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Don Dailey
Joined: 29 Apr 2008
Posts: 4318
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 Post subject: Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 1:40 am |
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| tomgdrums wrote: |
| Don wrote: |
| Houdini wrote: |
| Don wrote: |
| What I'm doing here is a study, not marketing. The data shows that Houdini does not scale well. I publish this and my methodology so that it can be duplicated and verified by others. I run 2000 games because we get a lot of nonsense statements from people who run 10 games matches to draw conclusions, so I would invite anyone to duplicate this test with more games. |
You don't just report data, you SPECULATE about how good your own engine Komodo might be at some time control you haven't actually used in your test.
In addition you SPECULATE about a commercial competitor, Houdini 2, a program you've never actually used.
As a forum moderator, don't you feel a little bit ethically challenged when writing this marketing blabla disguised as "a study"?
Robert |
I'm not going to engage in a pissing contest with you. Make anything out of that you wish. Meanwhile I'll refer you to this long time control rating list:
http://www.husvankempen.de/nunn//40120new/40_120_ratinglist/40_120_AllVersion/rangliste.html |
What is interesting about that rating list is that Houdini 2 is nowhere to be found. Seems a tad incomplete to me. |
They cannot thoroughly test every version of every program at that time control. I don't think many people are willing to test that long and of course it take a lot of time to get just a few games.
Komodo would do better if it were Houdini 2.0 at this time control. On the CEGT list Houdini 2.0 is about 15 ELO stronger at 40/4 but at 40/20 already Houdini 1.5 is stronger (look at the single processor version:
http://www.husvankempen.de/nunn/40_40%20Rating%20List/40_40%20All%20Versions/rangliste.html
On almost every rating list you can see the trend, Houdini 2.0 is awesome at fast time controls but then Houdini 1.5 gradually catches up and then passes it at the longer time controls.
Another example is CCRL At 40/4 Houdini 2.0 is a whopping 74 ELO ahead of Houdini 1.5 but at 40/40 Houdini 1.5 is +13 ELO stronger!
The IPON list is played at a a level that is significantly slower than the CCRL 40/4 time control (which is adjusted for hardware) and as you would expect Houdini 1.5 does better, in fact it's 7 ELO stronger than Houdini 2.0
The trend is so obvious that I am surprised nobody else has noticed it.
Actually EVERY program has specific scaling characteristics. It drives us crazy when we are testing because we cannot use any program as a reference due this fact. They will either go up, go down, or stay about the same with increasing time control but of course that is always relative to some other program or programs. We test at many different time controls because we know about this.
_________________
"Your superior intellect is no match for our puny weapons." -Kang and Kodos |
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| Subject |
Author |
Date/Time |
 Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Teodoriu Catalin |
Fri Feb 24, 2012 7:17 pm |
| Re: NUMBER 1 ENGINE ON LONG TIME CONTROLS |
Uri Blass |
Fri Feb 24, 2012 7:52 pm |
| Re: NUMBER 1 ENGINE ON LONG TIME CONTROLS |
Teodoriu Catalin |
Sat Feb 25, 2012 8:02 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Don Dailey |
Fri Feb 24, 2012 10:01 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Lonnie Cook |
Fri Feb 24, 2012 10:21 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Don Dailey |
Fri Feb 24, 2012 11:16 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Robert Houdart |
Fri Feb 24, 2012 11:40 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Don Dailey |
Fri Feb 24, 2012 11:51 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Robert Houdart |
Sat Feb 25, 2012 12:13 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Ignacio Garcia |
Sat Feb 25, 2012 12:29 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Don Dailey |
Sat Feb 25, 2012 12:30 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Tom Giampietro |
Sat Feb 25, 2012 1:05 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Don Dailey |
Sat Feb 25, 2012 1:40 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Robert Houdart |
Sat Feb 25, 2012 1:52 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Peter Skinner |
Sat Feb 25, 2012 5:54 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Carl Bicknell |
Sat Feb 25, 2012 8:57 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Ben-Hur Carlos Langoni |
Sat Feb 25, 2012 10:22 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Carl Bicknell |
Sun Feb 26, 2012 8:00 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Ben-Hur Carlos Langoni |
Sun Feb 26, 2012 1:04 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
George Speight |
Sat Feb 25, 2012 9:37 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Uri Blass |
Sun Feb 26, 2012 10:43 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Sedat Canbaz |
Sun Feb 26, 2012 11:54 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Ben-Hur Carlos Langoni |
Sun Feb 26, 2012 1:17 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Sedat Canbaz |
Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:05 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Sedat Canbaz |
Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:57 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Don Dailey |
Sun Feb 26, 2012 1:57 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Uri Blass |
Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:33 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Ignacio Garcia |
Sun Feb 26, 2012 3:41 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Don Dailey |
Sun Feb 26, 2012 4:51 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Ignacio Garcia |
Sun Feb 26, 2012 5:34 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Ricardo Barreira |
Sun Feb 26, 2012 7:54 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Uri Blass |
Sun Feb 26, 2012 10:53 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Don Dailey |
Mon Feb 27, 2012 1:35 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Jouni Uski |
Mon Feb 27, 2012 4:18 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Robert Houdart |
Mon Feb 27, 2012 6:26 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Don Dailey |
Mon Feb 27, 2012 6:50 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Larry Kaufman |
Mon Feb 27, 2012 6:56 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Milos Stanisavljevic |
Mon Feb 27, 2012 5:04 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Milos Stanisavljevic |
Mon Feb 27, 2012 5:22 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Larry Kaufman |
Mon Feb 27, 2012 6:31 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Don Dailey |
