way of weasling out. You could also have posted that this board is "Hosted by Your Move Chess & Games", which is also something that everyone can read. But the fact that you did refer to the description of the forum sections strongly suggests that this was not intended as a random off-topic remark, but had some bearing on the discussion. And in particular that you think that these descriptions can be a jusification for some people to hurt others, and hurt computer Chess in general.
If that was not your intention, you better correct it in public.
Do you think such discriptions can justify the act of hurting others? (A simple yes or no would do.)
I think you're making a mountain out of a molehill. Nobody here has the intention of hurting computer chess. That's just ridiculous.
Although the moderators didn't move such threads in the several terms when I was a moderator, stickying such threads in the Tournaments subforum is probably the correct thing to do.
Re: Statement from the Moderation Team
Posted: Thu May 26, 2016 10:28 pm
by hgm
The people that actually do organize these events have just told us here it does hurt their events.
Are you calling them liars?
Graham Banks wrote: stickying such threads in the Tournaments subforum is probably the correct thing to do.
The affected people (organizers and participants) have all told here this does not satisfy their needs, and will cause them a lot of hardship.
So you consider inflicting hardship on people "the correct thing to do"? Why? I never took you for a sadistic person... Why is it a correct thing to do to make other people suffer?
Re: To MODERATORS: Please CONTINUE moving tournaments!
Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 1:06 am
by bob
Dann Corbit wrote:Harvey Williamson wrote:Dann Corbit wrote:
WCCC/WMCCC is a European championship.
When did komodo become a European engine?
Sounds like someone who would like an important sounding sticker on his box.
There is an exception to every rule. A cameo by Komodo fits that bill.
Here are the most recent entrants:
Code: Select all
1 Jonny flag DEU 2,400 cores, 2,376 threads, AMD x86-64, 2.8 GHz 7.0 8 World Computer Chess Champion
2 Komodo flag USA 24 cores, 24 threads, Intel i7 6.5 8 Second Place
3 Hiarcs flag GBR 28 threads, Intel Xeon E5-2697, 2.8 GHz 5.0 8 Third Place
4 Protector flag DEU 8 cores, 15 threads, Intel i7 5690x, 4 GHz 5.0 8
5 Shredder flag DEU 16 cores, 16 threads, Intel i7 4.5 8
6 Ginkgo flag DEU 6 cores, 6 threads, Intel i5 4.0 8
7 The Baron flag NLD 16 cores, 16 threads, Intel E5-2687w, 3.1 GHz 3.0 8
8 Maverick flag USA 1 thread, Intel i7, 2.8 GHz 1.0 8
9 Fridolin flag DEU 4 cores, 7 threads, Intel i7 0.0 8
1 Junior flag ISR Dual 12 core Intel Xenon I5 2.7 GHz 7.5 10 World Computer Chess Champion
2 Jonny flag DEU 2400 core AMD 2.8 GHz 7.0 10 Second Place
3 Pandix flag HUN I7-3740, 2.7 GHz, 16 GB RAM 5.5 10 Third Place
3 Hiarcs flag GBR 16 core Intel Xenon E5 3.1 GHz 5.5 10 Third Place
5 Shredder flag DEU 16 core Intel 3.1 GHz 4.5 10
6 Merlin (hu) flag HUN I7-3740, 2.7 GHz, 16 GB RAM 0.0 10
1 Junior flag ISR 16 core i7 Sandybridge 6.0 8 World Computer Chess Champion
