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Is this positions drawn ??
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Daniel Mehrmann



Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 762
Location: Germany
PostPost subject: Homer can solve fortress draws    Posted: Wed May 23, 2007 11:40 pm Reply to topic Reply with quote
M ANSARI wrote:
Topalov vs. Mamedyrov

[d]3Q4/6pk/5r1p/4K2P/8/8/8/8 w - - 0 63
   ::    WQ    ::    ::
::    ::    ::    BP BK
   ::    ::    BR    BP
::    ::    WK    :: WP
   ::    ::    ::    ::
::    ::    ::    ::    
   ::    ::    ::    ::
::    ::    ::    ::    



Topalov gave up trying to win and went for a draw ... but engines see a big plus for white. Is this position theoretically drawn ... or was Topalov too tired to find out if a win exists? Which engine also sees a draw ?


Yes, this position is a draw. It's a typical fortress !

But Homer can solve such "fortress" positions is a fast time:

Homer 2.01pre6 by Daniel Mehrmann, http://www.homer-chess.com, info@homer-chess.de

1/06 0:00 +5.29 1.Dd7 (132)
2/04 0:00 +5.33 1.Dd7 Tf8 (318) 19
3/06 0:00 +5.29 1.Dd3+ Kg8 2.Dd7 Tf8 (1.597) 99
4/08 0:00 +5.28 1.Dd7 Kg8 2.Kd5 Tf8 (5.843) 365
5/12 0:00 +5.13 1.Dd3+ Kg8 2.Dd7 Tf8 3.Kd4 Tf4+ 4.Kc5 (23.219) 494
6/13 0:00 +5.15 1.Dd3+ Kg8 2.Dd5+ Kh7 3.Db7 Tf1 4.Ke4 Kg8 (55.218) 587
7/14 0:00 +5.14 1.Dd7 Tf2 2.Ke4 Kg8 3.Kd3 Kf8 4.Ke4 (144.792) 664
8/14 0:00 +5.10 1.Dd7 Tf2 2.Ke4 Tf8 3.Kd3 Tf3+ 4.Kc4 Tf8 5.Dd3+ (175.161) 660
8/16 0:00 +5.10 1.Dd7 Tf2 2.Ke4 Tf8 3.Kd3 Tf3+ 4.Kc4 Tf8 5.Dd3+ (263.961) 626
9/14 0:00 +5.04 1.Dd7 Tf2 2.Ke4 Tf1 3.Ke3 Tf8 4.Dd3+ Kg8 5.Dc4+ Tf7 6.Dc8+ (312.147) 625
9/18 0:00 +5.04 1.Dd7 Tf2 2.Ke4 Tf1 3.Ke3 Tf8 4.Dd3+ Kg8 5.Dc4+ Tf7 6.Dc8+ (537.106) 604
10/18 0:01 +5.03 1.Dd7 Kg8 2.Ke4 Tf1 3.Dd5+ Kh7 4.Ke3 Tf8 5.De4+ Kg8 6.Ke2 Td8 (809.768) 558 TB:198
