a general moderation point ....

[chrisw]

Congrats to the CCC mods. There are a few issues that concern.

Any complaint sent in by the ! button concerning here or the EO forum is displayed in full, together with mod responses on a general mod forum which is open to CTF mods as well. Under normal circumstances this would not perhaps appear a problem, except that I feel it inappropriate to make a ! complaint about a misbehaving CTF mod that can be read immediately, edited, deleted by same misbehaving CTF mod. Is it possible to flag up ! complaints such that they go to forum mods specifically and not mods who are unrelated to the forum in question?

Secondly, you might think this post should be in Help and Suggestions, but, again in that case, I, and possibly others, won't post into that forum for obvious reasons.

Thirdly, all user IP addresses are immediately available to all mods, including those not responsible for the forum one is actually reading or writing to. There are certain individuals I deem it inappropriate to have access to my IP address. Is it actually necessary for mods to have access at all? I can see only bad coming from that knowledge on such a universal and simple basis.

We are not accountable for what happens in CTF, Chris.

My suggestion: take screenshots to serve as proofs if you fear a post will be edited. A mod must follow the forum's charter and be exemplary. If he doesn't he gets banned, just like everybody. The alternate mod's point is not only to make coffee for the three others.

indeed you are not accountable for CTF, neither am I, I don't post there. But why do CTF mods get access to my, and everybody's, IP address, even when we shun the place?

I was not referrign to posts being edited, but to ! complaint messages beign edited. Miguel suggests that the system is changed now, and only forum mods get to see ! complaints and not mods from other forums - is that true now?

Also, since you reminded me, forum posts are deletable, editable by ANY mod, not necessarily the mod thta deals with the forum in question, any mod can also mess with your user details etc. In present circumstances, unless this has been changed, I see again only bad from such a widespread access to personal data. Can, or is it already changed, it be possible to restrict mod access to those of us who dont go near CTF?

As to me takign screenshots!! too much hassle. why shoudl I have to?

No, a mod from CTF can't edit posts here, nor can we edit posts in CTF. And, as Miguel said, we can't even access the CTF complaints, so they can't access ours. Relax.

I'm on the beach in the Mediterrean sun and am quite relaxed thank you

This cross forum editing was in place in the past when I knew about it, if its changed now, good.

What about IP address knowledge though? Can ALL mods see my IP? Can they track someone movign around? IP address probign should be heavily restricted imo, do you remember the case of the African guy from Zambia? who was pursued not just by CTF mods a few years ago, but by CTF users in on the game? They were even telephonign him in Africa as "proof". Straight racism of course, blacks can't write chess programs or make intelligent posts seemed the theme. If you can't guarantee the calibre of mods, then you should not give them these tools.

[chrisw]

Congrats to the CCC mods. There are a few issues that concern.

Any complaint sent in by the ! button concerning here or the EO forum is displayed in full, together with mod responses on a general mod forum which is open to CTF mods as well. Under normal circumstances this would not perhaps appear a problem, except that I feel it inappropriate to make a ! complaint about a misbehaving CTF mod that can be read immediately, edited, deleted by same misbehaving CTF mod. Is it possible to flag up ! complaints such that they go to forum mods specifically and not mods who are unrelated to the forum in question?

Secondly, you might think this post should be in Help and Suggestions, but, again in that case, I, and possibly others, won't post into that forum for obvious reasons.

Thirdly, all user IP addresses are immediately available to all mods, including those not responsible for the forum one is actually reading or writing to. There are certain individuals I deem it inappropriate to have access to my IP address. Is it actually necessary for mods to have access at all? I can see only bad coming from that knowledge on such a universal and simple basis.

We are not accountable for what happens in CTF, Chris.

My suggestion: take screenshots to serve as proofs if you fear a post will be edited. A mod must follow the forum's charter and be exemplary. If he doesn't he gets banned, just like everybody. The alternate mod's point is not only to make coffee for the three others.

indeed you are not accountable for CTF, neither am I, I don't post there. But why do CTF mods get access to my, and everybody's, IP address, even when we shun the place?

I was not referrign to posts being edited, but to ! complaint messages beign edited. Miguel suggests that the system is changed now, and only forum mods get to see ! complaints and not mods from other forums - is that true now?

