xyclOps, a clone ?

[Matthias Gemuh]

I did have the feeling from the very beginning that the thing is Toga/Fruit.
Now I am seeming more and more to be right.
Fraud is bad, and when it is used to extort people's money, it is inexcusable.

Matthias.

[Alexander Schmidt]

Werner asked me because of this message:

http://64.68.157.89/forum/viewtopic.php ... 19&t=22209

This is evidence enough, such strings don't belong in a WB engine, especially when they are exactly the same as in Toga.

I took a quick look and it is a slightly modified Toga (1.3.4?)

It is ported to Winboard and has switched off all analysing features so it is hard to see it is a clone. But if you start with startposition and d2d4, then compare the analysis line you will see the similaries:

FEN: rnbqkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/3P4/8/PPP1PPPP/RNBQKBNR b KQkq d3 0 1

TogaII:
1/1 00:00 2 0 -0,71 a7a5
1/1 00:00 4 0 -0,55 b7b5
1/5 00:00 19 0 -0,20 d7d5
2/6 00:00 86 0 -0,34 d7d5 Sg1f3
3/7 00:00 819 0 -0,20 d7d5 Sg1f3 Sg8f6
4/8 00:00 1.661 0 -0,30 d7d5 Sg1f3 Sg8f6 Sb1c3
5/11 00:00 5.062 0 -0,20 d7d5 Sg1f3 Sg8f6 Sb1c3 Sb8c6
6/13 00:00 11.915 0 -0,30 d7d5 Sg1f3 Sg8f6 Sb1c3 Sb8c6 Lc1f4
6/17 00:00 18.677 0 -0,27 Sg8f6 Sg1f3 d7d6 Sb1c3 Sb8c6 Lc1f4
7/17 00:00 37.173 0 -0,23 Sg8f6 Sb1c3 d7d6 e2e4 Sb8c6 Sg1f3 Lc8g4
8/19 00:00 84.642 0 -0,16 Sg8f6 Sb1c3 d7d5 Lc1f4 Sb8c6 Sc3b5 e7e5 d4xe5 Lf8b4+ c2c3
8/19 00:00 99.295 0 -0,13 d7d5 Sb1c3 Sb8c6 Lc1f4 Lc8f5 Sc3b5 e7e5 d4xe5 Lf8b4+ c2c3
9/21 00:00 169.701 0 -0,22 d7d5 Sg1f3 Sb8c6 Sb1c3 g7g6 Lc1f4 Lf8h6 Sf3g5 Sg8f6
9/24 00:00 307.288 0 -0,16 e7e6 e2e4 Sg8f6 Lf1d3 d7d5 e4xd5 Sf6xd5 Sb1c3 Lf8b4 Lc1d2
10/25 00:01 563.747 0 -0,33 e7e6 e2e4 Sg8f6 Lf1d3 d7d5 e4xd5 Sf6xd5 Sg1f3 Lf8e7 00 00
10/25 00:01 654.036 0 -0,24 d7d5 Sg1f3 Sb8c6 Sb1c3 g7g6 Lc1f4 Lf8h6 Lf4xh6 Sg8xh6 e2e4 d5xe4 Sc3xe4
11/25 00:01 966.248 708.751 -0,20 d7d5 Sg1f3 Sb8c6 Sb1c3 Sg8f6 e2e3 e7e6 Lf1d3 Lf8d6 00 00




FEN: rnbqkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/3P4/8/PPP1PPPP/RNBQKBNR b KQkq d3 0 1