10/18 0:01 +5.03 1.Dd7 Kg8 2.Ke4 Tf1 3.Dd5+ Kh7 4.Ke3 Tf8 5.De4+ Kg8 6.Ke2 Td8 (992.585) 563 TB:198
11/18 0:02 +5.03 1.Dd7 Kg8 2.Ke4 Tf1 3.Dd5+ Kh7 4.Ke3 Tf8 5.De4+ Kg8 6.Ke2 Td8 7.De6+ (1.169.563) 551 TB:344
11/18 0:02 +5.03 1.Dd7 Kg8 2.Ke4 Tf1 3.Dd5+ Kh7 4.Ke3 Tf8 5.De4+ Kg8 6.Ke2 Td8 7.De6+ (1.452.658) 554 TB:344
12/20 0:03 +5.04 1.Dd7 Kg8 2.Kd4 Tf1 3.Dd5+ Kh7 4.Kc3 Tf4 5.Dd7 Tf8 6.Kb4 Ta8 7.Dd3+ (2.033.003) 515 TB:492
12/20 0:04 +5.04 1.Dd7 Kg8 2.Kd4 Tf1 3.Dd5+ Kh7 4.Kc3 Tf4 5.Dd7 Tf8 6.Kb4 Ta8 7.Dd3+ (2.302.840) 505 TB:736
13/21 0:07 +4.86 1.Dd7 Kg8 2.Kd4 Tf8 3.Dd5+ Kh7 4.De5 Tf1 5.Kc4 Kg8 6.Kb3 Kf7 7.Dc7+ Kf8 8.Dc5+ Kf7 (3.612.503) 513 TB:968
13/24 0:15 +4.86 1.Dd7 Kg8 2.Kd4 Tf8 3.Dd5+ Kh7 4.De5 Tf1 5.Kc4 Kg8 6.Kb3 Kf7 7.Dc7+ Kf8 8.Dc5+ Kf7 (7.043.634) 463 TB:2.227
14/24 0:18 +4.76 1.Dd7 Kg8 2.Kd4 Tf8 3.Dd5+ Kh7 4.De5 Tf1 5.Kc4 Kg8 6.Kb4 Tc1 7.Db2 Tf1 8.Dc3 (8.587.061) 461 TB:2.855
14/24 0:25 +4.76 1.Dd7 Kg8 2.Kd4 Tf8 3.Dd5+ Kh7 4.De5 Tf1 5.Kc4 Kg8 6.Kb4 Tc1 7.Db2 Tf1 8.Dc3 (11.208.397) 444 TB:3.861
15/25 0:30 +4.51 1.Dd7 Kg8 2.Kd4 Tf8 3.Dd5+ Kh7 4.De5 Tf1 5.Kc4 Tf8 6.Kb4 Kg8 7.Ka5 Kh7 8.Db2 Ta8+ 9.Kb4 (13.531.811) 450 TB:4.736
15/27 0:41 +4.51 1.Dd7 Kg8 2.Kd4 Tf8 3.Dd5+ Kh7 4.De5 Tf1 5.Kc4 Tf8 6.Kb4 Kg8 7.Ka5 Kh7 8.Db2 Ta8+ 9.Kb4 (17.710.176) 429 TB:6.701
16/24 0:44 +4.01-- 1.Dd7 (19.386.852) 434 TB:7.327
16/25 0:48 0.00 1.Dd7 Kg8 2.Kd4 Tf8 3.Dd5+ Kh7 4.De5 Tf1 5.Kc4 Tf2 6.Kb4 Tf8 7.Ka5 Kg8 8.Db2 Tf5+ 9.Kb4 Tf1 (20.777.528) 429 TB:7.887
16/25 0:50 +0.50++ 1.Da8 (21.137.413) 424 TB:8.595
16/38 3:05 +3.33 1.Da8 Tf2 2.Ke4 Tf1 3.Ke3 Te1+ 4.Kf2 Te5 5.Df3 Kg8 6.Kf1 Kh7 7.Df7 Kh8 8.Da7 Kh7 9.Dg1 Txh5 (42.250.817) 227 TB:64.292
16/38 3:08 +3.83++ 1.Ke4 (43.674.221) 230 TB:65.049
16/38 3:21 +3.33 1.Da8 Tf2 2.Ke4 Tf1 3.Ke3 Te1+ 4.Kf2 Te5 5.Df3 Kg8 6.Kf1 Kh7 7.Df7 Kh8 8.Da7 Kh7 9.Dg1 Txh5 (47.047.600) 233 TB:70.106
