Bobby Fischer outrageous chess moves,position 7 & 8....

[Dr.Wael Deeb]

[D]3r2k1/p4pp1/1b4qp/2p2n2/2Q1BB2/2PP4/Pr5P/R4R1K w - - 0 1


Bobby Fischer-Arthur Bisguler
New York State Open
White's 27th move


Solution:27.Be5!,the black horse is pinned to his queen by the white
bishop at e4....


[D]5r2/p1qP4/2p2p2/5Q1p/4R1rP/6Pk/P4P2/6K1 w - - 0 1


Bobby Fischer-E.Osbun
Simulianeous Exhibition with clocks
White's 44th move....


Solution:This should be a rather easy mate after 44.Rxg4+!....

[plattyaj]

A bit too easy these two. Schola got Be5 in 35ms and Rxg4 in 32ms on rather old hardware. It would have taken me a little longer I think

Andy.

[CRoberson]

These tests were with a 32 bit compile and a slow laptop.

Telepath finds Be5 quickly

FEN: 3r2k1/p4pp1/1b4qp/2p2n2/2Q1BB2/2PP4/Pr5P/R4R1K w - - 0 1

Telepath Version 4.102b:
1 00:00 3 0 -1.98
1 00:00 16 0 -1.54
1 00:00 102 0 -1.54 Bf4xh6
2 00:00 369 102 -1.54
2 00:00 908 102 +0.75
2 00:00 1.266 102 +0.75 Bf4c1
3 00:00 1.814 1.266 +0.75
3 00:00 3.237 1.266 +0.75 Bf4c1 Rb2e2
4 00:00 8.525 3.237 -8.57
4 00:00 19.236 3.237 -8.51
4 00:00 25.104 3.237 -1.09
4 00:00 32.768 3.237 +0.03
4 00:00 35.167 3.237 +0.03 Bf4e5 Nf5e3 Be4xg6
5 00:00 69.545 35.167 +1.65
5 00:00 72.544 35.167 +1.65 Bf4e5 Qg6e6 Rf1xf5 Qe6xc4
6 00:00 87.478 72.544 +1.42
6 00:00 98.234 72.544 +1.42 Bf4e5 Qg6e6 Rf1xf5 Qe6xc4 d3xc4
7 00:00 232.322 98.234 +1.63
7 00:00 243.055 98.234 +1.63 Bf4e5 Qg6e6 Rf1xf5 Qe6xc4 d3xc4 Rd8d2
8 00:01 349.067 243.055 +1.57 Bf4e5 Qg6e6 Rf1xf5 Qe6xc4 d3xc4 Rb2e2 Be4f3
8 00:01 398.019 243.055 +1.57 Bf4e5 Qg6e6 Rf1xf5 Qe6xc4 d3xc4 Rb2e2 Be4f3
9 00:02 711.602 199.009 +1.60 Bf4e5 Qg6e6 Rf1xf5 Qe6xc4 d3xc4 g7g6 Ra1g1 Rb2xa2
