Did Anand miss a win in Game 3?

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notyetagm
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Re: Did Anand miss a win in Game 3?

Post by notyetagm »

Houdini wrote:In Game 3 of the WC match, the following position was reached after move 33.

[D]2r5/1p2R2p/3P2k1/p4p2/7R/1P3P2/P2r2P1/1K6 w - -
Instead of Anand's 34.Rc7 the alternative 34.d7! looks very promising.

[D]2r5/1p1PR2p/6k1/p4p2/7R/1P3P2/P2r2P1/1K6 b - -
What is your and your engine's opinion?
From the comment thread over at Chess Vibes http://www.chessvibes.com/reports/anand ... r-37-moves
In the press conference, they analyzed a nice line that at the end with a rook sac and queen with check. This was 34.d7 Rcc2 35.Rc4 Rb2+ 36.Kc1 Rxa2 37.Rc8 Rf2 (Threatening mate on f1 or a1) 38. Re6+! Kf7 39.Rf6!! wins. So Vishy had not seen this resource and hence dint play 34.d7. A pity. But a nice fighting game :)
Jouni
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Re: Did Anand miss a win in Game 3?

Post by Jouni »

In Jeffrey Hall line ... 35.Rc4 Rb2+ ?? is losing (-Rxc4 = draw)
Jouni
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Houdini
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Re: Did Anand miss a win in Game 3?

Post by Houdini »

notyetagm wrote:From the comment thread over at Chess Vibes http://www.chessvibes.com/reports/anand ... r-37-moves
In the press conference, they analyzed a nice line that at the end with a rook sac and queen with check. This was 34.d7 Rcc2 35.Rc4 Rb2+ 36.Kc1 Rxa2 37.Rc8 Rf2 (Threatening mate on f1 or a1) 38. Re6+! Kf7 39.Rf6!! wins. So Vishy had not seen this resource and hence dint play 34.d7. A pity. But a nice fighting game :)
He'll be disappointed to have missed a good opportunity - he didn't have a lot of time left on the clock.

After 34.d7! there appear to be 3 main defenses for black:
1) 34...Rcc2 35.Rc4 Rxc4 36.bxc4
2) 34...Rd1+ 35.Kb2 Rd2+ 36.Ka3 Rcc2
3) 34...Rd1+ 35.Kb2 Rc5 36.Rexh7 Rd2+

So far in each line Houdini gives a score above +0.9 at depth 35 or higher.
Not sure whether it's a win, but it's certainly very promising.
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Mike S.
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Re: Did Anand miss a win in Game 3?

Post by Mike S. »

After intensive backwards analysis in several sub-variations, and at 20+ depths, Ivanhoe 946h's opinion is:

39: Anand,V - Gelfand,B, World Chess Championship Match 2012
[D]2r5/1p2R2p/3P2k1/p4p2/7R/1P3P2/P2r2P1/1K6 w - - 0 1

Analysis by Ivanhoe 46hm w32 Analysis-tb (Atom N455/1.66 GHz only):
(...)
34.d7 Rcc2 35.Rc4 Rxc4 36.bxc4 h5 37.Kc1 Rd4 38.Kb2 Kf6 39.Rh7 Kg6 40.Kc3 Rd1 41.d8R Rxd8 42.Rxb7 Kf6 43.c5 Rd5 44.Rb5 a4 45.Ra5 Ke7 46.a3 f4 47.Kb4 Rd2 48.Ra7+ Ke6 49.Rg7 Rc2 50.Kb5
+/- (0.97) Depth: 10 00:00:01 309kN
+/- (0.98) Depth: 21 00:01:31 37938kN, tb=757

I guess 34.d7 was a reasonable attempt to win, but it has been reported that Anand was low on time.
Regards, Mike
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gleperlier
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Re: Did Anand miss a win in Game 3?

Post by gleperlier »

[D]2r5/1p1PR2p/6k1/p4p2/7R/1P3P2/P2r2P1/1K6 b - - 0 1

Analysis by CM XI Aiglos II:

1...Rd1+ 2.Kb2 Rd2+ 3.Ka3 Rcc2 4.Ka4 Rxa2+ 5.Kb5 Rab2 6.Kxa5 Rxb3 7.Rb4 Rd5+ 8.Ka4 Rxb4+ 9.Kxb4 Kf6 10.Rxh7 Ke6 11.d8Q Rxd8 12.Rxb7 Rd2 13.g3
+/= (0.52) Depth: 17 00:03:12 503mN
(Gab, 14.05.2012)
kgburcham
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Re: Did Anand miss a win in Game 3?