17/25 3:23 +2.83-- 1.Da8 (47.879.673) 235 TB:70.344
17/26 3:25 0.00 1.Da8 Tf2 2.Ke4 Tf1 3.Ke3 Tf7 4.De4+ Kg8 5.Ke2 Tf6 6.Ke1 Kh8 7.Dc2 Tf2 8.De4 Tf6 (48.890.019) 237 TB:71.220
17/28 3:35 +0.50++ 1.Kd5 (51.513.650) 238 TB:75.118
17/32 4:34 0.00 1.Da8 Tf2 2.Ke4 Tf1 3.Ke3 Tf7 4.De4+ Kg8 5.Ke2 Tf6 6.Ke1 Kh8 7.Dc2 Tf2 8.De4 Tf6 (59.614.073) 217 TB:107.889
18/26 4:36 +0.50++ 1.Da8 (60.285.774) 217 TB:109.441
18/28 4:46 0.00 1.Da8 Tf2 2.Ke4 Tf1 3.Ke3 Tf7 4.De4+ Kg8 5.Ke2 Tf6 6.Ke1 Kh8 7.Dc2 Tf2 8.De4 Tf6 (63.751.997) 222 TB:112.032
18/28 4:46 0.00 1.Da8 Tf2 2.Ke4 Tf1 3.Ke3 Tf7 4.De4+ Kg8 5.Ke2 Tf6 6.Ke1 Kh8 7.Dc2 Tf2 8.De4 Tf6 (63.751.997) 222 TB:112.032
19/28 4:51 +0.50++ 1.Da8 (65.061.029) 222 TB:114.796
19/28 4:53 0.00 1.Da8 Tf2 2.Ke4 Tf1 3.Ke3 Tf7 4.De4+ Kg8 5.Ke2 Tf6 6.Ke1 Kh8 7.Dc2 Tf2 8.De4 Tf6 (65.444.083) 223 TB:116.083
19/28 4:53 0.00 1.Da8 Tf2 2.Ke4 Tf1 3.Ke3 Tf7 4.De4+ Kg8 5.Ke2 Tf6 6.Ke1 Kh8 7.Dc2 Tf2 8.De4 Tf6 (65.444.083) 223 TB:116.083
20/28 4:57 0.00 1.Da8 Tf2 2.Ke4 Tf1 3.Ke3 Tf6 4.De4+ Kg8 5.Ke2 Tf8 6.Ke1 Kh8 7.Dc2 Tf6 8.De4 Kg8 9.Ke2 (66.276.875) 222 TB:117.688
20/30 5:06 0.00 1.Da8 Tf2 2.Ke4 Tf1 3.Ke3 Tf6 4.De4+ Kg8 5.Ke2 Tf8 6.Ke1 Kh8 7.Dc2 Tf6 8.De4 Kg8 9.Ke2 (68.853.536) 224 TB:122.096
21/28 5:08 0.00 1.Da8 Tf2 2.Ke4 Tf1 3.Ke3 Tf6 4.De4+ Kg8 5.Ke2 Tf8 6.Ke1 Kh8 7.Dc2 Tf6 8.De4 Kg8 9.Ke2 (69.583.559) 225 TB:123.321
21/32 5:19 0.00 1.Da8 Tf2 2.Ke4 Tf1 3.Ke3 Tf6 4.De4+ Kg8 5.Ke2 Tf8 6.Ke1 Kh8 7.Dc2 Tf6 8.De4 Kg8 9.Ke2 (72.502.509) 227 TB:131.123
22/30 5:25 0.00 1.Da8 Tf2 2.Ke4 Tf1 3.Ke3 Tf6 4.De4+ Kg8 5.Ke2 Tf8 6.Ke1 Kh8 7.Dc2 Tf6 8.De4 Kg8 9.Ke2 (73.865.861) 227 TB:134.485
22/34 6:04 0.00 1.Da8 Tf2 2.Ke4 Tf1 3.Ke3 Tf6 4.De4+ Kg8 5.Ke2 Tf8 6.Ke1 Kh8 7.Dc2 Tf6 8.De4 Kg8 9.Ke2 (85.620.494) 234 TB:163.513
Bester Zug: Dd8-a8 Zeit: 6:12.203 min K/s: 235.258 Knoten: 87.302.144 TB: 168.566