9 00:02 789.306 199.009 +1.60 Bf4e5 Qg6e6 Rf1xf5 Qe6xc4 d3xc4 g7g6 Ra1g1 Rb2xa2
10 00:04 1.242.825 263.102 +1.42 Bf4e5 Qg6e6 Rf1xf5 Qe6xc4 d3xc4 g7g6 Ra1g1 Rb2xa2 Be4d5
10 00:04 1.449.807 263.102 +1.42 Bf4e5 Qg6e6 Rf1xf5 Qe6xc4 d3xc4 g7g6 Ra1g1 Rb2xa2 Be4d5
11 00:08 2.572.574 289.961 +1.52 Bf4e5 Qg6e6 Rf1xf5 Qe6xc4 d3xc4 f7f6 Be4d5+ Kg8h8 Be5f4 Rd8f8 Bf4d6
11 00:12 3.996.117 289.961 +1.52 Bf4e5 Qg6e6 Rf1xf5 Qe6xc4 d3xc4 f7f6 Be4d5+ Kg8h8 Be5f4 Rd8f8 Bf4d6
12 00:21 6.820.782 307.393 +1.78 Bf4e5 Qg6e6 Rf1xf5 Qe6xc4 d3xc4 f7f6 Be5xf6 g7xf6 Rf5xf6 Rd8d7 Rf6g6+ Kg8h8 Rg6xh6+
12 00:23 7.813.241 307.393 +1.78 Bf4e5 Qg6e6 Rf1xf5 Qe6xc4 d3xc4 f7f6 Be5xf6 g7xf6 Rf5xf6 Rd8d7 Rf6g6+ Kg8h8 Rg6xh6+
13 00:34 11.399.388 325.551 +1.80 Bf4e5 Qg6e6 Rf1xf5 Qe6xc4 d3xc4 f7f6 Be5xf6 g7xf6 Rf5xf6 Rd8d7 Rf6xh6 Bb6c7 Ra1g1+
13 00:40 13.638.701 325.551 +1.80 Bf4e5 Qg6e6 Rf1xf5 Qe6xc4 d3xc4 f7f6 Be5xf6 g7xf6 Rf5xf6 Rd8d7 Rf6xh6 Bb6c7 Ra1g1+
14 01:02 21.028.880 332.651 +1.81 Bf4e5 Qg6e6 Rf1xf5 Qe6xc4 d3xc4 f7f6 Be5xf6 g7xf6 Rf5xf6 Kg8g7 Rf6g6+ Kg7f8 Rg6xh6 Bb6c7 Ra1f1+
14 01:18 26.540.346 332.651 +1.81 Bf4e5 Qg6e6 Rf1xf5 Qe6xc4 d3xc4 f7f6 Be5xf6 g7xf6 Rf5xf6 Kg8g7 Rf6g6+ Kg7f8 Rg6xh6 Bb6c7 Ra1f1+
15 01:57 39.637.656 335.953 +1.85 Bf4e5 Qg6e6 Rf1xf5 Qe6xc4 d3xc4 f7f6 Be5xf6 g7xf6 Rf5xf6 Kg8g7 Rf6g6+ Kg7f8 Rg6xh6 Rb2f2 Rh6h8+ Kf8f7 Rh8h7+
15 02:43 55.925.540 335.953 +1.85 Bf4e5 Qg6e6 Rf1xf5 Qe6xc4 d3xc4 f7f6 Be5xf6 g7xf6 Rf5xf6 Kg8g7 Rf6g6+ Kg7f8 Rg6xh6 Rb2f2 Rh6h8+ Kf8f7 Rh8h7+
16 04:00 81.566.873 341.009 0.00 Bf4e5 Qg6e6 Rf1xf5 Qe6xc4 d3xc4 f7f6 Be5xf6 g7xf6 Rf5xf6 Kg8g7 Rf6g6+ Kg7f8 Rg6xh6 Rb2f2 Rh6h8+ Kf8f7 Rh8h7+