2 Shredder flag DEU 5.5 8 Second Place
2 Hiarcs flag GBR 12 core i7 Nehalem 5.5 8 Second Place
4 Pandix flag HUN 5.0 8
4 Jonny flag DEU 800 core cluster 5.0 8
6 The Baron flag NLD 8 core i7 Nehalem 4.5 8
7 Booot flag UKR 3.0 8
8 Rookie 3.4 flag NLD 1.5 8
9 Woodpusher 1997 flag GBR 0.0 8
1 Rybka flag USA Intel Cluster run by Lukas Cimiotti 8.0 9 Disqualified
2 Rondo flag USA 6.5 9 World Computer Chess Champion
2 Thinker flag USA 6.5 9 World Computer Chess Champion
4 Shredder flag DEU 6.0 9 Third Place
5 Jonny flag DEU Cluster 5.5 9
6 Pandix Breakthrough flag HUN loan hardware 5.0 9
7 Deep Junior flag ISR 4.0 9
8 Darmenios flag POL 2.0 9
9 Fridolin flag DEU 1.0 9
10 Hector for Chess flag HUN 0.5 9
Boiled down to individual engines:
Woodpusher
Thinker
The
Shredder
Rybka
Rookie
Rondo
Protector
Pandix
Merlin
Maverick
Komodo
Junior
Jonny
Hiarcs
Hector
Ginkgo
Fridolin
Darmenios
Booot
Considering the CCRL 40/40 measurements, these are the top 20 engines:
Texel
Strelka
Stockfish
Rybka
Protector
NirvanaChess
Naum
Komodo
Houdini
Hannibal
Gull
Fritz
Fizbo
Fire
Equinox
Critter
Chiron
Bouquet
BlackMamba
Andscacs
Alfil
And what is missing from the ICGA list?
Answer:
Most of the programs from the second list.
And why don't they participate?
Because the contest is meaningless unless you want a fancy,
false sticker on your box.
You should stop with the insulting crap. Do you realize how many clones are on your "preferred list"?
Strelka, Houdini and fire stand out. There are probably others. This is why WE (the ICGA membership / participants) choose who gets to enter.
If you don't like the ICGA, nobody has forced you to join. But you sound like a bitter complainer and nothing else with these kinds of posts. Particularly when you are clueless about which are original and which are not.
Re: To MODERATORS: Please CONTINUE moving tournaments!
Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 1:19 am
by Dann Corbit
bob wrote:Dann Corbit wrote:Harvey Williamson wrote:Dann Corbit wrote:
WCCC/WMCCC is a European championship.
When did komodo become a European engine?
Sounds like someone who would like an important sounding sticker on his box.
There is an exception to every rule. A cameo by Komodo fits that bill.
Here are the most recent entrants:
Code: Select all
1 Jonny flag DEU 2,400 cores, 2,376 threads, AMD x86-64, 2.8 GHz 7.0 8 World Computer Chess Champion
2 Komodo flag USA 24 cores, 24 threads, Intel i7 6.5 8 Second Place
3 Hiarcs flag GBR 28 threads, Intel Xeon E5-2697, 2.8 GHz 5.0 8 Third Place
4 Protector flag DEU 8 cores, 15 threads, Intel i7 5690x, 4 GHz 5.0 8
5 Shredder flag DEU 16 cores, 16 threads, Intel i7 4.5 8
6 Ginkgo flag DEU 6 cores, 6 threads, Intel i5 4.0 8
7 The Baron flag NLD 16 cores, 16 threads, Intel E5-2687w, 3.1 GHz 3.0 8
8 Maverick flag USA 1 thread, Intel i7, 2.8 GHz 1.0 8
9 Fridolin flag DEU 4 cores, 7 threads, Intel i7 0.0 8
1 Junior flag ISR Dual 12 core Intel Xenon I5 2.7 GHz 7.5 10 World Computer Chess Champion
2 Jonny flag DEU 2400 core AMD 2.8 GHz 7.0 10 Second Place
3 Pandix flag HUN I7-3740, 2.7 GHz, 16 GB RAM 5.5 10 Third Place
