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C# Performance
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Lucas Braesch



Joined: 31 May 2010
Posts: 1761
PostPost subject: Re: C# Performance    Posted: Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:52 am Reply to topic Reply with quote
Ron Murawski wrote:

'Best' is a slippery word. If I wanted a cryptographically secure PRNG I wouldn't use KISS, I would use something stronger. But, if I wanted to bang out good PRNs as quickly as possible, then KISS would be a good choice. Keep in mind that MersenneTwister would also be a very good choice.

I don't understand the link between cryptography and RNG. All we want is an RNG that is relatively fast and easy to code (that excludes the mersenne twister right away), and that passes all known statistical tests. As far as I know the KISS RNG that I use in DoubleCheck passes all known statistical tests and is very simple. Another example is the KISS generator in Stockfish. Here's what I use in DoubleCheck, I would be glad if you could provide an example of statistical test where this generator fails, and where another one succeeds:
Code:
uint64_t rand64()
// JLKISS 64-bit RNG, by Pr. David Jones, UCL Bioinformatics Lab
{
   // seed variables
   static uint64_t x = 123456789123ULL, y = 987654321987ULL;
   static uint32_t z1 = 43219876, c1 = 6543217, z2 = 21987643, c2 = 1732654;

   x = 1490024343005336237ULL * x + 123456789;
   y ^= y << 21; y ^= y >> 17; y ^= y << 30;   // do not set y=0

   uint64_t t;
   t = 4294584393ULL * z1 + c1; c1 = t >> 32; z1 = t;
   t = 4246477509ULL * z2 + c2; c2 = t >> 32; z2 = t;