Post by kgburcham »

Dr.Wael Deeb wrote:Again as I wrote above without even using a chess engine,Mr.Houdini has rushed a little bit so early to claim that Anand had missed an easy win....
Dr.D
I went back to see the "Easy Win" words, could not find them.
All I could find that Robert said is this:
"Instead of Anand's 34.Rc7 the alternative 34.d7! looks very promising."

with Roberts high chess rating, strong hardware, strong program, and programming ability, I didnt think he would say "easy win".
This group has run off most all programmers, I hate to lose another programmer, but if Robert dissappears, I will still read here.
kgburcham
Waschbaer
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Re: Did Anand miss a win in Game 3?

Post by Waschbaer »

Mr.Houdini has rushed a little bit so early to claim that Anand had missed an easy win....
Sorry, you must see things that aren`t there!
In his post Mr. Houdine asked: did Anand miss a win?

And he wrote: "...looks very promising"

Nothing else!
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Dr.Wael Deeb
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Re: Did Anand miss a win in Game 3?

Post by Dr.Wael Deeb »

Waschbaer wrote:
Mr.Houdini has rushed a little bit so early to claim that Anand had missed an easy win....
Sorry, you must see things that aren`t there!
In his post Mr. Houdine asked: did Anand miss a win?

And he wrote: "...looks very promising"

Nothing else!
"Very promising" in the game of ches is almost identical to winning the game actually so I stick to my guns on that....

I am not interested in a game of words and I do handle the english language pretty well....at least I think so 8-)
_No one can hit as hard as life.But it ain’t about how hard you can hit.It’s about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward.How much you can take and keep moving forward….
Jack Lad
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Re: Did Anand miss a win in Game 3?

Post by Jack Lad »

gleperlier wrote:[D]2r5/1p1PR2p/6k1/p4p2/7R/1P3P2/P2r2P1/1K6 b - - 0 1

Analysis by CM XI Aiglos II:

1...Rd1+ 2.Kb2 Rd2+ 3.Ka3 Rcc2 4.Ka4 Rxa2+ 5.Kb5 Rab2 6.Kxa5 Rxb3 7.Rb4 Rd5+ 8.Ka4 Rxb4+ 9.Kxb4 Kf6 10.Rxh7 Ke6 11.d8Q Rxd8 12.Rxb7 Rd2 13.g3
+/= (0.52) Depth: 17 00:03:12 503mN
(Gab, 14.05.2012)
6. Kxa5? is a blunder. White needs to play Kb6! instead to win.
[d] 8/1p1PR2p/1K4k1/p4p2/7R/1P3P2/1r1r2P1/8 b - - 3 6
Now cracks a noble heart.—Good night, sweet Princess, And flights of angels sing thee to thy rest!
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Dr.Wael Deeb
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Re: Did Anand miss a win in Game 3?

Post by Dr.Wael Deeb »

kgburcham wrote:
Dr.Wael Deeb wrote:Again as I wrote above without even using a chess engine,Mr.Houdini has rushed a little bit so early to claim that Anand had missed an easy win....
Dr.D
I went back to see the "Easy Win" words, could not find them.
All I could find that Robert said is this:
"Instead of Anand's 34.Rc7 the alternative 34.d7! looks very promising."

with Roberts high chess rating, strong hardware, strong program, and programming ability, I didnt think he would say "easy win".
This group has run off most all programmers, I hate to lose another programmer, but if Robert dissappears, I will still read here.
kgburcham
So what Should I do :!: :?:

Build a statue of Robert and get down on my knees because he's a programmer :!: :?:

Sticking to the same logic,where were you when Don or the so called Mr.Komodo called me Dweeb without no reason of whatever :!: :?:

I treat people by their kindness or by their nasty nature....Robert is definitely in the second group and if he wants to leave then let it be....
Dr.D
_No one can hit as hard as life.But it ain’t about how hard you can hit.It’s about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward.How much you can take and keep moving forward….