Best,
Daniel

ps: There is no trick, its just a Homer Very Happy
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Subject Author Date/Time
Is this positions drawn ?? M ANSARI Fri May 18, 2007 8:15 pm
      Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Tobias Lagemann Fri May 18, 2007 8:53 pm
            Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Terry McCracken Fri May 18, 2007 9:01 pm
                  Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Uri Blass Fri May 18, 2007 9:17 pm
                        Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Robin Smith Fri May 18, 2007 9:35 pm
                              Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Alex Brown Fri May 18, 2007 9:47 pm
                                    Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Uri Blass Fri May 18, 2007 10:29 pm
                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Torstein Wed May 23, 2007 12:33 pm
                              Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Paulo Soares Fri May 18, 2007 10:18 pm
                                    Re: ComputerChess is bad for you !! nuff Fri May 18, 2007 10:27 pm
                                          Re: ComputerChess is bad for you !! Paulo Soares Fri May 18, 2007 10:34 pm
                                          Re: ComputerChess is bad for you !! Uri Blass Fri May 18, 2007 10:39 pm
                                                Re: ComputerChess is bad for you !! Terry McCracken Fri May 18, 2007 10:53 pm
                                                      Re: ComputerChess is bad for you !! Dann Corbit Sat May 19, 2007 12:27 am
                                                            Re: ComputerChess is bad for you !! Terry McCracken Sat May 19, 2007 4:57 am
                                                                  Re: ComputerChess is bad for you !! Dann Corbit Sat May 19, 2007 6:13 am
                                                                        Re: ComputerChess is bad for you !! Terry McCracken Sat May 19, 2007 4:14 pm
                                                                        Re: ComputerChess is bad for you !! George Tsavdaris Sat May 19, 2007 4:52 pm
                                                                              Re: ComputerChess is bad for you !! Terry McCracken Sat May 19, 2007 6:15 pm
                                                                                    Re: ComputerChess is bad for you !! George Tsavdaris Sat May 19, 2007 6:20 pm
                                                                                          Re: ComputerChess is bad for you !! Terry McCracken Sat May 19, 2007 7:43 pm
                                                                                    Re: ComputerChess is bad for you !! Uri Blass Sat May 19, 2007 6:31 pm
                                                                                          Re: ComputerChess is bad for you !! Terry McCracken Sat May 19, 2007 7:39 pm
                                                                                          Re: ComputerChess is bad for you !! Alessandro Scotti Sat May 19, 2007 9:10 pm
                                                                                          Re: ComputerChess is bad for you !! Terry McCracken Sun May 20, 2007 3:27 am
                                                                                          Re: ComputerChess is bad for you !! Dann Corbit Wed May 23, 2007 4:17 am
                                                                                          Re: ComputerChess is bad for you !! M ANSARI Wed May 23, 2007 6:53 am
                                                                                          Re: ComputerChess is bad for you !! George Tsavdaris Wed May 23, 2007 4:19 pm
                                                                                          Re: ComputerChess is bad for you !! Dann Corbit Wed May 23, 2007 6:19 pm
                              Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Uri Blass Fri May 18, 2007 10:36 pm
                                    Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Save us all some trouble nuff Fri May 18, 2007 10:41 pm
                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Save us all some trouble Uri Blass Fri May 18, 2007 11:50 pm
                                                Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Save us all some trouble Graham Banks Fri May 18, 2007 11:59 pm
                                                      Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Save us all some trouble Uri Blass Sat May 19, 2007 12:03 am
                                                            Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Save us all some trouble Graham Banks Sat May 19, 2007 12:13 am
                                    Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Robin Smith Sat May 19, 2007 4:00 am
                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Uri Blass Sat May 19, 2007 6:14 am
                                                Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Terry McCracken Sat May 19, 2007 4:17 pm
                                                      Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Uri Blass Sat May 19, 2007 5:13 pm
                                                            Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Terry McCracken Sat May 19, 2007 6:09 pm
                                                                  Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Dann Corbit Mon May 21, 2007 9:51 pm
                                                                        Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Robin Smith Tue May 22, 2007 3:15 am
                                                                              Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Dann Corbit Tue May 22, 2007 4:02 am
                                                                                    Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Terry McCracken Tue May 22, 2007 4:20 am
                                                                                    Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Robin Smith Tue May 22, 2007 10:24 pm
                                                                              Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Terry McCracken Tue May 22, 2007 4:29 am
                                                                                    Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Dann Corbit Wed May 23, 2007 11:42 pm
                                                                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? J. Prata Thu May 24, 2007 12:19 am
                                                                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Dann Corbit Thu May 24, 2007 12:42 am
                                                                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Robin Smith Thu May 24, 2007 1:20 am
                                                                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Terry McCracken Thu May 24, 2007 2:29 am
                                                                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Robin Smith Thu May 24, 2007 3:21 am
                                                                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Terry McCracken Thu May 24, 2007 4:29 am
                                                                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Uri Blass Thu May 24, 2007 7:20 am
                                                                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Terry McCracken Thu May 24, 2007 2:25 am
                                                                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? glorfindel Fri May 25, 2007 1:38 am
                                                                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Terry McCracken Fri May 25, 2007 2:11 am
                                                                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? glorfindel Fri May 25, 2007 3:04 pm
                                                                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Terry McCracken Fri May 25, 2007 5:04 pm
                                                                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Robin Smith Fri May 25, 2007 2:35 am
                                                                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? glorfindel Fri May 25, 2007 3:25 pm
                                                                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Richard Sutherland Fri May 25, 2007 3:50 pm
                                                                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Terry McCracken Fri May 25, 2007 4:09 pm
                                                                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Robin Smith Fri May 25, 2007 4:50 pm
                                                                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Terry McCracken Fri May 25, 2007 5:05 pm
                                                                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Dann Corbit Fri May 25, 2007 2:23 am
                                                                        Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Terry McCracken Tue May 22, 2007 4:19 am
                                                                              Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Dann Corbit Wed May 23, 2007 10:56 pm
                        Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Paulo Soares Fri May 18, 2007 10:15 pm
                              Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Uri Blass Fri May 18, 2007 10:26 pm
                                    Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Paulo Soares Fri May 18, 2007 10:58 pm
                                          Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Uri Blass Sat May 19, 2007 12:01 am
                                                Re: Is this positions drawn ?? Paulo Soares Sat May 19, 2007 12:24 am
      Homer can solve fortress draws Daniel Mehrmann Wed May 23, 2007 11:40 pm
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