XyclOps:
1 -241687:02:48 0 0 +0,76 a7a5
1 -241687:02:48 4 4 +0,70 b7b5
1 -241687:02:48 9 9 +0,20 d7d5
2 -241687:02:48 78 78 +0,34 d7d5 g1f3
3 -241687:02:48 283 283 +0,20 d7d5 g1f3 g8f6
4 -241687:02:48 720 36.000 +0,30 d7d5 g1f3 g8f6 b1c3
5 -241687:02:48 2.596 129.800 +0,20 d7d5 g1f3 g8f6 b1c3 b8c6
6 -241687:02:48 4.986 249.300 +0,20 d7d5 g1f3 g8f6 b1c3 b8c6 c1f4
7 -241687:02:48 10.379 345.966 +0,20 d7d5 g1f3 g8f6 b1c3 b8c6 c1f4 c8f5
8 -241687:02:48 20.512 410.240 +0,09 d7d5 g1f3 g8f6 b1c3 b8c6 c1g5 c8f5 g5f6 g7f6
9 -241687:02:48 35.715 595.250 +0,23 d7d5 g1f3 g8f6 b1c3 b8c6 c1f4 g7g6 e2e3
9 -241687:02:48 64.931 499.469 +0,17 g8f6 g1f3 b8c6 c1f4 e7e6 e2e3 f6d5 b1c3 d5f4 e3f4
10 -241687:02:48 125.047 521.029 +0,20 g8f6 g1f3 e7e6 c1g5 b8c6 e2e4 f8b4 c2c3 b4e7 g5f6 e7f6 f1c4
11 -241687:02:47 233.553 530.802 +0,18 g8f6 g1f3 e7e6 e2e3 b8c6 f1d3 f8b4 c2c3 b4e7 e1g1 e8g8
12 -241687:02:47 616.335 540.644 +0,12 g8f6 g1f3 e7e6 c1g5 b8c6 e2e4 f8b4 c2c3 b4e7 f1d3 e8g8 e1g1
13 -241687:02:46 1.224.109 536.889 +0,20 g8f6 g1f3 e7e6 e2e3 d7d5 f1d3 b8c6 c1d2 f8d6 e1g1 e8g8 b1c3 c8d7
14 -241687:02:43 2.524.072 560.904 +0,08 g8f6 g1f3 e7e6 e2e3 d7d5 b1c3 f8b4 f1d3 b8c6 c1d2 e8g8 e1g1 f6g4 d1e2

So:

Don't spend any money in this engine, and if you did, try to get it back!

Alex

[Matthias Gemuh]

I did have the feeling from the very beginning that the thing is Toga/Fruit.
Now I am seeming more and more to be right.
Fraud is bad, and when it is used to extort people's money, it is inexcusable.

Matthias.

The xyclOps website :
"xyclOps was designed, created, and programmed by Norman Schmidt. "


.

[Matthias Gemuh]

...
Alex

Hi Alex,
to be able to use your installed engines with ChessGUI 0.112 or later, you should update now (by copying whole package unto your installed stuff) and start ChessGUI at least once.
If not, you shall set "Time Fraction" manually to 1 for all engines.
Best,
Matthias.


.

[Alexander Schmidt]

Thanks Matthias, I will do this!

But unfortunately I have not much time recently for chess, and I must admit, I lost interest a little bit...

But I follow the ChessGUI developement, and I am happy that it finds more and more fiends

[Matthias Gemuh]

Thanks Matthias, I will do this!

But unfortunately I have not much time recently for chess, and I must admitt, I lost interest a little bit...

But I follow the ChessGUI developement, and I am happy that it finds more and more fiends

It's all normal when interest in a hobby at some point diminishes.

[Christopher Conkie]

I am happy that it finds more and more fiends

"R" Alex......it needs an "R". ChessGUI is great. Its free....thats great.

I say this without being fiendish.

[kranium]

12 people registered xyclOps. i will immediate refund them if the are not satisfied for any reason, and they can keep for free what i consider a great engine. i have issued 1 refund already, more than 1 hour ago to hans lemiere. i would have gladly done that anyway if he wanted, even without the clone accusations.

my one and only goal was and is to make a strong engine that maybe could compete with rybka. i have never believed that i would sell a lot or get rich. a modest amount of users willingly 'supporting' the further development would enable me to make it stronger...that was an still is my only goal.

norm

[pedrox]

Hi Norman,

the question is not only whether you are return money to clients who wish to do so, the question is whether you can continue to offer your engine and also on a commercial basis. I am sure that many people in CCC would be willing to pay for new versions of TOGA more powerful to Tomas, but this is not possible.

If you feel that your engine does not infrige Fruit/Toga licence, then surely find ways to prove and can continue to offer your engine and selling it.

[Zach Wegner]

the question is not only whether you are return money to clients who wish to do so, the question is whether you can continue to offer your engine and also on a commercial basis. I am sure that many people in CCC would be willing to pay for new versions of TOGA more powerful to Tomas, but this is not possible.

But this is possible, because he provides the source.

Maybe if he refunds ALL money he has received and then opens the source as GPL, then he can legally sell it. But at that point I would hope that nobody was foolish enough to give him money.