Also, since you reminded me, forum posts are deletable, editable by ANY mod, not necessarily the mod thta deals with the forum in question, any mod can also mess with your user details etc. In present circumstances, unless this has been changed, I see again only bad from such a widespread access to personal data. Can, or is it already changed, it be possible to restrict mod access to those of us who dont go near CTF?

As to me takign screenshots!! too much hassle. why shoudl I have to?

I can confirm what Julien said. When I enter CTF and view a post, I lose the ability to edit posts. I lose all the added permissions that I have while viewing CCC posts.

sounds good. what about mod ! complaints, do thye still ALL go into one huge mod complaint list, or has that been broken up so you can only see post complainst for which uou are responsible?

[Adam Hair]

Congrats to the CCC mods. There are a few issues that concern.

Any complaint sent in by the ! button concerning here or the EO forum is displayed in full, together with mod responses on a general mod forum which is open to CTF mods as well. Under normal circumstances this would not perhaps appear a problem, except that I feel it inappropriate to make a ! complaint about a misbehaving CTF mod that can be read immediately, edited, deleted by same misbehaving CTF mod. Is it possible to flag up ! complaints such that they go to forum mods specifically and not mods who are unrelated to the forum in question?

Secondly, you might think this post should be in Help and Suggestions, but, again in that case, I, and possibly others, won't post into that forum for obvious reasons.

Thirdly, all user IP addresses are immediately available to all mods, including those not responsible for the forum one is actually reading or writing to. There are certain individuals I deem it inappropriate to have access to my IP address. Is it actually necessary for mods to have access at all? I can see only bad coming from that knowledge on such a universal and simple basis.

We are not accountable for what happens in CTF, Chris.

My suggestion: take screenshots to serve as proofs if you fear a post will be edited. A mod must follow the forum's charter and be exemplary. If he doesn't he gets banned, just like everybody. The alternate mod's point is not only to make coffee for the three others.

indeed you are not accountable for CTF, neither am I, I don't post there. But why do CTF mods get access to my, and everybody's, IP address, even when we shun the place?

I was not referrign to posts being edited, but to ! complaint messages beign edited. Miguel suggests that the system is changed now, and only forum mods get to see ! complaints and not mods from other forums - is that true now?

Also, since you reminded me, forum posts are deletable, editable by ANY mod, not necessarily the mod thta deals with the forum in question, any mod can also mess with your user details etc. In present circumstances, unless this has been changed, I see again only bad from such a widespread access to personal data. Can, or is it already changed, it be possible to restrict mod access to those of us who dont go near CTF?

As to me takign screenshots!! too much hassle. why shoudl I have to?

I can confirm what Julien said. When I enter CTF and view a post, I lose the ability to edit posts. I lose all the added permissions that I have while viewing CCC posts.

sounds good. what about mod ! complaints, do thye still ALL go into one huge mod complaint list, or has that been broken up so you can only see post complainst for which uou are responsible?

I can only see CCC complaints. I assume that CTF mods can only see CTF complaints.

[Don]

Congrats to the CCC mods. There are a few issues that concern.

Any complaint sent in by the ! button concerning here or the EO forum is displayed in full, together with mod responses on a general mod forum which is open to CTF mods as well. Under normal circumstances this would not perhaps appear a problem, except that I feel it inappropriate to make a ! complaint about a misbehaving CTF mod that can be read immediately, edited, deleted by same misbehaving CTF mod. Is it possible to flag up ! complaints such that they go to forum mods specifically and not mods who are unrelated to the forum in question?

Secondly, you might think this post should be in Help and Suggestions, but, again in that case, I, and possibly others, won't post into that forum for obvious reasons.

Thirdly, all user IP addresses are immediately available to all mods, including those not responsible for the forum one is actually reading or writing to. There are certain individuals I deem it inappropriate to have access to my IP address. Is it actually necessary for mods to have access at all? I can see only bad coming from that knowledge on such a universal and simple basis.

The IP button is a good moderation tool. Many times in the past a user would join up under some false name, create all sorts of trouble, get removed from the forum and then do it again, in some case MANY times. Also we have had cases (not in my mod term but others) of the same person creating 20 or more "users" in order to vote or support himself.

I suspect that's an urban myth put out for discrediting purposes. Who has ever created multiple users? it's too pathetic.

You are just way too too funny!

[chrisw]

Congrats to the CCC mods. There are a few issues that concern.