Rxg4 also easy


FEN: 5r2/p1qP4/2p2p2/5Q1p/4R1rP/6Pk/P4P2/6K1 w - - 0 1

Telepath Version 4.102b:
1 00:00 6 0 -2.16
1 00:00 43 0 -1.20
1 00:00 53 0 -1.08
1 00:00 97 0 -1.08 Re4d4
2 00:00 285 97 -1.33
2 00:00 788 97 +0.99
2 00:00 1.020 97 +0.99 Re4e8
3 00:00 1.276 1.020 +0.99
3 00:00 2.007 1.020 +0.99 Re4e8 Qc7d6
4 00:00 2.827 2.007 +0.99
4 00:00 5.048 2.007 +0.99 Re4e8 Qc7d6 d7d8Q
5 00:00 6.564 5.048 +0.99
5 00:00 8.740 5.048 +0.99 Re4e8 Qc7d6 d7d8Q Qd6xd8
6 00:00 11.951 8.740 +0.99
6 00:00 40.409 8.740 +1.30
6 00:00 45.068 8.740 +1.30 Qf5f3 Rg4xg3+ f2xg3 Qc7b6+ Kg1f1 Qb6b1+ Re4e1 Qb1xa2
7 00:00 71.954 45.068 +1.76
7 00:00 79.928 45.068 +1.76 Qf5f3 Rg4xg3+ f2xg3 Qc7b6+ Kg1f1 Qb6b5+ Kf1f2 Qb5b2+ Re4e2 Qb2d4+ Re2e3
8 00:00 114.747 79.928 +1.58 Qf5f3 Rg4xg3+ f2xg3 Qc7b6+ Kg1f1 Qb6b5+ Kf1f2 Qb5b2+ Re4e2 Qb2d4+ Re2e3 Qd4d2+ Kf2g1 Qd2h2+ Kg1f1
8 00:00 179.571 79.928 +2.10 Re4xg4 Qc7e5 Qf5xe5 f6xe5 Rg4b4 a7a5 Rb4c4
8 00:00 200.746 79.928 +2.10 Re4xg4 Qc7e5 Qf5xe5 f6xe5 Rg4b4 a7a5 Rb4c4
9 00:00 235.031 200.746 +2.14 Re4xg4 Qc7e5 Qf5xe5 f6xe5 Rg4b4 Rf8a8 Rb4b3 Ra8f8
9 00:01 314.124 200.746 +2.14 Re4xg4 Qc7e5 Qf5xe5 f6xe5 Rg4b4 Rf8a8 Rb4b3 Ra8f8
10 00:01 387.350 157.062 +2.31 Re4xg4 Qc7e5 Qf5xe5 f6xe5 Rg4a4 Rf8b8 Kg1f1 c6c5 Ra4xa7
10 00:01 503.296 157.062 +2.31 Re4xg4 Qc7e5 Qf5xe5 f6xe5 Rg4a4 Rf8b8 Kg1f1 c6c5 Ra4xa7
11 00:01 594.257 251.648 +2.66 Re4xg4 Qc7e5 Qf5xe5 f6xe5 Rg4a4 Rf8b8 Kg1f1 c6c5 Ra4a5 Kh3g4
11 00:02 806.699 251.648 +2.66 Re4xg4 Qc7e5 Qf5xe5 f6xe5 Rg4a4 Rf8b8 Kg1f1 c6c5 Ra4a5 Kh3g4
12 00:02 967.931 268.899 +2.50 Re4xg4 Qc7e5 Qf5xe5 f6xe5 Rg4a4 Rf8b8 Kg1f1 c6c5 Ra4a5 Rb8d8 Ra5xa7
12 00:04 1.473.148 268.899 +2.50 Re4xg4 Qc7e5 Qf5xe5 f6xe5 Rg4a4 Rf8b8 Kg1f1 c6c5 Ra4a5 Rb8d8 Ra5xa7
13 00:05 1.779.973 294.629 +2.75 Re4xg4 Qc7e5 Qf5xe5 f6xe5 Rg4a4 Rf8b8 Kg1f1 Rb8b1+ Kf1e2 Rb1b2+ Ke2d3 Rb2b1 Ra4xa7 Kh3g2 Kd3c2
13 00:21 7.796.516 294.629 +2.75 Re4xg4 Qc7e5 Qf5xe5 f6xe5 Rg4a4 Rf8b8 Kg1f1 Rb8b1+ Kf1e2 Rb1b2+ Ke2d3 Rb2b1 Ra4xa7 Kh3g2 Kd3c2
14 00:24 8.650.273 354.387 +2.40 Re4xg4 Qc7e5 Qf5xe5 f6xe5 Rg4a4 Rf8d8 Ra4xa7 Kh3g4 a2a4 Kg4f5 a4a5 Kf5e6 a5a6
1 01:10 24.472.799 354.387 0.00 Re4xg4 Qc7e5 Qf5xe5 f6xe5 Rg4a4 Rf8d8 Ra4xa7 Kh3g4 a2a4 Kg4f5 a4a5 Kf5e6 a5a6

[Dr.Wael Deeb]

Thanks for sharing your results,yes,the two positions are pretty easy for the chess engines....

[Jim Logan]

Certainly the first problem is easy. But mate is a bit far away in the second position with Black countering Qe5. Fritz 11 prefers Qf3 instead of Bobby's move.

