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Measure: correlation
Distance on the horizontal axis to the common ancestor - degree of relatedness (smaller - more related).

Ponder hits or similarity tester?

Rebel wrote:Ponder hits or similarity tester?

Similarity tester.

ChessTiger's distance may be artificially high. It does not return a best move when the similarity tester sends the command. It sends it several hundred milliseconds later.

Shredder does not precisely obey the commands from the similarity tester. There is a lag before it starts thinking and a lag before it sends the best move. Both lags are 15-20 milliseconds. I do not think it has a large effect on the results.

Komodo has a lag before it starts thinking, about 90ms IIRC. It stops exactly when the command is received. That would make it seem more distant than it really is. When corrected for, it becomes a little closer to Rybka 3.

Stockfish does not obey the stop command precisely. It will not send a best move until it reaches depth 10, IIRC.

Adam Hair wrote:ChessTiger's distance may be artificially high. It does not return a best move when the similarity tester sends the command. It sends it several hundred milliseconds later.

Shredder does not precisely obey the commands from the similarity tester. There is a lag before it starts thinking and a lag before it sends the best move. Both lags are 15-20 milliseconds. I do not think it has a large effect on the results.

Komodo has a lag before it starts thinking, about 90ms IIRC. It stops exactly when the command is received. That would make it seem more distant than it really is. When corrected for, it becomes a little closer to Rybka 3.

Stockfish does not obey the stop command precisely. It will not send a best move until it reaches depth 10, IIRC.

How do you correct Komodo? Add 90ms to Komodo time? I used a very rough adjustment for strength: scale 1 for weaker engines, scale 0.1 for super-engines. It's I think enough, because strength dependency is weak. Komodo with scale 0.1 still clustered apparently correctly, and it's only 10ms thinking time. Do you suggest using 100ms for Komodo?

I think I found that Komodo grouped a little more closely to Rybka 3 when I increased the time for Komodo. How much closer? I do not remember, but I am certain that it would not make a lot of difference to the dendrogram.

Basically, I was trying to pass on to you ChessTiger does not run the test correctly, and then decided to mention the quirks that some of the other engines have. In all, I do not think the dendrogram would change much if all of the engines obeyed the similarity tester precisely.

How many ORIGINAL top program we really have? May be only 3

1. Rybka + clones (Ippolit, Robbolit, Houdini, Critter, etc..)

2. Stockfish

3. Komodo

Jouni wrote:How many ORIGINAL top program we really have? May be only 3

1. Rybka + clones (Ippolit, Robbolit, Houdini, Critter, etc..)

2. Stockfish

3. Komodo

Interesting to note the clustering of engines which are claimed to be original around open sources (Fruit 2.1, Strelka 2, Ivanhoe) and around the RE of Houdini.

Adam Hair wrote:I think I found that Komodo grouped a little more closely to Rybka 3 when I increased the time for Komodo. How much closer? I do not remember, but I am certain that it would not make a lot of difference to the dendrogram.

Basically, I was trying to pass on to you ChessTiger does not run the test correctly, and then decided to mention the quirks that some of the other engines have. In all, I do not think the dendrogram would change much if all of the engines obeyed the similarity tester precisely.

Older versions of Komodo had a longer delay between thinking time startup. Did you measure this delay on all versions or a specific version?

Don wrote:

Adam Hair wrote:I think I found that Komodo grouped a little more closely to Rybka 3 when I increased the time for Komodo. How much closer? I do not remember, but I am certain that it would not make a lot of difference to the dendrogram.

Basically, I was trying to pass on to you ChessTiger does not run the test correctly, and then decided to mention the quirks that some of the other engines have. In all, I do not think the dendrogram would change much if all of the engines obeyed the similarity tester precisely.

Older versions of Komodo had a longer delay between thinking time startup. Did you measure this delay on all versions or a specific version?

I am going by memory, which is not reliable in this case. I would have to go back over the logs I made. The versions would have been Komodo 3 and Komodo 4.