Any complaint sent in by the ! button concerning here or the EO forum is displayed in full, together with mod responses on a general mod forum which is open to CTF mods as well. Under normal circumstances this would not perhaps appear a problem, except that I feel it inappropriate to make a ! complaint about a misbehaving CTF mod that can be read immediately, edited, deleted by same misbehaving CTF mod. Is it possible to flag up ! complaints such that they go to forum mods specifically and not mods who are unrelated to the forum in question?

Secondly, you might think this post should be in Help and Suggestions, but, again in that case, I, and possibly others, won't post into that forum for obvious reasons.

Thirdly, all user IP addresses are immediately available to all mods, including those not responsible for the forum one is actually reading or writing to. There are certain individuals I deem it inappropriate to have access to my IP address. Is it actually necessary for mods to have access at all? I can see only bad coming from that knowledge on such a universal and simple basis.

We are not accountable for what happens in CTF, Chris.

My suggestion: take screenshots to serve as proofs if you fear a post will be edited. A mod must follow the forum's charter and be exemplary. If he doesn't he gets banned, just like everybody. The alternate mod's point is not only to make coffee for the three others.

indeed you are not accountable for CTF, neither am I, I don't post there. But why do CTF mods get access to my, and everybody's, IP address, even when we shun the place?

I was not referrign to posts being edited, but to ! complaint messages beign edited. Miguel suggests that the system is changed now, and only forum mods get to see ! complaints and not mods from other forums - is that true now?

Also, since you reminded me, forum posts are deletable, editable by ANY mod, not necessarily the mod thta deals with the forum in question, any mod can also mess with your user details etc. In present circumstances, unless this has been changed, I see again only bad from such a widespread access to personal data. Can, or is it already changed, it be possible to restrict mod access to those of us who dont go near CTF?

As to me takign screenshots!! too much hassle. why shoudl I have to?

I can confirm what Julien said. When I enter CTF and view a post, I lose the ability to edit posts. I lose all the added permissions that I have while viewing CCC posts.

sounds good. what about mod ! complaints, do thye still ALL go into one huge mod complaint list, or has that been broken up so you can only see post complainst for which uou are responsible?

I can only see CCC complaints. I assume that CTF mods can only see CTF complaints.

ok, good, although your proof does depend on there being CTF ! complaints to see, and if you can't see them .....

assumign that is good, then my only remaining gripe is then about too wide IP address access. Marcel's idea of encoding the address looks good.

[chrisw]

Congrats to the CCC mods. There are a few issues that concern.

Any complaint sent in by the ! button concerning here or the EO forum is displayed in full, together with mod responses on a general mod forum which is open to CTF mods as well. Under normal circumstances this would not perhaps appear a problem, except that I feel it inappropriate to make a ! complaint about a misbehaving CTF mod that can be read immediately, edited, deleted by same misbehaving CTF mod. Is it possible to flag up ! complaints such that they go to forum mods specifically and not mods who are unrelated to the forum in question?

Secondly, you might think this post should be in Help and Suggestions, but, again in that case, I, and possibly others, won't post into that forum for obvious reasons.

Thirdly, all user IP addresses are immediately available to all mods, including those not responsible for the forum one is actually reading or writing to. There are certain individuals I deem it inappropriate to have access to my IP address. Is it actually necessary for mods to have access at all? I can see only bad coming from that knowledge on such a universal and simple basis.

The IP button is a good moderation tool. Many times in the past a user would join up under some false name, create all sorts of trouble, get removed from the forum and then do it again, in some case MANY times. Also we have had cases (not in my mod term but others) of the same person creating 20 or more "users" in order to vote or support himself.

I suspect that's an urban myth put out for discrediting purposes. Who has ever created multiple users? it's too pathetic.

You are just way too too funny!

Pardon? Who has created 20 plus voting users? There are users here ridiculous enough to go through the hassle of creating 20 plus different email addresses and then registering them just for voting? Does anyone care enough, or are you imagining an import above your station?

[Daniel White]

Congrats to the CCC mods. There are a few issues that concern.

Any complaint sent in by the ! button concerning here or the EO forum is displayed in full, together with mod responses on a general mod forum which is open to CTF mods as well. Under normal circumstances this would not perhaps appear a problem, except that I feel it inappropriate to make a ! complaint about a misbehaving CTF mod that can be read immediately, edited, deleted by same misbehaving CTF mod. Is it possible to flag up ! complaints such that they go to forum mods specifically and not mods who are unrelated to the forum in question?