[Dr.Wael Deeb]

Certainly the first problem is easy. But mate is a bit far away in the second position with Black countering Qe5. Fritz 11 prefers Qf3 instead of Bobby's move.

My understanding of the position is that Fischer played 44.Rxg4! with the idea of Qd3 and then Qf1 mate....
Countering with Qe5 after Rxg4 won't save the black position,it will only extend it's suffering....
The move of Fritz 11 is also pretty acceptable,but it seems that fischer seeked beauty with his move....

[kgburcham]

I have some friends that just bought quads and three of the top commercial programs. I got these guys into computer chess. I told them that everyone at this site were above average and some are the best in the world with test positions. I told my friends that we like getting our strong programs on fast hardware challenged.

Then you post an old outdated mate in one. All of your positions so far have been easily solved by todays weakest programs on small hardware.

The selection of a good test position to challenge the guys here takes some effort. There are very few test positions left in the world that have not been posted here or been put in a test suite.

None are left in books that the top guys here have not seen already.

Deep Blue positions have been ripped apart. Go find one.

So far your positions have only challenged my Fidelity MACH III MASTER Model 6113 Rated 2265. This uses a 68000 microprocessor running at 16 mhz. This unit has 64k ROM and 80kRAM.

Dont bring up the position of yours where I posted it took 18 minutes to solve. Not true. The previous position the program chose was also winning in short time.

You can keep posting these positions but you should state like others have done------"For dedicateds Only" or "Not for Commercials" etc...

Also why did you make a reference to your chess library, implying that others here dont have?
I have always assumed that most here have an extensive chess library that they have accumulated for years just like mine and some have much more.

Maybe you will post some challenging positions, we will see.

I will go post one of my all time favorite positions now.

kgburcham

[Dr.Wael Deeb]

I have some friends that just bought quads and three of the top commercial programs. I got these guys into computer chess. I told them that everyone at this site were above average and some are the best in the world with test positions. I told my friends that we like getting our strong programs on fast hardware challenged.

Then you post an old outdated mate in one. All of your positions so far have been easily solved by todays weakest programs on small hardware.

The selection of a good test position to challenge the guys here takes some effort. There are very few test positions left in the world that have not been posted here or been put in a test suite.

None are left in books that the top guys here have not seen already.

Deep Blue positions have been ripped apart. Go find one.

So far your positions have only challenged my Fidelity MACH III MASTER Model 6113 Rated 2265. This uses a 68000 microprocessor running at 16 mhz. This unit has 64k ROM and 80kRAM.

Dont bring up the position of yours where I posted it took 18 minutes to solve. Not true. The previous position the program chose was also winning in short time.

You can keep posting these positions but you should state like others have done------"For dedicateds Only" or "Not for Commercials" etc...

Also why did you make a reference to your chess library, implying that others here dont have?
I have always assumed that most here have an extensive chess library that they have accumulated for years just like mine and some have much more.

Maybe you will post some challenging positions, we will see.

I will go post one of my all time favorite positions now.

kgburcham

I can simply choose the latest positions from the ChessBase magazine or from the newest yearbook of New In Chess and fload you and your friends with hundreds of tough positions to fry your hardware....
My main task is to show respect to one of the greatest chess players the world had ever known....
I don't care about your stupid outdated,slower than a snail,dedicated units....
As you can see,some users here were more than happy to test themselves or to learn something new from these outdated positions,so your statement is rather rude and pretty unfriendly....
And what is your problem with my statement that I have tons of chess books bought and collected through the years!?Did I insult someone with this statement!?
I know that you have something in your life that you are bravely fighting against and I as a physician regard this,but try to be more friendly oriented never the less in your posts....

