FIDE rules expert wanted!

[hgm]

We are having a discussion on WB forum on what you have to do to lose against a bare King. If I forfeit on time, and my opponent is bare... does that count as a loss or as a win? If I leave the tournament room, do I immediately forfeit? Am I allowed to resign?

Who knows this?

Should I have WinBoard corect all wins of a bare King o draws, when claim verification is on?

[Graham Banks]

My understanding is that you can't claim a win unless you have mating material left.
If your opponent only has a king left and your flag falls, he can only claim a draw.

[Uri Blass]

We are having a discussion on WB forum on what you have to do to lose against a bare King. If I forfeit on time, and my opponent is bare... does that count as a loss or as a win? If I leave the tournament room, do I immediately forfeit? Am I allowed to resign?

Who knows this?

Should I have WinBoard corect all wins of a bare King o draws, when claim verification is on?

It is a draw unless the side that wins on time can give checkmate(assuming that the opponent does everything to lose on the board)

I am not sure if you are allowed to resign but win on time for the side with only king is a draw.

Uri

[Tony]

We are having a discussion on WB forum on what you have to do to lose against a bare King. If I forfeit on time, and my opponent is bare... does that count as a loss or as a win? If I leave the tournament room, do I immediately forfeit? Am I allowed to resign?

Who knows this?

Should I have WinBoard corect all wins of a bare King o draws, when claim verification is on?

It's a draw. Immediate (like in a checkmate)

The basic rule is that if you can't win, even if you're opponent helped you, it's a draw.

Tony

[bob]

We are having a discussion on WB forum on what you have to do to lose against a bare King. If I forfeit on time, and my opponent is bare... does that count as a loss or as a win? If I leave the tournament room, do I immediately forfeit? Am I allowed to resign?

Who knows this?

Should I have WinBoard corect all wins of a bare King o draws, when claim verification is on?

Unless the rules have changed, a lone king can not win. So if I have a lone king and your flag falls, the game is a draw, as you have to have enough material to checkmate. But note that you don't have to have enough material to force checkmate, but enough to mate in some possible way even if the opponent has to play sub-optimally to do so. IE _any_ possible winning chance, no matter how remote, will let me win on time. Otherwise it is a draw. Unless I am losing of course.

[Mike S.]

From the FIDE Laws of Chess:

http://www.fide.com/info/handbook?id=124&view=article

5.1 b. The game is won by the player whose opponent declares he resigns. This immediately ends the game.

I quote this simple rule because it is the only occurrance of the word "resign" in the whole document, and it is unrestrained. In other words, there is no rule which would say, you're not allowed to resign if the opponent has no material which is capable to mate. There is no such rule, that's why I think it is allowed to resign even in such cases.

Although it would of course seem very weird to do so!

6.10 Except where Articles 5.1 or one of the Articles 5.2 (a), (b) and (c) apply, if a player does not complete the prescribed number of moves in the allotted time, the game is lost by the player. However, the game is drawn, if the position is such that the opponent cannot checkmate the player`s king by any possible series of legal moves, even with the most unskilled counterplay.

That means for example, the lone king can lose KNN-K on time, and both sides can lose in KB-KN while KB-K and KN-K are draws.

[Terry McCracken]

From the FIDE Laws of Chess:

http://www.fide.com/info/handbook?id=124&view=article

5.1 b. The game is won by the player whose opponent declares he resigns. This immediately ends the game.

That rule should be amended or qualified. As of course no mating material no win. This should be clarified and a rule implimented that you can't resign in such situations.

I quote this simple rule because it is the only occurrance of the word "resign" in the whole document, and it is unrestrained. In other words, there is no rule which would say, you're not allowed to resign if the opponent has no material which is capable to mate. There is no such rule, that's why I think it is allowed to resign even in such cases.

Although it would of course seem very weird to do so!

6.10 Except where Articles 5.1 or one of the Articles 5.2 (a), (b) and (c) apply, if a player does not complete the prescribed number of moves in the allotted time, the game is lost by the player. However, the game is drawn, if the position is such that the opponent cannot checkmate the player`s king by any possible series of legal moves, even with the most unskilled counterplay.

That means for example, the lone king can lose KNN-K on time, and both sides can lose in KB-KN while KB-K and KN-K are draws.

[Tony]

From the FIDE Laws of Chess:

http://www.fide.com/info/handbook?id=124&view=article

5.1 b. The game is won by the player whose opponent declares he resigns. This immediately ends the game.

I quote this simple rule because it is the only occurrance of the word "resign" in the whole document, and it is unrestrained. In other words, there is no rule which would say, you're not allowed to resign if the opponent has no material which is capable to mate. There is no such rule, that's why I think it is allowed to resign even in such cases.

Although it would of course seem very weird to do so!
.

You can't resign when the game already ended.

If someone would try to resign in such a position, I think the referee can interfer ( and disqualify someone)

Tony

Tony

[Terry McCracken]

From the FIDE Laws of Chess:

http://www.fide.com/info/handbook?id=124&view=article

5.1 b. The game is won by the player whose opponent declares he resigns. This immediately ends the game.

I quote this simple rule because it is the only occurrance of the word "resign" in the whole document, and it is unrestrained. In other words, there is no rule which would say, you're not allowed to resign if the opponent has no material which is capable to mate. There is no such rule, that's why I think it is allowed to resign even in such cases.

Although it would of course seem very weird to do so!
.

You can't resign when the game already ended.

If someone would try to resign in such a position, I think the referee can interfer ( and disqualify someone)

Tony

Tony

That's a good point, and should be made crystal clear. Otherwise people might attempt for whatever reason to throw games.

I find this discussion, no offence intended, a bit silly. I'm surprised by the original question!? The answer should be obvious.

Terry

[BBauer]

If you want to loose the game
let your mobile ring.
regards
Bernhard