Secondly, you might think this post should be in Help and Suggestions, but, again in that case, I, and possibly others, won't post into that forum for obvious reasons.

Thirdly, all user IP addresses are immediately available to all mods, including those not responsible for the forum one is actually reading or writing to. There are certain individuals I deem it inappropriate to have access to my IP address. Is it actually necessary for mods to have access at all? I can see only bad coming from that knowledge on such a universal and simple basis.

The IP button is a good moderation tool. Many times in the past a user would join up under some false name, create all sorts of trouble, get removed from the forum and then do it again, in some case MANY times. Also we have had cases (not in my mod term but others) of the same person creating 20 or more "users" in order to vote or support himself.

I would have thought the people on these forums would know how unreliable an IP address is for identifying somebody. A lot of IPs change every time the user reboots their router, not to mention proxys, tor etc etc.

[Dan Honeycutt]

I'm on the beach in the Mediterrean sun and am quite relaxed thank you

This cross forum editing was in place in the past when I knew about it, if its changed now, good.

It's been the way it is now since day 1 as far as I know. When we first moved to this software only Tim had access to Help and Suggestions. Some joker came along and spammed all three forums with a host of obscenities and such. CCC and CTF mods got their forums cleaned up in short order but Tim was awol and nobody could do anything about Help and Suggestions. Several members, Steve B. I specifically recall, were quite irate.

After that all moderators were given access to Help and Suggestions. So careful if you post there - I can get 'ya.

What about IP address knowledge though? Can ALL mods see my IP? Can they track someone movign around? IP address probign should be heavily restricted imo, do you remember the case of the African guy from Zambia? who was pursued not just by CTF mods a few years ago, but by CTF users in on the game? They were even telephonign him in Africa as "proof". Straight racism of course, blacks can't write chess programs or make intelligent posts seemed the theme. If you can't guarantee the calibre of mods, then you should not give them these tools.

I can see your IP.

Best
Dan H.

[Don]

The IP button is a good moderation tool. Many times in the past a user would join up under some false name, create all sorts of trouble, get removed from the forum and then do it again, in some case MANY times. Also we have had cases (not in my mod term but others) of the same person creating 20 or more "users" in order to vote or support himself.

For that purpose, say a 12 bit hash the upper 3 bytes together with the lower byte are sufficient.

I tend to agree with the IP concern. I travel a lot and it is none of the moderators' concern where that is.

It may come as a surprise to you, but it's not important for me to know where all your many world travels take you. Are you that important that you think this is some big moderator concern? What a paranoid world you live in.

The IP hashing business is not a solution - if you want to lock yourself into some anonymous little box out of fear of "big brother" then you need to stay off the internet completely. The connecting IP address is part of every socket connection and there is nothing you can do about that.

If you want to isolate yourself from the world you need to dispose of your cell phones and get off the Internet.

Using a VPN service might be a worthwhile countermeasure. There are plenty of those. Also good for watching streaming TV content from your home country (or others) bypassing "region restrictions".

[Don]

Congrats to the CCC mods. There are a few issues that concern.

Any complaint sent in by the ! button concerning here or the EO forum is displayed in full, together with mod responses on a general mod forum which is open to CTF mods as well. Under normal circumstances this would not perhaps appear a problem, except that I feel it inappropriate to make a ! complaint about a misbehaving CTF mod that can be read immediately, edited, deleted by same misbehaving CTF mod. Is it possible to flag up ! complaints such that they go to forum mods specifically and not mods who are unrelated to the forum in question?

Secondly, you might think this post should be in Help and Suggestions, but, again in that case, I, and possibly others, won't post into that forum for obvious reasons.

Thirdly, all user IP addresses are immediately available to all mods, including those not responsible for the forum one is actually reading or writing to. There are certain individuals I deem it inappropriate to have access to my IP address. Is it actually necessary for mods to have access at all? I can see only bad coming from that knowledge on such a universal and simple basis.

There is also the matter of the forums blatant announement showing the "Users browsing this forum: ", isn't that an invasion of my privacy? If I want to browse talkchess it's nobody's business but my own!

Maybe we can complain about all these human rights infraction to the "American Civil Liberties Union" and get some changes made!

This is way more interesting than the Rybka/ICGA debacle, finally a real cause for the super bored people to take up!!!