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Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1
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Sven Schüle



Joined: 15 May 2008
Posts: 2249
Location: Berlin, Germany
PostPost subject: Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1    Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 10:13 pm Reply to topic Reply with quote
bob wrote:
Sven Schüle wrote:
syzygy wrote:
Sven Schüle wrote:
syzygy wrote:
Sven Schüle wrote:
You need to convert square numbers that are in the range 0..255 into those in the range 0..63 (using SQUARE_TO_64) before indexing any of the magic_bb_xxx arrays. Maybe you can do this within bishop_attacks(), rook_attacks() etc.

Is there any advantage to a 16x16 board when using bitboards?

I don't understand your question, do you mean "is there any advantage of a 16x16 board"? If not, can you please explain your question?

Well, maybe we should not start a discussion on what is correct English idiom.

Agreed Smile And I apologize for my insufficient understanding of correct English idioms Wink

So to answer your question: I don't see any advantage in it but that is not the point IMO. I think Matthew is experimenting with a way to use bitboards in Fruit with as little changes as possible, so initially he tries to keep most of Fruit's internal representation intact, including the 16x16 board stuff. Efficiency is not an issue at this stage. I think this approach is not bad in general. The next steps (after making the current state run correctly) would include removing everything that is now unused or no longer mandatory after introducing bitboards, and then improving and optimizing it. The latter also includes to apply some "obvious" changes, like reducing the number of bitboards per board from 256 to some reasonable number like 8, 9, 12, 13, 14, whatever seems to fit the needs.

Sven


So, apparently, in theory he will do a bitboard move generator and leave everything else alone? That will be weaker. Move generation is not the big CPU cycle burner, but all the translation to an 0x88 will certainly slow things down if he tries to keep the fruit eval intact. Ugh...

The project is in a very early stage, so no need to judge at that point ... I can almost assure you that "keeping the fruit eval intact" is not among Matthew's goals. But before changing the eval from mailbox to bitboards it is clear that the basic infrastructure must be working first.

And I think it is also a "learning project", not (yet) a "world class engine development project", so one has to apply different standards.

Sven
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Subject Author Date/Time
Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Matthew R. Brades Tue May 08, 2012 3:20 pm
      Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Robert Hyatt Tue May 08, 2012 3:31 pm
            Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Matthew R. Brades Tue May 08, 2012 5:06 pm
                  Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Ronald de Man Tue May 08, 2012 6:43 pm
                  Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Evert Glebbeek Tue May 08, 2012 8:34 pm
                        Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 H.G.Muller Tue May 08, 2012 8:41 pm
                  Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Sven Schüle Tue May 08, 2012 8:43 pm
                        Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Sven Schüle Tue May 08, 2012 10:09 pm
                              Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Ronald de Man Tue May 08, 2012 10:15 pm
                                    Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Sven Schüle Tue May 08, 2012 10:21 pm
                                          Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Ronald de Man Tue May 08, 2012 10:59 pm
                                                Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Sven Schüle Wed May 09, 2012 11:33 am
                                                      Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Robert Hyatt Sun May 13, 2012 5:11 pm
                                                            Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Sven Schüle Sun May 13, 2012 10:13 pm
                                                                  Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Robert Hyatt Mon May 14, 2012 2:17 am
                                                                        Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Sven Schüle Mon May 14, 2012 10:19 am
                                                                              Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 H.G.Muller Mon May 14, 2012 10:53 am
                                                                                    Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Mincho Georgiev Mon May 14, 2012 12:19 pm
                                                                                    Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Sven Schüle Mon May 14, 2012 12:28 pm
                                                                                          Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 H.G.Muller Mon May 14, 2012 3:10 pm
                                                                                          Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Sven Schüle Mon May 14, 2012 4:25 pm
                                                                                          Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 H.G.Muller Mon May 14, 2012 4:34 pm
                                                                                          Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Sven Schüle Mon May 14, 2012 4:46 pm
                                                                                          Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 H.G.Muller Mon May 14, 2012 5:05 pm
                                                                                          Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Sven Schüle Mon May 14, 2012 8:51 pm
                                                                                    Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Robert Hyatt Mon May 14, 2012 10:43 pm
                                                                                          Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 H.G.Muller Tue May 15, 2012 5:41 am
                                                                                          Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Matthew R. Brades Tue May 15, 2012 2:45 pm
                                                                                          Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Matthew R. Brades Tue May 15, 2012 4:04 pm
                                                                                          Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Evert Glebbeek Tue May 15, 2012 4:41 pm
                                                                              Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Robert Hyatt Mon May 14, 2012 10:41 pm
                                                                  Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Mincho Georgiev Mon May 14, 2012 6:22 am
                                                Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Robert Hyatt Sun May 13, 2012 5:09 pm
                        Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Ronald de Man Tue May 08, 2012 10:11 pm
                              Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Sven Schüle Tue May 08, 2012 10:18 pm
                  Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Robert Hyatt Sun May 13, 2012 5:14 pm
                        Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 H.G.Muller Sun May 13, 2012 6:35 pm
                        Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Matthew R. Brades Sun May 13, 2012 8:24 pm
                              Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Sven Schüle Sun May 13, 2012 10:22 pm
                              Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 H.G.Muller Mon May 14, 2012 6:56 am
                        Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Sven Schüle Sun May 13, 2012 10:18 pm
      Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 H.G.Muller Tue May 08, 2012 4:12 pm
      Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Lucas Braesch Wed May 09, 2012 5:01 am
      Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Lucas Braesch Wed May 09, 2012 5:13 am
            Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Sven Schüle Wed May 09, 2012 11:35 am
                  Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Matthew R. Brades Wed May 09, 2012 2:50 pm
                        Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Matthew R. Brades Wed May 09, 2012 2:57 pm
                              Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Sven Schüle Wed May 09, 2012 3:27 pm
                                    Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Matthew R. Brades Thu May 10, 2012 1:32 pm
                                          Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 H.G.Muller Thu May 10, 2012 2:47 pm
                                                Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Matthew R. Brades Thu May 10, 2012 3:11 pm
                                                      Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Matthew R. Brades Thu May 10, 2012 3:14 pm
                                                            Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Sven Schüle Thu May 10, 2012 11:06 pm
                                                                  Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Matthew R. Brades Fri May 11, 2012 10:14 am
                                                                        Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 H.G.Muller Fri May 11, 2012 10:28 am
                                                                        Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Lucas Braesch Fri May 11, 2012 11:26 am
                                                                        Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Sven Schüle Sat May 12, 2012 2:06 pm
                                                                              Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Matthew R. Brades Sat May 12, 2012 3:54 pm
                                                                                    Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Evert Glebbeek Sat May 12, 2012 4:20 pm
                                                                                          Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Matthew R. Brades Sat May 12, 2012 5:00 pm
                                                                                          Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Matthew R. Brades Sat May 12, 2012 5:15 pm
                                                                                          Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Sven Schüle Sat May 12, 2012 5:32 pm
                                                                                          Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Sven Schüle Sat May 12, 2012 8:54 pm
                                                                                    Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Sven Schüle Sat May 12, 2012 5:21 pm
                                                      Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 H.G.Muller Thu May 10, 2012 3:25 pm
                                          Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Matthew R. Brades Thu May 10, 2012 3:06 pm
                                                Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Ronald de Man Thu May 10, 2012 6:42 pm
                        Re: Project help required: Bitboard Fruit 2.1 Lucas Braesch Thu May 10, 2012 10:51 am
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