3 Hiarcs flag GBR 16 core Intel Xenon E5 3.1 GHz 5.5 10 Third Place
5 Shredder flag DEU 16 core Intel 3.1 GHz 4.5 10
6 Merlin (hu) flag HUN I7-3740, 2.7 GHz, 16 GB RAM 0.0 10
1 Junior flag ISR 16 core i7 Sandybridge 6.0 8 World Computer Chess Champion
2 Shredder flag DEU 5.5 8 Second Place
2 Hiarcs flag GBR 12 core i7 Nehalem 5.5 8 Second Place
4 Pandix flag HUN 5.0 8
4 Jonny flag DEU 800 core cluster 5.0 8
6 The Baron flag NLD 8 core i7 Nehalem 4.5 8
7 Booot flag UKR 3.0 8
8 Rookie 3.4 flag NLD 1.5 8
9 Woodpusher 1997 flag GBR 0.0 8
1 Rybka flag USA Intel Cluster run by Lukas Cimiotti 8.0 9 Disqualified
2 Rondo flag USA 6.5 9 World Computer Chess Champion
2 Thinker flag USA 6.5 9 World Computer Chess Champion
4 Shredder flag DEU 6.0 9 Third Place
5 Jonny flag DEU Cluster 5.5 9
6 Pandix Breakthrough flag HUN loan hardware 5.0 9
7 Deep Junior flag ISR 4.0 9
8 Darmenios flag POL 2.0 9
9 Fridolin flag DEU 1.0 9
10 Hector for Chess flag HUN 0.5 9
Boiled down to individual engines:
Woodpusher
Thinker
The
Shredder
Rybka
Rookie
Rondo
Protector
Pandix
Merlin
Maverick
Komodo
Junior
Jonny
Hiarcs
Hector
Ginkgo
Fridolin
Darmenios
Booot
Considering the CCRL 40/40 measurements, these are the top 20 engines:
Texel
Strelka
Stockfish
Rybka
Protector
NirvanaChess
Naum
Komodo
Houdini
Hannibal
Gull
Fritz
Fizbo
Fire
Equinox
Critter
Chiron
Bouquet
BlackMamba
Andscacs
Alfil
And what is missing from the ICGA list?
Answer:
Most of the programs from the second list.
And why don't they participate?
Because the contest is meaningless unless you want a fancy,
false sticker on your box.
You should stop with the insulting crap. Do you realize how many clones are on your "preferred list"?
Strelka, Houdini and fire stand out. There are probably others. This is why WE (the ICGA membership / participants) choose who gets to enter.
If you don't like the ICGA, nobody has forced you to join. But you sound like a bitter complainer and nothing else with these kinds of posts. Particularly when you are clueless about which are original and which are not.
What have I said that is insulting?
Houdini and Fire are well accepted by the community at large.
But if we remove those three strong engines, my points all stand, completely unaltered.
A FIDE chess championship without :
Code: Select all
Rank Name Title Country Rating Games B-Year
1 Carlsen, Magnus g NOR 2851 0 1990
2 Caruana, Fabiano g USA 2804 11 1992
3 Kramnik, Vladimir g RUS 2801 0 1975
4 Giri, Anish g NED 2790 0 1994
5 Vachier-Lagrave, Maxime g FRA 2788 0 1990
6 Nakamura, Hikaru g USA 2787 11 1987
7 Aronian, Levon g ARM 2784 0 1982
8 Karjakin, Sergey g RUS 2779 0 1990
9 Ding, Liren g CHN 2778 4 1992
10 So, Wesley g USA 2775 11 1993
11 Anand, Viswanathan g IND 2770 0 1969
12 Eljanov, Pavel g UKR 2765 0 1983
13 Harikrishna, P. g IND 2763 0 1986
14 Svidler, Peter g RUS 2762 0 1976
15 Li, Chao b g CHN 2756 4 1989
16 Topalov, Veselin g BUL 2754 0 1975
17 Grischuk, Alexander g RUS 2752 0 1983
18 Mamedyarov, Shakhriyar g AZE 2748 4 1985
19 Gelfand, Boris g ISR 2740 0 1968
20 Yu, Yangyi g CHN 2737 3 1994
would hardly be a championship.