Mon Feb 27, 2012 6:48 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Milos Stanisavljevic |
Mon Feb 27, 2012 4:52 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Larry Kaufman |
Mon Feb 27, 2012 5:11 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Milos Stanisavljevic |
Mon Feb 27, 2012 5:19 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Don Dailey |
Mon Feb 27, 2012 5:35 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Ignacio Garcia |
Mon Feb 27, 2012 5:58 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Don Dailey |
Mon Feb 27, 2012 6:38 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Ignacio Garcia |
Tue Feb 28, 2012 2:40 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls. |
Jesús Muñoz |
Tue Feb 28, 2012 3:06 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Don Dailey |
Tue Feb 28, 2012 9:06 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Ignacio Garcia |
Wed Feb 29, 2012 11:22 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls. |
Jesús Muñoz |
Mon Feb 27, 2012 6:50 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls. |
Don Dailey |
Tue Feb 28, 2012 12:30 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls. |
Jesús Muñoz |
Tue Feb 28, 2012 11:31 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls. |
Don Dailey |
Tue Feb 28, 2012 11:57 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls. |
Don Dailey |
Tue Feb 28, 2012 12:06 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls. |
Jouni Uski |
Tue Feb 28, 2012 2:10 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls. |
Don Dailey |
Tue Feb 28, 2012 8:31 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls. |
Bigler |
Tue Feb 28, 2012 4:52 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls. |
Larry Kaufman |
Tue Feb 28, 2012 4:58 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls. |
Bigler |
Tue Feb 28, 2012 5:03 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls. |
Larry Kaufman |
Tue Feb 28, 2012 5:46 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls. |
Terry McCracken |
Wed Feb 29, 2012 5:37 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls. |
Carl Bicknell |
Wed Feb 29, 2012 9:19 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls. |
Terry McCracken |
Wed Feb 29, 2012 5:49 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls. |
Dr.Wael Deeb |
Wed Feb 29, 2012 5:59 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls. |
Terry McCracken |
Thu Mar 01, 2012 4:52 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls. |
Uri Blass |
Tue Feb 28, 2012 6:05 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Bram Mourik |
Tue Feb 28, 2012 9:01 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Don Dailey |
Tue Feb 28, 2012 9:30 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Dr.Wael Deeb |
Tue Feb 28, 2012 9:37 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Bram Mourik |
Wed Feb 29, 2012 5:58 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Don Dailey |
Wed Feb 29, 2012 6:25 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
om prakash |
Thu Mar 01, 2012 7:00 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
enrico fagiuoli |
Wed Feb 29, 2012 8:43 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Leon Coleman |
Wed Feb 29, 2012 5:23 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Don Dailey |
Wed Feb 29, 2012 12:47 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Vincent Diepeveen |
Thu Mar 01, 2012 11:44 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Uri Blass |
Thu Mar 01, 2012 1:30 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Don Dailey |
Thu Mar 01, 2012 1:34 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
enrico fagiuoli |
Thu Mar 01, 2012 2:57 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Don Dailey |
Thu Mar 01, 2012 9:48 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
enrico fagiuoli |
Fri Mar 02, 2012 11:09 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Vincent Diepeveen |
Fri Mar 02, 2012 12:20 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Don Dailey |
Fri Mar 02, 2012 12:26 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Vincent Diepeveen |
Fri Mar 02, 2012 12:51 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Dr.Wael Deeb |
Fri Mar 02, 2012 12:55 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Don Dailey |
Fri Mar 02, 2012 1:49 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Dr.Wael Deeb |
Fri Mar 02, 2012 3:10 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Don Dailey |
Fri Mar 02, 2012 3:30 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Dr.Wael Deeb |
Fri Mar 02, 2012 3:43 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Uri Blass |
Fri Mar 02, 2012 8:14 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Dr.Wael Deeb |
Fri Mar 02, 2012 8:31 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Uri Blass |
Fri Mar 02, 2012 8:45 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Larry Kaufman |
Fri Mar 02, 2012 8:58 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Dr.Wael Deeb |
Fri Mar 02, 2012 9:26 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Dr.Wael Deeb |
Fri Mar 02, 2012 9:23 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Carl Bicknell |
Fri Mar 02, 2012 5:41 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Larry Kaufman |
Fri Mar 02, 2012 6:59 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Dr.Wael Deeb |
Fri Mar 02, 2012 7:10 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Carl Bicknell |
Sat Mar 03, 2012 3:49 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Dr.Wael Deeb |
Sun Mar 04, 2012 8:36 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Robert Flesher |
Fri Mar 02, 2012 9:28 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Dr.Wael Deeb |
Fri Mar 02, 2012 9:55 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Jon Dart |
Sat Feb 25, 2012 9:09 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Andrew R. Case |
Sat Feb 25, 2012 9:14 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Gabor Szots |
Thu Mar 01, 2012 2:19 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Larry Kaufman |
Thu Mar 01, 2012 3:21 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
om prakash |
Thu Mar 01, 2012 4:16 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Larry Kaufman |
Thu Mar 01, 2012 4:51 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
om prakash |
Thu Mar 01, 2012 4:54 pm |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
George Speight |
Sun Mar 04, 2012 9:42 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Jouni Uski |
Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:35 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Maurizio Maglio |
Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:41 am |
| Re: Number 1 engine on long time controls |
Don Dailey |
Fri Mar 02, 2012 1:34 pm |
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