[kgburcham]

I can simply choose the latest positions from the ChessBase magazine or from the newest yearbook of New In Chess and fload you and your friends with hundreds of tough positions to fry your hardware....
Please post some of these hardware frying positions, that is what we are looking for.
My main task is to show respect to one of the greatest chess players the world had ever known....
Many could care less about booby fishter. He damned the US later in his life. Cursed the Jews and many others. He was disrespectful to many great chess players.
I don't care about your stupid outdated,slower than a snail,dedicated units....
Easy you will irritate Steve B. I like my two Fidelity dedicateds
As you can see,some users here were more than happy to test themselves or to learn something new from these outdated positions,so your statement is rather rude and pretty unfriendly....
My point here is that this site is about chess programs and hardware. If you want to talk booty fishter, you should go to the Talk Forum.
And what is your problem with my statement that I have tons of chess books bought and collected through the years!?Did I insult someone with this statement!?
My point with this one is that most here also have as much as your library or more. I am not going to say anything about my chess library in this crowd of chess badasses.
I know that you have something in your life that you are bravely fighting against and I as a physician regard this,but try to be more friendly oriented never the less in your posts....
Nothing I posted is personal. Nothing about your internet character bothers me. It bugs me when someone posts a position on the "dedicated" level at this site and does not classify it as such. If someone identifies a dedicated level test position I will not open the post---unless I feel like getting out my "stupid outdated,slower than a snail,dedicated unit"

Also I check most tournaments and all high level GM tournaments for test positions. Also I keep up with Chessbase info. I do not think this is a good source.
Also I am collecting 2008 GM and Super GM tournament blunders. This is really growing.

Mr. Wael Deeb
Have a good day

kgburcham

[bob]

Be5 is found instantly with a score of +3...

Code: Select all

                3     0.02  -1.07   1. Rae1 Qg4 2. Bd5
                3     0.02   0.53   1. Be5 Ne3 2. Bxg6 Nxc4 3. Bxf7+ 
                3->   0.02   0.53   1. Be5 Ne3 2. Bxg6 Nxc4 3. Bxf7+ (s=4)
                4     0.02     +1   1. Be5!! 
                4     0.02     +3   1. Be5!!           
                4     0.02   3.07   1. Be5 Qe6 2. Rxf5 Qxc4 3. dxc4 (s=3)
                4->   0.02   3.07   1. Be5 Qe6 2. Rxf5 Qxc4 3. dxc4  
                5     0.02   3.07   1. Be5 Qe6 2. Rxf5 Qxc4 3. dxc4  
                5->   0.03   3.07   1. Be5 Qe6 2. Rxf5 Qxc4 3. dxc4  
                6     0.03   2.97   1. Be5 Qe6 2. Rxf5 Qxc4 3. dxc4 Rbd2
                6->   0.03   2.97   1. Be5 Qe6 2. Rxf5 Qxc4 3. dxc4 Rbd2
                7     0.03   3.04   1. Be5 Qe6 2. Rxf5 Qxc4 3. dxc4 f6
                                    4. Bf4
                7->   0.04   3.04   1. Be5 Qe6 2. Rxf5 Qxc4 3. dxc4 f6
                                    4. Bf4

The second one is not so clear... Qf3 might be even better... apologies to Fischer in advance...

Code: Select all

               16    16.57   3.90   1. Qf3 Rxg3+ 2. fxg3 Qb6+ 3. Re3 Qb1+
                                    4. Kf2 Qb2+ 5. Kf1 Qb5+ 6. Rd3 Rd8
                                    7. g4+ Kxh4 8. Qxf6+ Kxg4 9. Ke2 Rxd7
                                    10. Qe6+ Kf4 11. Qe3+ Kf5 12. Qh3+
                                    Ke5 13. Qxd7 Qb2+ 14. Rd2
               16->  25.69   3.90   1. Qf3 Rxg3+ 2. fxg3 Qb6+ 3. Re3 Qb1+
                                    4. Kf2 Qb2+ 5. Kf1 Qb5+ 6. Rd3 Rd8
                                    7. g4+ Kxh4 8. Qxf6+ Kxg4 9. Ke2 Rxd7
                                    10. Qe6+ Kf4 11. Qe3+ Kf5 12. Qh3+
                                    Ke5 13. Qxd7 Qb2+ 14. Rd2 (s=2)
               17    43.94     +1   1. Qf3!!   (15.8Mnps)             
               17     1:23     +3   1. Qf3!!   (15.7Mnps)             
               17     2:09     +M   1. Qf3!!   (16.6Mnps)