   return x + y + z1 + ((uint64_t)z2 << 32);   // return 64-bit result
}

Note that Mersenne Twister passes all known statistical tests, but fails in some linear complexity tests. This is not an issue for chess programming (as all the RNG are drawn at the start of the program once and for all). But the real issue I have with MT is that it's obfuscated, while KISS generators are much simpler (and faster) and perform just as well (speed aside where they beat MT anytime)
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Subject Author Date/Time
C# Performance Richard Allbert Fri Jan 27, 2012 8:41 pm
      Re: C# Performance Kevin Hearn Fri Jan 27, 2012 9:01 pm
            Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Fri Jan 27, 2012 9:13 pm
      Re: C# Performance Gary Fri Jan 27, 2012 9:07 pm
            Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Fri Jan 27, 2012 9:17 pm
                  Re: C# Performance Gary Fri Jan 27, 2012 10:09 pm
      Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Sat Jan 28, 2012 12:59 am
            Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Sat Jan 28, 2012 8:44 am
                  Re: C# Performance Sven Schüle Sat Jan 28, 2012 9:48 am
                        Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Sat Jan 28, 2012 10:25 am
                              Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Sat Jan 28, 2012 11:41 am
                  Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Sat Jan 28, 2012 11:44 am
            Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Sat Jan 28, 2012 10:31 am
      Re: C# Performance Marco Costalba Sat Jan 28, 2012 1:09 pm
            Re: C# Performance Lucas Braesch Sat Jan 28, 2012 1:52 pm
            Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Sat Jan 28, 2012 2:05 pm
                  Re: C# Performance Marco Costalba Sat Jan 28, 2012 2:30 pm
                        Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Sat Jan 28, 2012 5:22 pm
                              Re: C# Performance Sven Schüle Sat Jan 28, 2012 6:02 pm
                                    Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Sat Jan 28, 2012 6:12 pm
                                    Re: C# Performance Robert Purves Sat Jan 28, 2012 10:17 pm
                              Re: C# Performance Marco Costalba Sat Jan 28, 2012 10:25 pm
                  Re: C# Performance Thomas Petzke Sat Jan 28, 2012 4:21 pm
      Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Mon Jan 30, 2012 12:52 pm
            Re: C# Performance Marco Costalba Mon Jan 30, 2012 6:37 pm
                  Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Wed Feb 01, 2012 6:55 pm
                        Re: C# Performance Marco Costalba Wed Feb 01, 2012 7:18 pm
            Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:55 pm
                  Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Wed Feb 01, 2012 6:57 pm
                        Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Wed Feb 01, 2012 9:59 pm
            Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Fri Feb 03, 2012 1:34 am
                  Re: C# Performance Robert Purves Fri Feb 03, 2012 3:26 am
                        Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Fri Feb 03, 2012 9:28 am
                              Re: C# Performance Sven Schüle Fri Feb 03, 2012 9:45 am
                                    Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Sat Feb 04, 2012 7:57 pm
                                          Re: C# Performance Sven Schüle Sat Feb 04, 2012 10:36 pm
                                                Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Sat Feb 04, 2012 11:49 pm
                                                      Re: C# Performance Sven Schüle Sun Feb 05, 2012 12:51 am
                                                            Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Sun Feb 05, 2012 1:05 am
                              Re: C# Performance Sven Schüle Fri Feb 03, 2012 10:04 am
                                    Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Fri Feb 03, 2012 11:40 am
                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Sat Feb 04, 2012 7:10 pm
                                                Re: C# Performance Lucas Braesch Sat Feb 04, 2012 8:31 pm
                                                      Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Sat Feb 04, 2012 10:23 pm
                                                            Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Sun Feb 05, 2012 12:23 am
                                                                  Re: C# Performance Lucas Braesch Sun Feb 05, 2012 2:57 am
                                                                        Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Sun Feb 05, 2012 11:40 am
                                                                              Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Mon Feb 06, 2012 6:29 pm
                                                                                    Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Mon Feb 06, 2012 6:29 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Mon Feb 06, 2012 6:30 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Mon Feb 06, 2012 6:45 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Gary Mon Feb 06, 2012 7:00 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Mon Feb 06, 2012 7:12 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Sven Schüle Mon Feb 06, 2012 10:50 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Tue Feb 07, 2012 9:52 am
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Tue Feb 07, 2012 9:53 am
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Tue Feb 07, 2012 9:53 am
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Tue Feb 07, 2012 9:54 am
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Tue Feb 07, 2012 1:59 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Tue Feb 07, 2012 2:54 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Tue Feb 07, 2012 3:06 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Tue Feb 07, 2012 5:17 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Tue Feb 07, 2012 6:10 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Tue Feb 07, 2012 6:20 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Tue Feb 07, 2012 8:02 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Tue Feb 07, 2012 9:19 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Tue Feb 07, 2012 10:20 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Wed Feb 08, 2012 7:47 am
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Wed Feb 08, 2012 7:57 am
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Sven Schüle Wed Feb 08, 2012 10:09 am
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Wed Feb 08, 2012 12:16 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Vincent Diepeveen Sat Feb 18, 2012 10:03 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Wed Feb 08, 2012 9:30 am
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Wed Feb 08, 2012 12:02 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Wed Feb 08, 2012 12:34 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Wed Feb 08, 2012 12:56 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Wed Feb 08, 2012 1:18 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Wed Feb 08, 2012 2:30 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Wed Feb 08, 2012 2:34 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Wed Feb 08, 2012 3:02 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Wed Feb 08, 2012 3:27 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Wed Feb 08, 2012 3:29 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Wed Feb 08, 2012 3:59 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Wed Feb 08, 2012 4:04 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Wed Feb 08, 2012 6:07 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Thu Feb 09, 2012 10:41 am
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Thu Feb 09, 2012 1:47 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Thu Feb 09, 2012 2:56 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Sat Feb 11, 2012 4:41 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Sun Feb 12, 2012 8:34 am
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Lucas Braesch Sun Feb 12, 2012 10:52 am
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Sun Feb 12, 2012 12:26 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Ron Murawski Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:26 am
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Lucas Braesch Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:52 am
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Mon Feb 13, 2012 6:27 am
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Ron Murawski Tue Feb 14, 2012 6:38 am
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Lucas Braesch Tue Feb 14, 2012 8:22 am
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Tue Feb 14, 2012 11:30 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:49 am
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Sat Feb 18, 2012 12:34 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Mon Feb 20, 2012 9:19 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Tue Feb 21, 2012 8:33 am
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Tue Feb 21, 2012 6:37 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Vincent Diepeveen Sat Feb 18, 2012 10:19 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Sun Feb 12, 2012 2:01 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Sun Feb 12, 2012 4:40 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Vincent Diepeveen Sat Feb 18, 2012 10:06 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Sun Feb 19, 2012 1:01 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Vincent Diepeveen Sun Feb 19, 2012 5:25 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Sun Feb 19, 2012 7:04 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Vincent Diepeveen Sun Feb 19, 2012 9:17 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Sun Feb 19, 2012 11:33 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Sun Feb 19, 2012 9:22 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Vincent Diepeveen Sun Feb 19, 2012 9:32 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Vincent Diepeveen Sun Feb 19, 2012 9:37 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Vincent Diepeveen Sun Feb 19, 2012 10:06 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Lucas Braesch Wed Feb 08, 2012 10:56 am
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Wed Feb 08, 2012 11:30 am
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Wed Feb 08, 2012 12:04 pm
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Tony Soares Tue Feb 07, 2012 3:47 am
                                                                                          Re: C# Performance Richard Allbert Tue Feb 07, 2012 9:55 am
                                          Re: C# Performance Mark Pearce Sat Feb 04, 2012 8:37 pm
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